[brombur]

I've got a very noobish set of questions that my reading of the rules seems to be failing to answer.

Matrix connections and host interactions

1 - When a runner enters goes to and attempts to enter a host is there any distance penalties? I would think not because the host are just digital constructs. Am I wrong? 

1a - Do devices inside a host count as having a distance from the runner in the host?

1b - The point of a host is to protect its slaved devices but the rules seem to indicate that once you have hacked into a host you count as being directly connected to the device, thereby removing all the benefits of it being slaved to the host in the first place. In fact it turns slaving into a liability from what I can tell

2 - Once runner has accessed a host can they drop from VR to AR in order to move around while still maintaining that connection and then slide between modes as needed to accomplish certain tasks?

2a - If the runner is being looked for and they are in AR can they react and swap modes for their roll to avoid detection?

3 - Do decker's run their decks in silent mode when hacking and thus suffer the -2 silent mode dice penalty or is this accounted for in the standard hacking rolls made by the decker to do everything?

3a - If the penalty exists then the decker must be expected to do somethings while not hidden. So would their be a consequence to a hack on the fly attempt while not in silent mode? I know attacking triggers an alert and sleezinging gets you marked if you fail but what happens when you sleeze, an action that ups your grid score, in a host/system while not hidden

4 - If the Decker's team have access to the matrix, which they all pretty much do, can they watch the decker work and comment on/direct actions. This is really a broader question of do we let our team communicate and help the decker hack, if they themselves lack the skills.

I appreciate your feedbacks
 

[Jack_Spade]

1: Correct, entering a host is not a dice test, so there is no penalty.
1a: There are no devices in hosts. A host contains only files and personas. Devices slaved to a host can be accessed from within as though you had a direct connection to them, therefore there are no noise penalties
1b: Correct: It's the trade off of having a possibly very strong master lock, but once you have cracked it you have full access to all it protected. That said, the new Kill Code book introduced a new type of host (Industry) that no longer grants the direct connection benefit

2: Yes, you can switch to AR as long as you are not link locked. Moving around the real world is possible but doesn't mean you move through the host - and vice versa.
2a: AR has nothing to do with how easy you are to detect. AR just means you have a dp penalty and rely on your RL ini to act (and you don't take biofeedback damage which can be a very substantial benefit)

3: If you run silent you have a -2 penalty. You can forgoe running silent but that makes it pretty trivial for anyone looking for a hacker to check your device for illegal matrix actions. So as long as no-one notices you using sleaze actions, you don't have to run silent to hack.
3a: Provided you modified your Persona to look like it belongs to the host and you never fail a sleaze action you should be fine. That said: Some hosts have their patrol ic set to be paranoid and may be scanning any persona they detect for illegal matrix actions. In that case it would be better to work in hidden mode

4: Yes, you can communicate pretty freely even while inside a host. That allows leadership and teamwork actions up to a certain degree. That said, you can't watch someone in the matrix if you aren't in the same host as they. A persona that enters a host vanishes from the matrix.

[brombur]

Thanks for the info. a couple follow ups

Entering the Host isn't an action but sleezing/brute forcing a mark on it is in order to gain entry. Is there a distance penalty on that?

It seems that by the law of averages most accomplished runners can very easily access hosts so is the real benefit/challenge provided by a host that you have IC patrolling and scanning constantly to find those that don't belong?

Correct me if I am wrong but a Host defends against a Hack with its Firewall + Rating which is usually Rating +2 or 3. A good host might get 14-16 dice averaging our to 4 or 5 successes. Pretty comparable to a starting runner who is likely to have a pool between 12-14 dice to start.

Currently I have the hosts using a scanning schedule based on the book and determining at random when it starts scanning for the hacker. How often does the system check itself for unauthorized marks?

[Jack_Spade]

Hacking a MARK on a host might incur a noise penalty from local interference with your connection and being on the wrong grid, but not from distance.

That only is true for hosts up to R6. Serious corporation hosts can go up to 12, making them a serious challenge for even the most accomplished hackers.

The system checks itself as often as the owner thought it would be prudent - i.e. a host dedicated as a matrix club might be less conerned about security and more about not bothering its guests than a security host that shouldn't usually be accessed at all by anyone. The latter will likely check every icon with a matrix perception test that it can find, while the former will only get active if there is an obvious breach of security.

[brombur]

Thanks again.

[Finstersang]

1b: Correct: It's the trade off of having a possibly very strong master lock, but once you have cracked it you have full access to all it protected. That said, the new Kill Code book introduced a new type of host (Industry) that no longer grants the direct connection benefit

Which, in turn, makes it pointless for hackers to enter the host. Flawless game design 
(Maybe the freelancer behind that section assumed that you can only interact with the devices slaved to a host while inside that host  )

3a: Provided you modified your Persona to look like it belongs to the host and you never fail a sleaze action you should be fine. That said: Some hosts have their patrol ic set to be paranoid and may be scanning any persona they detect for illegal matrix actions. In that case it would be better to work in hidden mode

For ease of play, that should be the best way to go right now. It´s a bit of a mushy area, though. So far, Matrix Perception has been pretty proactive: You (and Patrol IC) have to pick a target and inspect it, then you may detect that the Target has previously done something illegal. Some new passages in Kill Code indicate that Matrix Users (and Patrol IC) also have some kind of "Passive" Matrix Perception that allows them to spot things happening as they happen...

4: Yes, you can communicate pretty freely even while inside a host. That allows leadership and teamwork actions up to a certain degree. That said, you can't watch someone in the matrix if you aren't in the same host as they. A persona that enters a host vanishes from the matrix.

Communication with the outside should be possible, yes. Sadly, actual Matrix Teamwork (i.e. the use of the Teamwork rules) is still disputed right now.

[HP15BS]

(Maybe the freelancer behind that section assumed that you can only interact with the devices slaved to a host while inside that host  )

Implying that that's not the standard understanding?

[Jack_Spade]

Slaving has a clearly defined function:

"Slaving gives a weaker device some added protection. Whenever a slaved device is called on to make a defense test, it uses either its own or its master’s rating for each rating in the test." p.233 core

Nothing more and nothing less. It neither makes them vanish from the matrix nor does it allow them to enter a host.

[HP15BS]

I read it to mean "you can only interact with devices that are in/on a host while inside that host."

I find it annoyingly easy to get confused about how personas can be "in" a host, but devices can't... even though your persona is kinda just your device + an avatar.

[Finstersang]

(Maybe the freelancer behind that section assumed that you can only interact with the devices slaved to a host while inside that host  )

Implying that that's not the standard understanding?

If you think that assumption through (for standard host, not those new industry hosts), the master-slave-protection from the WAN would never come into play: If you can only wirelessly access the devices in the WAN while you are inside the host (on a side note: What would be the best way for a GM to describe the iconography for this?  ), and if you are automatically assumed to have a direct to connection to every device in the WAN while you are inside the host, the device will always defend with its own Attributes. Then why call it a Slave of the Host to begin with? 

But here´s the the thing: Your assumption, while not actually supported by the RAW, is still somewhat plausible. And given that you (and you´re surely not the only one!) always assumed WANs to work this way, it seems plausible that the freelancer behind Kill Code´s "Industry hosts" assumed it as well. Hell, it´s even possible that your assumption actually is correct, and there´s just a vital line missing in the core rules since 5 years. Wouldn´t surprise me 

[HP15BS]

The issue is that I seem to recall reading that you can't interact with things that are outside of a host while you're inside of it and vice versa.

But it's been a while since I actually played or otherwise needed such rules to be fresh in my mind, so I could be misremembering.

[PiXeL01]

You can’t interact with anything outside the host. Even GOD will not touch you although your Overwatch Counter is still running.

[HP15BS]

Why should it work one way, but not the other? If you can't interact with anything on the other side of the host... then you can't interact with anything on the other side of the host.

So if you can't interact with anything that's inside the host while you're outside of it, then you have to be in the host to do anything. Which means the only option is to be in the host, and therefore have a direct connection (or else get an actual physical direct connection), like Finstersang said.

[brombur]

See this is why I have had so many questions about using the matrix rules as written.

So a device slaved to a host isn't within the host? lets take a standard Security cam on the side of the building. the Decker/Mancer can wirelessly hack the  camera without being inside the host? So the device gets its Rating + Host firewall to resist?

[Jack_Spade]

@HP15BS

The important thing to consider is the word "direct connection".
You can't interact with anything on the matrix outside the host, but a direct connection doesn't happen through the matrix. It's a separate line of communication.