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SINners

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RickDeckard

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« on: <07-13-21/0520:57> »
I've been struggling with how this negative quality should affect my players. Two of them have SINs, national and corporate ltd respectively, but so far I haven't really made them pay for that in any way.

The quality states SINs must be broadcast at all times: this I've hand waived a bit as they usually just broadcast a fake SIN when on a run. It's not like GOD is sitting there watching whether their real SIN blinks in and out of view as long as they're broadcasting a SIN when required to do so.

The quality also states that they must pay tax: this I haven't applied yet, but am thinking about doing so. It just seems kinda pointless to take their Nuyen as it hinders character development. I also don't have a good in-game excuse as they're always paid in certified credsticks. It's not like their real SINs actually make any money (even though they should in order to exist)

How do other GMs handle this quality? What are some good negative in-game effects I can throw at them?

Hanzo

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« Reply #1 on: <07-13-21/0610:09> »
Try checking this thread

https://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=32576.0

maybe you'll find something interresting regarding your question.

TLDR: Players musn't be allowed to transfer big sums of money "from nowher" (aka credsticks) to their official bank accounts. Either they must prove to authorities that have indeed found this credstick, register this event, pay taxes from this sum of money, and only then they can use this money.

Besides if a player doesn't have any official job, but has a steady "income" from credsticks, now that can bring officials' attention to this player.

Just imagine: A person has no official job, but pays rent, does shopping, goes to restaurants ets. All this information is recorded in the SIN. So...

Stainless Steel Devil Rat

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« Reply #2 on: <07-13-21/1146:01> »
I assume you're asking for 6th edition, so that's how I'll answer.

The SINner quality has 3 effects:

1) the fluff mentions that your biometrics are on permanent record with "The Man".

2) one rules-crunch effect is that you have a nuyen bleed, representing taxes/bribes you must pay in order to remain free to commit more crimes

3) second rules-crunch effect calls back to the fluff, and imposes a bonus to any attempt to trace your icon through the matrix.

Speaking strictly: Lifestyles automatically cost more, there's no way around it (unless you're willing to retire the character and give in to being convicted of tax fraud).  And whenever NPCs are trying to track the character's physical location via the matrix, they get bonus edge for that attempt.

I suspect that the point of your contention might be factor #1: the SINner's biometrics are available to every police and security department in the Sixth World.  Arguably, this means that any fingerprint, any tiny droplet of blood, any hair follicle, any piece of shed skin, any use of their natural voice in range of an audio scanner, any time a camera catches their uncovered face, a shadowrunner's jig is up and police know exactly who they are, and that they were at that scene.  Frankly, this theme of an overbearing, omni-present security apparatus is the reason that Shadowrunners are assumed by default to be SINless, as that's the natural explanation for why Big Brother can't find them any instant it wants to, right?   Well, I sympathize with that view, but the bugbear there is if you presume Shadowrunners have to be SINless in order to not be "naturally selected" out of the crime pool, then the SINner quality shouldn't be available at all.  Since it is, then it must be that the underlying premise of "Shadowrunners MUST be SINless in order to survive" must be false.

So I see at least two reasonable ways of looking at the quality given that SINner shadowrunners are, by the fluff, imperiled by their fingerprints being left behind at the scene of a crime when the detective runs their prints through the global SIN register:

A) the increase of lifestyle cost includes bribes to the local security apparatus to push inquiries under the rug when you're involved

B) go ahead and give that bonus Edge to ALL attempts to identify the character, not just attempts to find them via Trace Icon.

depending on your players tastes and campaign theme, there's a third option:

C) if you're a SINner, then you're just fragged if you leave behind biometrics.  Get your go bag, forfeit how ever many pre-paid months you have on your current lifestyle, and go to ground until the cops get tired of looking for you.

Edit: I suppose a blend of B and C is possible: Whenever there's a "messy" scene that police/security are sure to forensically examine, give the NPC's bonus edge to find that SINner's fingerprint, or record of their uncovered face being caught on one of the ubiquitous cameras, or to locate their shed hair.
« Last Edit: <07-13-21/1151:06> by Stainless Steel Devil Rat »
RPG mechanics exist to give structure and consistency to the game world, true, but at the end of the day, you’re fighting dragons with algebra and random number generators.

Hobbes

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« Reply #3 on: <07-13-21/1250:50> »
Other things to keep in mind.  Shadowrun Cops are not really cops.  They're much more mercenary security force, and they only care about "Public Spaces".  Things that happen on Corp territory are handled in house.

Forensics are expensive.  Unless the crime is public and violent, odds are the cops are just sweeping up, not gathering DNA and finger prints.  (Or if the 'runner pissed off someone rich/powerful and they're looking for "whodonnit?" for some reason).

Part two.  Chasing Shadowrunners is also very expensive and generally pointless.  Shadowrunners are hired guns.  Most of the time the target of a run doesn't care about the 'runners per se.  The target of a run probably cares about who hired the runners, and may want to ask the 'runners a few questions in that vein.  Honestly that can be handled by an email and possibly a small payment, rather than a strike team.  Much more cost efficient.  And 9 times out of 10 a corp has a short list of suspects anyway.

In general sending the corps expensive private army to chase a group of dangerous and well armed criminals doesn't pay any quarter end bonuses, so the corp management doesn't actually care much about the 'runners specifically.

Now if the 'runners still have the mcguffin, or they made it personal for someone rich and powerful, then they'll want to be more careful.  Corps and cops may be in pursuit if the 'runners still have the mcguffin (or the Corps think they may still have the mcguffin).  Otherwise the cops pretty much just show up and keep away the press while the cleaning staff picks up the pieces and mops up any blood.     

RickDeckard

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« Reply #4 on: <07-14-21/0145:44> »
I assume you're asking for 6th edition, so that's how I'll answer.



We're playing 5th ed. and this is the "previous editions" board, so I don't know how the quality is described in 6th ed, but I imagine most of this still apply.

5th ed doesn't say anything about lifestyle cost increase, only a 10-15% tax, which I think I'm going to go ahead and apply.

RickDeckard

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« Reply #5 on: <07-14-21/0147:37> »
Other things to keep in mind.  Shadowrun Cops are not really cops.  They're much more mercenary security force, and they only care about "Public Spaces".  Things that happen on Corp territory are handled in house.

Forensics are expensive.  Unless the crime is public and violent, odds are the cops are just sweeping up, not gathering DNA and finger prints.  (Or if the 'runner pissed off someone rich/powerful and they're looking for "whodonnit?" for some reason).

Part two.  Chasing Shadowrunners is also very expensive and generally pointless.  Shadowrunners are hired guns.  Most of the time the target of a run doesn't care about the 'runners per se.  The target of a run probably cares about who hired the runners, and may want to ask the 'runners a few questions in that vein.  Honestly that can be handled by an email and possibly a small payment, rather than a strike team.  Much more cost efficient.  And 9 times out of 10 a corp has a short list of suspects anyway.

In general sending the corps expensive private army to chase a group of dangerous and well armed criminals doesn't pay any quarter end bonuses, so the corp management doesn't actually care much about the 'runners specifically.

Now if the 'runners still have the mcguffin, or they made it personal for someone rich and powerful, then they'll want to be more careful.  Corps and cops may be in pursuit if the 'runners still have the mcguffin (or the Corps think they may still have the mcguffin).  Otherwise the cops pretty much just show up and keep away the press while the cleaning staff picks up the pieces and mops up any blood.     

Yeah, I'm gonna need to increase the heat on them whenever they fuck up. Which is often. Currently we're playing Columbian Subterfuge, and instead of kidnapping the Vicar General they ended up bricking her helicopter mid-air as she was escaping. She's now the centerpiece of a pile of scrap metal at street level =)

Xenon

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« Reply #6 on: <07-14-21/1917:06> »
I've been struggling with how this negative quality should affect my players.
Think of having a SIN as being similar to having/hiding a second identity.

During day-time you are Matt Murdock. A respected legit national citizen that practice law. You own an apartment. You pay taxes. Your parents, also legit citizens, are perhaps still alive. You also have a few friends, perhaps a sibling, a couple of neighbors and some co-workers - all of them which only know you as Matt Murdock.

A few nights a week, however, you are Daredevil. A feared shadowrunner. A corporate asset that do the dirty laundry when the laundry is so dirty that the corp can't use their own security forces. You have contacts within the shadows and you also know several shadowrunners - all of them which only know you as Daredevil.

You really enjoy being Matt Murdoc and you will go great length to keep your two identities separated as you would not want to incriminate your real identity and on the Daredevil side you would also not want elements in the shadows to add two and two as this tend to result in a bullet.

There are a lot of plot hooks here for a creative GM to exploit ;-)




As for Corporate SIN.
A negative quality that reward 25 karma typically have a really large effect on the character and is supposed to put severe constraints on the character. To get a feeling on just how much you can for example compare to other negative qualities that also reward 25 karma. Such as Burnout level Addiction or Extreme Allergy to something Common like Sunlight or Soy.
« Last Edit: <07-14-21/1918:40> by Xenon »