NEWS

[SR4] Smart Armor

  • 5 Replies
  • 4042 Views

TsuiPen

  • *
  • Newb
  • *
  • Posts: 29
« on: <06-08-13/1020:41> »
Hello Chummers,

I have a question I could not find an answer to here or in other forums. I apologise in advance for the lengthy description of the thought process.

My group is not sure about a certain paragraph of the rules on Smart Armor:
"Every time a heavy ballistic weapon or explosive
(usually any weapon that does more than 10 DV) hits a vehicle
with smart armor, roll a test using the smart armorís rating as
the dice pool. Every hit is added to the firing weaponís AP value
(thus rendering the smart armor less effective)." (AR, p 132)

My initial understanding was that it meant an especially heavy ballistic weapon (like more than the usual grenade (10P) -> it says more than 10P) has a chance to get even better armor piercing effects when it targets a smart armored vehicle (derived from the explanatory part in parenthesis -> "thus rendering the smart armor less effective"). Frowns and eyebrow raising occured (explosions being pushed back or smth??).
My group felt that would defy the smart armor's raison d'Ítre. I aggree in this reasoning, but maybe it was meant to somewhat balance vehicle combat.

A related issue was: When does smart armor get triggered? Then we circled back on the reasoning of the quoted paragraph and now I am convinced the "damage > 10P" is meant to be the activation threshold, and the parenthesis "thus rendering the smart armor less effective" is meant to mean "afterwards its rating is decreased by the hits rolled". That leads to some contradiction of "adding" to the AP value and "reducing" it - but I feel this might be unintentional and a mistake in the book.

I hope I now reached the correct understanding of the rule - can someone confirm please (or explain how it really works)?

jerryme

  • *
  • Newb
  • *
  • Posts: 72
  • Power level: over 9000
« Reply #1 on: <06-10-13/0802:29> »
I was wondering the exact same thing. Here's my interpretation:

Quote
Small explosives spaced throughout the exterior of the vehicle prematurely detonate/deflect incoming fire, reducing the AP value of attacks by the smart armor’s rating.

Quote
Every time a heavy ballistic weapon or explosive (usually any weapon that does more than 10 DV) hits a vehicle with smart armor, roll a test using the smart armor’s rating as the dice pool. Every hit is added to the firing weapon’s AP value (thus rendering the smart armor less effective).

First of all, I agree with you that they seem to have mixed up "add" and "reduce". As it is, smart armor would help the opponent, since AP is usually negative if it favors you...

Now, I understand it this way: Smart armor is supposed to be less effective against heavy weapons with a base damage of at least 10. If that's the case, you roll with (smart rating)d6. The hits get "added" to the AP rating, which is basically equal to the smart armor being (temporarily) reduced by the hits (which would make more sense to me). That doesn't mean smart armor is helping heavy weapons, it's just that its protection is less effective. Smart armor cannot increase the AP to more than its rating, because the number of (rating)d6 hits is always equal to or less than rating.

Example: Doberman with normal armor 9 and smart armor 3.

Ganger 1 shoots with Ares Predator, 4 net hits => DV of 9 AP-1 => AP gets "reduced" to 0 by smart armor => no damage thanks to smart armor

Ganger 2 shoots with Panther XXL, 2 net hits => DV of 12 AP-5 => you roll 3d6, get 1 hit => enemy gets one "more" AP, ie. AP-6 => smart armor "reduces" it by 3 => AP-3 (To me it seems easier to just reduce the rating by the hits, ie. 3-1=2 & 5-2=3, so AP-3, but yeah...)


Also, I don't think the rating is decreased by the hits rolled. It is only ever decreased when you glitch. Furthermore you can only use smart armor rating times then it must be replenished.
« Last Edit: <06-10-13/0807:57> by jerryme »

Michael Chandra

  • *
  • Catalyst Demo Team
  • Prime Runner
  • ***
  • Posts: 9876
  • Question-slicing ninja
« Reply #2 on: <06-10-13/0807:24> »
First of all, I agree with you that they seem to have mixed up "add" and "reduce". As it is, smart armor would help the opponent...
No it doesn't. The bonus it gives simply works less, like it says and you already concluded. The Smart Armor rating is relatively decreased with the hits rolled, meaning it on average is 1/3 less effective. So you first add the Smart Armor effect, then you roll to see how much the weapon's AP is changed.
How am I not part of the forum?? O_O I am both active and angry!

jerryme

  • *
  • Newb
  • *
  • Posts: 72
  • Power level: over 9000
« Reply #3 on: <06-10-13/0809:20> »
@Michael
The AP is negative, so adding to it makes it worse for the attacker. That's what I meant...
I've edited a bit...
« Last Edit: <06-10-13/0811:50> by jerryme »

Michael Chandra

  • *
  • Catalyst Demo Team
  • Prime Runner
  • ***
  • Posts: 9876
  • Question-slicing ninja
« Reply #4 on: <06-10-13/0815:09> »
Ah, now I get it. I was thinking from the defender's point of view. Yeah, sounds like a language mixup due to adding and subtracting and all that.
How am I not part of the forum?? O_O I am both active and angry!

TsuiPen

  • *
  • Newb
  • *
  • Posts: 29
« Reply #5 on: <06-10-13/0941:57> »
Thanks, your interpretation makes sense to me, jerryme.

I just realised the strange scenario that in case of "damage > 10P" to score 0 hits on the smart armor's roll is the best outcome for the defending player (better prepare your low hitters!), and a glitch almost* does not do anything else than what would have happened anyway ("reduces the value of the smart armor by one").

*) reducing the rating instead of its remaining charges.