[Zweiblumen]

So, there are a bunch of threads all over the place for this but I wanted to get some opinions about my attempt at making them a bit less useless and I didn't want to clog up other house-rule threads with the mess that is/will be anything TM related.  The main focus here is to make Submersion Grades matter for something other than simply letting you raise your Resonance level.

Attack Upgrade
--------------
The Attack Rating of your Living Persona is increased by
your Submersion Grade (Max of 2).

Data Processing Upgrade
-----------------------
The Data Processing Rating of your Living Persona is
increased by your Submersion Grade (Max of 2).

Firewall Upgrade
-----------------------
The Firewall Rating of your Living Persona is increased
by your Submersion Grade (Max of 2).

Mathemagics
-----------

Mind Over Machine (MMRI)
------------------------
Provide +1/Grade (Max of 3) to all Vehicle skill tests
and +1/Grade (Max of 3) to Handling and Speed while
Jumped In to a vehicle.

NeuroFilter
-----------
You get a +1/Grade (Max of 2) to resist biofeedback damage.
(Note: All matrix damage is biofeedback damage for TMs)

Overclocking
------------
You accelerate your Living Persona to act more quickly in
the Matrix.  You gain an additional +1D6 while in VR.

Quiet
-----
You reduce Noise of the area by 2 for a radius of
10m/Submersion Grade.

Resonance Link
--------------
This echo gives you the ability to establish a low-level,
one-way empathic link with another technomancer of your
choice. As long as you’re linked, you can discern the
dominant mood and emotions of your linked companion. You
know whenever your companion is under attack or stress,
feeling pain, or otherwise in danger. The Resonance Link
works in only one direction (so your companion does not
receive empathic signals from you), but if both of you
take the echo with each other, you can make a two-way link.

Resonance Program
-----------------
Choose one Common or Hacking program per Submersion Grade.
The technomancer can run Resonance/2 programs at a time and
switch programs the same way a Decker does on their deck, ie
swaping no more than 2 per action.

Resonance Riding
----------------
This allows the technomancer to create a PAN with their
Living Persona.  The technomancer can slave Submersion
Grade x 3 devices to their personal PAN.

Resonance Scream
----------------
You increase Noise of the area by 2 for a radius of
10m/Submersion Grade.

Skinlink
--------
You gain the ability to forge a direct connection with any
device you can physically touch. Two technomancers with this
echo can mentally communicate simply by touching.

Sleaze Upgrade
--------------
The Sleaze Rating of your Living Persona is increased by
your Submersion Grade (Max of 2).

Sleepwaker
----------
The technomancer gains the ability to subconsciously perceive
minor events happening around their body while working with the
Matrix in VR. This allows them to choose to perform Perception-
related Actions, in the Matrix or the real world.

Again, would love to hear any and all feedback

[Imladir]

As someone playing a TM, I would love those rules.
But while it makes echoes more inline with initiation powers, the problem (if there is one) would come from a comparison with deckers. Wouldn't that make TMs a lot more efficient that deckers too quickly?

[fseperent]

I don't use TMs in 5th because of how they got boned.
I like these changes mainly due to the limits you placed on them.
Drop the FV by 2 for echoes, and I think TMs would be good to go.

[Zweiblumen]

As someone playing a TM, I would love those rules.
But while it makes echoes more inline with initiation powers, the problem (if there is one) would come from a comparison with deckers. Wouldn't that make TMs a lot more efficient that deckers too quickly?

These haven't had any play-testing yet, so I don't have a good answer for that.  But with Karma costs that are progressively more expensive, and the opportunity cost of what else you *can't* get when investing in submersions it doesn't feel that way to me.  Deckers are still much more flexible than TMs in the matrix *AND* they have access to a lot of things (like cyberware and a *lot* more programs) that TMs don't.  IMHO it's a lot easier to get 500¥ than it is 13/16/19/22/etc karma for programs.  And while they can boost their Matrix stats relatively quickly, they are capped at how high they can go lower than Deckers are.  ¯\_(ツ)_/¯  Needs more (read any) play-testing and insight from the masses like you   Thanks for the feedback!

I don't use TMs in 5th because of how they got boned.
I like these changes mainly due to the limits you placed on them.
Drop the FV by 2 for echoes, and I think TMs would be good to go.

Think you mean Complex Forms, and Aaron suggests dropping them by 3.  And he says to give a +2 to mental stats for ASDF values, but I like making them more accessible via Echoes.  His methods mean a human (with a CRAP ton of karma) could have ASDF values of 10/10/10/10, which is too high IMHO.  Again, ¯\_(ツ)_/¯, needs more play-testing   Thanks for the feedback!

[Imladir]

Do you have a source for what Aaron recommands?

[Zweiblumen]

Do you have a source for what Aaron recommands?

http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=12594.msg450303#msg450303

[Imladir]

Great, thanks

[fseperent]

Yeah, I meant Complex Forms.
I thought about -3 to FV, but ultimately thought that was too much.

Here's my logic on that:
Otakus/TMs have had only 20 or so years tops to work on Resonance powers, with few corporations doing R&D.
Meanwhile, metahumanity has spent at least 50 years on magic research, both freelance and corporate R&D.
At -3, at least the way I'm reading it, Complex Forms and Spells would have the same drain/fading rating for the same effect.
Sadly, from a story point of view, that doesn't make sense.

[Zweiblumen]

Yeah, I meant Complex Forms.
I thought about -3 to FV, but ultimately thought that was too much.

Here's my logic on that:
Otakus/TMs have had only 20 or so years tops to work on Resonance powers, with few corporations doing R&D.
Meanwhile, metahumanity has spent at least 50 years on magic research, both freelance and corporate R&D.
At -3, at least the way I'm reading it, Complex Forms and Spells would have the same drain/fading rating for the same effect.
Sadly, from a story point of view, that doesn't make sense.

IMHO, we're getting into Simulation vs. Abstraction nit-picking here.  Based on that logic, if you're playing a 5e game set in 2050, you'd have to raise the Drain Value of all of the spells to compensate for that.  If you're playing a 5e game set in 2090, you'd have to lower the DV for spells etc etc.  For the most part, Crunch is Crunch and Fluff is Fluff.  I love both in this game, but I don't think the reason a 15yo that has just Awakened can cast a spell at DV X instead of X-1 is because of 50 years of research.  And that same meta will cast that same spell at DV X after studying magic for 15 years when they are a 30yo (baring any meta-magic and specialization etc etc).  All that said, sure!  FVs of RAW -2 or FVs of RAW -3, either way you look at it, FVs are too high

[HiddenBoss]

When there a CF with higher fade to made something do one action (mind spells have less drain) then a spell made to pick up dragon magic. There got to be something wrong.