Shadowrun
Shadowrun Play => Rules and such => Topic started by: Jack_Spade on <06-29-16/0603:07>
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Just received my hard copy of the German Rigger 5.0 book.
I'm pleased to say after a short skim that it seems to contain a lot of corrections (e.g. the new matrix actions now use the correct matrix attributes)
So if you have any questions in regard to the rules ask and I'll try to find if there are any official (German) corrections.
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I like that title; tarmac (aka asphalt) warrior sounds much better than Rigger 5 point oh.
That being said, I honestly thought R5.0 was one of the books with the least amount of necessary errata. One thing I do wonder is if rules for Smart Tires is listed as an accessory somewhere, because these are omitted in the English version but come stock on one or more vehicles.
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Well, one thing I see there are now actually prices for drone weapon mounts. (Micro 500, Mini 600, Small 750, Standard 1500, Large 2500, Huge 3000, Heavy 4000
That said, no there are no rules for Smart Tires - instead they removed the entry from the vehicle itself
While I'm at it, the layout is much clearer than in the English copy, mainly due to the fact that all vehicle entries for one class of vehicles was collected in one table instead of creating a mini table for each entry.
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Oh, any mention of capacity taken for Realistic Features on in the drone modification chapter? If I recall it has no listed mod slot cost in the English edition.
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Yes, it costs one point regardless which rating is used.
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Sweet, thanks!
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How come the German versions are improved and the English versions never get updated...? Isn't the game originally English? I don't wanna have to learn a second language to have updated rules.
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Pegasus, the company that produces and distributes the German edition, works with Catalyst on rules questions that are necessary for correct translation. They have a certain degree of latitude in their own rule making process, so it often seems the German edition is a more polished product.
Unfortunately, at least according to Catalyst, there isn't really a process to take the information Pegasus ends up with in order to give it to the English speaking public as Errata, because it can be the results of discussions back and forth and not a cohesive list of "change X to Y" as one would expect from an Errata document.
That's the story as I know it, anyway. Maybe someone from Catalyst would care to comment on the process in more detail.
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The only answer that makes any sense: Pegasus cares enough to get it right/ about their customers while Catalyst doesn't.
How come the German versions are improved and the English versions never get updated...? Isn't the game originally English? I don't wanna have to learn a second language to have updated rules.
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Guys, please.
That discussion has been done to death - not that the grievances aren't founded, but this is not the reason I opened this thread.
Stay constructive, please.
In exchange I can finally tell you the ratings of the Renraku Cyberhand Scuttler Drone:
Handl 5 Speed 1B Acl 1 Body 1(1) Arm 1 Pilot 2 Sen 1 Ava 8 Price 8000
And it seems as if a lot of prices have been lowered, but I'd need to make an in dept comparison for that.
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Ooh, have they updated the capacity for modification on the non-Rigger drones? Some are listed as BODY (MODIFIED BODY) in the English version while others are listed as BODY.
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Yes, those have all been addressed and incorporated
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Nice. Thanks again, man, time to pick up Asphalt Warrior
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Have there been any changes to the swarm rules between the two versions? As is there really OPed and while I don't expect any changes I thought id ask. Also the noizkeeto debuff ability still unchanged?
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1. An interval listed for salvage tests?
2. Drone upgrade thresholds?
3. Also drone / vehicle character sheets?
4. Official answer for this mess:
This is unfortunately a big arguing point, so I am just going to state the points and you will have to get a GM call.
I. Gunnery is a matrix action while jumped
II. Hot-sim provides +2 to matrix actions pool while jumped in
III. The description of the Rig says it provides +1 to matrix actions while in hot-sim
So the arguments are:
A.The hardware hot-sim bonus is a more specific rule for then normal hot-sim bonus. (you only get +1hotsim)
B.The hardware hot-sim bonus and the standard bonus are separate bonuses and stack. (you get +3 hotsim)
C. The hardware bonus is a typo, because the book is badly edited and organized. Same matrix, same bonus (+2)
5.For Salvage tests Rigger 5.0 states that you state the "damage" you wish to inflict on vehicle/drone/gear in order to salvage. I make 3 assumption that are not stated any where and I would think they should be.
I. max limit is that of the whole condition monitor (should be obvious but I don't believe it is stated)
II. This "damage" is run against the condition monitor of a completely full condition monitor (destroyed) because you could just dismantle a full health drone for 100% of the parts -1 for every 2 points of damage it has? (because if it is 1 for 1 then you would get 0 from salvage instead of about 50%)
III. Choosing to do less damage does not exclude further searches only limit them to search with a total of damage chosen
(so you search a destroyed 8 health drone for 4 damage twice, it means you take twice as long to salvage parts but you are likely to get double the parts, you search the drone once for 8 apply edge you could get the same number of parts in half the time, or you do 1 pass without edge and just get the easy to find and remove parts but the damage you make searching make additional runs pointless)
IV. Possible example for a pass: Mechanic skill + Logic +2 AR +1 working condition + 1 Superior tools [damage inflicted + 2 special work area]
Any Clarification is appreciated.
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Just received my hard copy of the German Rigger 5.0 book.
I'm pleased to say after a short skim that it seems to contain a lot of corrections (e.g. the new matrix actions now use the correct matrix attributes)
So if you have any questions in regard to the rules ask and I'll try to find if there are any official (German) corrections.
what attributes does confuse pilot and suppress noise use? same as in rigger 5 or should they be using something else?
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You mentioned Smart Tires, did they do the same thing with the Motorcycle Gyro Stabilization?
4. Official answer for this mess:
This is unfortunately a big arguing point, so I am just going to state the points and you will have to get a GM call.
I. Gunnery is a matrix action while jumped
II. Hot-sim provides +2 to matrix actions pool while jumped in
III. The description of the Rig says it provides +1 to matrix actions while in hot-sim
So the arguments are:
A.The hardware hot-sim bonus is a more specific rule for then normal hot-sim bonus. (you only get +1hotsim)
B.The hardware hot-sim bonus and the standard bonus are separate bonuses and stack. (you get +3 hotsim)
C. The hardware bonus is a typo, because the book is badly edited and organized. Same matrix, same bonus (+2)
Clayton, this "mess" as you put it is completely contained in the Core rules, as far as I'm aware Rigger 5.0 doesn't modify any of the bonuses whatsoever and it seems pretty clear once you work it out.
Since you already broke this down (and it was discussed) in another thread, I'm moving this part of the discussion back to that thread (http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=24322.msg454507#msg454507) to keep from cluttering this one.
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Understood, I should have considered that was a core book question before posting I just grabbed my top 5 of the 20+ questions I have. Any hope for the other 4 questions? I believe they are all rigger 5.0
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Have there been any changes to the swarm rules between the two versions? As is there really OPed and while I don't expect any changes I thought id ask. Also the noizkeeto debuff ability still unchanged?
As far as I can see those rules are unchanged. Which isn't a big surprise since these rules might be a bit OP but they are very much functional
1. An interval listed for salvage tests?
2. Drone upgrade thresholds?
3. Also drone / vehicle character sheets?
4. Official answer for this mess: [...]
1. Nope, but I'd assume it's the same as the Repair Test (4 hours)
2. Yes, Mechanik+Logic [Mental] (4, 1 hour)
3. No
4. As answered in the other thread
what attributes does confuse pilot and suppress noise use? same as in rigger 5 or should they be using something else?
Confuse Pilot: Electronic Warfare + Logic [Data Processing] vs. Pilot + Firewall
Suppress Noise: Electronic Warfare + Logic [Data Processing]
You mentioned Smart Tires, did they do the same thing with the Motorcycle Gyro Stabilization?
Nope, that one has rules now. It keeps your bike upright and gives you +2 dice on balance tests
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OK so Rigger 5 is correct for those actions,good to know. on a another note upgrading a drones pilot cost mods point under the optional drone modding rules right?
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I wanted to type correct, but a closer reading and a table in the book shows that it seems not to cost any mod points.
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I wanted to type correct, but a closer reading and a table in the book shows that it seems not to cost any mod points.
Hmm the way I read it is that all drone attribute upgrades including pilot cost mod points equal to the increase minus 1 with one point increases costing 0 point per the section Adding up grades with the individual rules for each attribute just giving the cost of the upgrade.
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Yeah, but there is a table in the German book that indicates the opposite. (UP stands for Upgrade/Mod Points)
(http://i68.tinypic.com/1192cfc.jpg)
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OK,interesting. I just wounder if that's what catalyst intended or if its just Pegasus's interpretation . Think I'll ask in the errata thread.
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Are X-Ray sensors mentioned anywhere except page 138 (as part of the equipment on the Telestrian Industries Shamus drone?
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Nope, not as far as I can see.
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Bummer; thanks for checking, though!