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Any improvements to my adept Troll?

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Pissedoffbuddha

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« on: <10-15-10/1021:40> »
Hey All,

So I've just recently started playing SR4 and have become obsessed with making characters.  Right now I play a street samurai who uses a blade.  There is a decent chance he may die due to story things.... So if he does die I need to cover close combat again for the group.  So I've decided to make this Troll Adept.

Background (Quick Version):  Left at orphanage when he was a young kid (not baby). Orphanage rejected him.  Learn to survive on the streets.  Starting robing people to get money to gamble at the Underground Fighting League (UFL, similar to illegal boxing where people gamble).  Got recruited to the Triads who showed him he was an Adept and taught him to fight, currently fights for the Triads in the UFL.

Main Question:  Is it worth 1 magic to have Improved reflexes 2 rather than 1?
Fun Note: his DV on unarmed attacks is (STR/2 + 8)S or P, so it is 13S or 13P :) he can one shot most my group down to knocked out.

450 BP Limit

Name: Jax Durden (haha Fight Club)
Race: Troll
Magic Type: Adept

Stats

Body: 9
Agility: 3
Reaction: 4 (6)
Strength: 9
Charisma: 2
Intuition: 2
Logic: 2
Will Power: 3

Edge: 3
Magic: 6
Essence: 6

Qualities

Toughness
High Pain Tolerance 1
Adept
Martial Arts 2
- +2 DV to unarmed
- Finishing Move
- Kick Attack
- Break Weapon
- Set Up

SINner Criminal

Skills

Athletics Skill Group: 1
Unarmed Combat(Martial Arts): 6 ( 8 )
Dodge (Melee Combat): 4 (6)
Perception: 3
First Aid (Combat Wounds): 3 (5)
Tracking (Urban): 2 (4)
Con: 2
Pilot Ground Craft (Bike): 2 (4)

Contact

Alak Bhunath: L 4, C 3 (Triad Adept Trainer)

Powers

Attribute Boost 1 (Agility)
Improved Reflexes 2
Killing Hands
Penetrating Strike 3
Critical Strike 6

Gear

Armor Jacket
Helmet (Regular)
Commlink
Medkit 6
Fake Sin 4
Off-Road Bike
Low lifestyle

Thanks for the tips :)

Angelone

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« Reply #1 on: <10-15-10/1237:21> »
Looks pretty good. I'm going to suggest you get a stealth skill at least Infiltration. I'd also get a ranged weapon skill, it really sucks when you can't get to the enemy, but they can shoot you.
« Last Edit: <10-15-10/1239:31> by Angelone »
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Dakka

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« Reply #2 on: <10-15-10/1323:35> »
Dodge (melee combat) is inferior to your unarmed ability to block, especially if you get to add your Martial Arts spec to blocking.  Melee defense would be reaction + unarmed for block, or reaction plus unarmed plus unarmed for full parry.  Should change that spec to (Ranged) or drop it and the tracking spec for Pistols 1.

I would also trade out Set Up for Sweep. Set Up is a fairly useless maneuver, you have to give up the ability to do damage in order to get a bonus on your next attack.  Sweep does damage and also places the enemy prone which is +3 to hit on Melee.  You can Finishing Move a Sweep just as easily as a Set Up.  Sure it may look bad to trip a guy and crush his head with your knee, but its effective. 

Unless you are the only first aid skill in the group you could change that for the recommended infiltration skill or even stealth group at 1.  First Aid has a threshold of (2), uses one of your weak stats, and you will always have the -2 modifier for being an adept, and generally -1 for average conditions.  With your medkit thats a whole 10 dice to get 3 hits and heal 1 box.  A lot of work for a guy that sleeps it off with 18 dice (body + body).  You could also up the armor a bit if you have access to Arsenal.  Form Fitting Body Armor can be worn with other armor, costs 1,600¥, and will bump you up by 6/2.  SecureTech Personal Protection Piecemeal (PPP) armor can be worth with other armor, and for 900¥ you can get +2/+4.  That with your Armor Jacket and troll armor would be 17/12, which is going to convert a lot of damage to stun that you can rest off with 12 dice (body + willpower) and not need first aid at all. 

On improved Reflexes 2 I tend to find its not worth the magic point, and even improved reflexes 1 can be replaced by a Synaptic Booster.  It won't exactly save you BPs, since the starting Synaptic Booster is 80k, but 1 point of magic in essence loss is cheaper than Improved Reflexes.  Alternately you can go with Jazz (the drug) for +1 reaction and +1 IP for short periods of time then once you get 160k in your pocket you buy a Synaptic Booster R2 and for a single essence (-1 magic) you get Improved Reflexes 2.  If you use Jazz instead of Improved Reflexes you could get Improved Unarmed 3 for 1.5 PP and Wall Running for 1 PP.  Wall Running + troll's run speed will generally solve most of your "I can't reach him but he's shooting me" problems.  Wall Running is in Street Magic.

Critias

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« Reply #3 on: <10-15-10/1507:39> »
Ditto on the Dodge front.  Right now you could drop the Dodge skill altogether and free up enough points to get your Athletics Group higher (to help with ranged combat and general mobility), and have enough points left over to pick up a solid start on the Pistols (or some other gun) skill.  Likewise, you might want to shuffle around some skill points to get some sort of Infiltration ability, partially just because it's often a job requirement as a Shadowrunner, partially because as a dedicated close-combat guy you'll want every trick you can manage in order to get within range.

I like your Magic pretty much as it is -- I'm not a big fan of buying it all the way to 6, just to then chop it down in order to get Bioware or something.  I think you'll find that having 3 IPs is pretty nice, especially as a dedicated close-combat guy (who'll often need an action to get close or dodge, and will always need full actions to attack with).  I'm not too crazy about Penetrating Strike (especially with a damage value as high as yours, I don't think you'll really need it), I tend to prefer Elemental Strike -- but if you like it, you like it.  ;)

To be honest with a guy as already-awesome as yours is at unarmed combat, martial art maneuvers can be pretty much whatever you want them to be;  they're icing on the cake, so pick the ones you like.  That said, some of them you've picked seem a little weird, so you might want to read back over the list and look into how some of the rules interact with one another.

The only other suggestion I'd make is to not rule out social skills entirely.  Realistically, as well as from a "rounding out the character" perspective, I think you'd like to have a little Etiquette (street), Etiquette (Triads), or Intimidation, don't you?
« Last Edit: <10-15-10/1509:21> by Critias »

voydangel

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« Reply #4 on: <10-16-10/1400:03> »
Some of this has already been said, but here goes. Personally I would:

• I only count 5.5 PP used, according to SR20A. I don't have my old 4e handy, so maybe you've used 6 according to that, but, if my math is right... I would ditch the 3 ranks of Penetrating strike and get 2 ranks of counterstrike and 1 rank of attribute boost (strength).
• reduce Pilot ground craft & first aid down to 1 each, and remove the specializations for Dodge, Tracking & First Aid, netting a total of 18 BPs.
• remove kick maneuver for an additional 2 BP.
• Remove high pain tolerance and toughness for a net of 15 BP. (you can always get high pain tolerance with adept powers later)
• use your 35 BP to get pistols 2, infiltration 3, etiquette 1, intimidation 1 & negotiation 1. (3 BP left over.)
• swap the Set-up & Break weapon maneuvers for Sweep & Disarm respectively. Sweep and disarm are very very handy.
• use the remaining 3 BP to grab form-fitting body armor and the PPP armor setup as noted above by Dakka.
• I would definitely keep your magic at 6.

Just my 2 cents, it's your character after all, so I don't know if these changes would fit into your vision of what it should be. =)
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Dakka

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« Reply #5 on: <10-18-10/0320:31> »
FFBA is only 1600, less than half of one BP used on gear, don't need to spend 3 on that.

Bradd

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« Reply #6 on: <10-18-10/0607:20> »
Find out whether your GM is using the optional rule that lets you buy power points instead of metamagic when you initiate. It makes a big difference in planning. In particular, Magic 6 is a lot less important if you can get +1 PP after just 2-3 sessions.

Lately, I prefer using some combination of Jazz, Cram, and Edge for initiative. A lot depends on the threats you face, but 2 IPs are often enough. For example, a lot of grunts are slow, and you can skimp on Full Defense. If things get tight, buy a third IP with Edge. If you know that things are going to get really ugly, use all three for 4 IPs. Just beware addiction, especially when mixing Jazz & Cram. Speedballing gives you -1 to addiction tests.

voydangel

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« Reply #7 on: <10-19-10/0052:47> »
FFBA is only 1600, less than half of one BP used on gear, don't need to spend 3 on that.
Then with the other 2 BP you could re-aquire a maneuver, or get a specialization in semi-auto pistols, or ranged dodge or some such... =)
My tips for new GM's
Unless it is coming from an official source, RAI = "Rules As Imagined."
SR1+SR2+SR3++SR4++SR5+++h+b+++B+D382UBIE-RN---DSF-W+m+(o++)gm+MP