[firebug]

Hmm...  Saw the Echoes from a friend's book.  Not super happy with the limited number.  MMRI is totally redundant isn't it?  And Skinlink being an echo means every TM has their first 13 Karma predetermined, realistically.  And kinda annoyed by the FFF echo since it makes actually having built a TM character to use a Pain Editor be...  Pointless and less unique.  And Mathemagics?  Really?  A +2 Limit to a small group of rolls?  A static limit increase?  This should not be an echo.  This should be a quality like Analytical Mind.  Quiet and Resonance Scream are interesting and kinda useful at least, though again it bothers me that it's a static number.  A number literally every decker can easily beat, but...  Whatever.  Two is better than nothing.

I just have to say...  Like, cool, awesome.  TMs are gonna get their own book.  But god dammit, to be waiting for Data Trails since the edition came out to see TMs get a bunch of material, only to hear like freaking week before it comes out that "Oh, no, we're saving all the good TM stuff for a book you have to wait even longer for!" pisses me off.

I'll probably get my own copy but...  I'm disappointed.  Not even streams and paragons!  I mean, seriously?  This would be like if fucking Street Grimoire came out three months later than it did, but it lacked anything about mentor spirits and traditions, had half as many spells and half as many metamagics.  And then someone came and implied maybe those things would be in the next book specially for magicians that you'd have to wait three more months for and pay for as well.

I'm not saying this is some kind of marketing manipulation thing, but I'm not comfortable with how close it gets to being one by coincidence.  This is a serious disappointment.

I really hope the TM-specific book actually does what it needs to, so the people who write it don't get threatening emails from twice-burnt fans.

[AndrewD2]

OK I see people complaining about "Skinlink" as an echo. I'm not sure what it's supposed to be,but in "Unwired" its an Echo too.

[Miri]

OK I see people complaining about "Skinlink" as an echo. I'm not sure what it's supposed to be,but in "Unwired" its an Echo too.

In 4th though there wasn't a huge benefit to being directly connected to something beyond the lack of noise and unjammable.  In 5th a direct connection lets you avoid high firewalls from a Master device.

[AndrewD2]

OK I see people complaining about "Skinlink" as an echo. I'm not sure what it's supposed to be,but in "Unwired" its an Echo too.

In 4th though there wasn't a huge benefit to being directly connected to something beyond the lack of noise and unjammable.  In 5th a direct connection lets you avoid high firewalls from a Master device.

Got it, thanks. I didn't play 4th and I'm still learning 5th. Still trying to decide my first Echo whether it'll be Skinlink or Overclocking.

[firebug]

I'd suggest Skinlink, because without it TMs have no way to get a direct connection.  It makes up for that huge issue and also is plain good/sneaky.  It just is so needed to do stuff like entering hosts, that it's kinda upsetting that it's still an echo and not something more accessible.

TMs need stuff like Enhancements from Street Grimoire.  An ability they can buy that isn't quite Echo level, but isn't just a quality-level ability.

[Herr Brackhaus]

Couldn't a Technomancer use trodes to form a direct connection?

[Darzil]

Might be nice to give one echo to a Technomancer at Chargen - being able to have Control Rig 1 or Direct Connection from the off would help make on site hacking and techno-rigger viable.

[prionic6]

Our group allows the Technomancer to establish a direct connection by attaching a data tab and connecting to it wirelessly. edit: That's not RAW

[Triskavanski]

Aye, its understandable a lot of people are annoyed at the whole skin link thing. Mostly because its so big a thing to form the direct connection, and you know there will be an augment for it too.

I agree that whole Mathmatical thing should have been something else.. Unless you know, there was some technomancer stuff to work with it. Like a technomancer fighting style that uses mathmatics. But I have to ask.. Why in the world does not a single Echo expand with submersion grade? Why is it so often nothing more than a small stat increase?


Also, I want to note that I believe you can put an agent on a commlink now. Could be useful.

[Novocrane]

Also, I want to note that I believe you can put an agent on a commlink now

You mean outside hardwiring virtual machine to the commlink, and running an agent through that? Because last check, they only have room for apps.

[jackiepaper]

Aye, its understandable a lot of people are annoyed at the whole skin link thing. Mostly because its so big a thing to form the direct connection, and you know there will be an augment for it too.

I agree that whole Mathmatical thing should have been something else.. Unless you know, there was some technomancer stuff to work with it. Like a technomancer fighting style that uses mathmatics. But I have to ask.. Why in the world does not a single Echo expand with submersion grade? Why is it so often nothing more than a small stat increase?


Also, I want to note that I believe you can put an agent on a commlink now. Could be useful.

Understand that i cannot go back and rewrite the core mechanics of TMs. What they are is what we have to work with. I didn't write the complex forms or echoes in Data Trails so i'm in the same boat as you.

Skinlink was an echo in 4E and it's an echo in 5E. It's done and i can't go back and change it, so asking for it over and over again will not make that happen.

MMRI will obviously need to be fixed because it's a reprint. I don't know if the writer just didn't know that was already an echo or if something got jacked in editing. I'll ask him about that and Mathemagics (because i have no idea what it's supposed to be for either).

As far as echoes not being tied to Submergence grade, i don't know why that has been the case so far, but i have several planned that will be tied to submergence grade.

I am considering something similar to sidebar in Unwired that contained the "alternate" technomancer rule. That gets secondary priority though. I am looking to address the Fading issue and bring back/update some of the more interesting echoes from 4E.

Streams and Paragons are also top of the list priority. It ain't right that every character has to be a techno-adept.

[ScytheKnight]

Fair enough mate... I guess the main reason people are crying foul about Skin Link as an echo so much is because Hacking is about the only thing they're viable at and what the vast majority of the rest of their abilities are built around.

If you had more stuff to support Dronomancers/Technoriggers and maybe even some sort of combat powers... well... then that opens up more variety in that first echo. Hackers would take Skin Link, dronos/riggers would take MoM/MMRI, combat technos would take something else... heck maybe even having some other kind of 'wildcard' role technos can play and they might have something else they would want as a first Echo.

[jackiepaper]

My goal is always to make mechanics that allow for a range of characters instead of a single "useful" build. I hate when i see stuff like that.

[ScytheKnight]

Yeah, I know for me I real really peeved to see Skinlink as an Echo simply because it's a total no brainer. Give TMs more roles and there's less pressure for them to play as a hacker, thus less need for that first 13 karma to go into getting Skinlink.

[Top Dog]

So something I was wondering earlier and that came up in a recent discussion as well...

Can you run Virtual Machine (in a useful fashion) on a Commlink through a Program Carrier modification?

It's pretty clear that you can run Virtual Machine, which gives you 2 slots for cyberprograms. But does the fact of having 2 cyberprogram-slots give the commlink the ability to run cyberprograms, or is that a seperate ability? (If it is, it makes Virtual Machine useless on commlinks; if it isn't, it makes Virtual Machine fantastic on commlinks).