[Bull]

For what it's worth, Bull knows full well that he'd get smeared by Harlequin. But he has a grudge he just can't let go. And it'll possibly get him killed one of these days.  Unless Harlequin decides to duel him in the matrix

[CanRay]

"Hey, Bull, you know that guy that keeps topping your scores in that game you play when bored?  69_Chuckling_Dude_69?  Guess who he is?"

[Marcus]

Even using that definition 4e+ are more Mary Sue than the earlier edition shadowland characters.

I mean there is plenty of Shadowland characters to not like, and by all means don't like them, b/c they horrible people, or just maybe they just  rub you the wrong way. But to be clear a character ether is a marysue or is not. It's not a spectrum, they aren't more Marysue or less Marysue. Just as an example I can't stand Clockwork. There is no reason to believe a runner with rep for eating his team mates would last a month in the shadows, and every reason to believe he'd be dead door knob 10 mins for before his next run started. If clockwork ever showed up in an official missions, I'd bet plenty of people would go way out of their way up to including failing the run to kill him, just b/c not doing so is to dangerous. All the hacker Hubby and wife had to do get rid of the jerk, was send his address to the buddies of those he ate. That would have been the end of that.  But for whatever reason the devs like to keep that monster around thus he is a plot protected, Douche waffle. Be that doesn't make him a Marysue.

[Wakshaani]

People he … ate?

Is there something I should know?

Did Clockwork become a Ghoul when I wasn't looking?

[Marcus]

People he … ate?

Is there something I should know?

Did Clockwork become a Ghoul when I wasn't looking?

As far as I know he is not ghoul, just a total psycho. It's in one of his write ups.

Clockwork is first class bad news and needs to go.

[Lormyr]

The "legendary" runners don't bother me much, either in personality or stats. I do wish the high tier magic types weren't so ludicrous (do we really need anything with a magic attribute of 36?), but that is a relatively minor eye roll.

What does grate me are the stat blocks that aren't even legal. Serrin Sol from Court of Shadows springs to mind instantly with his magic attribute 10 but initiate grade 18. Come on guys give us a break.

[PiXeL01]

Most of the cast in the Seilie Court are immortal elves. Stats blocks for those and Great Dragons shouldn’t be printed simply because they are at the “Snap my fingers, you vanish from history” kind of power level

[Ghost Rigger]

I mean there is plenty of Shadowland characters to not like, and by all means don't like them, b/c they horrible people, or just maybe they just  rub you the wrong way. But to be clear a character ether is a marysue or is not. It's not a spectrum, they aren't more Marysue or less Marysue. Just as an example I can't stand Clockwork. There is no reason to believe a runner with rep for eating his team mates would last a month in the shadows, and every reason to believe he'd be dead door knob 10 mins for before his next run started. If clockwork ever showed up in an official missions, I'd bet plenty of people would go way out of their way up to including failing the run to kill him, just b/c not doing so is to dangerous. All the hacker Hubby and wife had to do get rid of the jerk, was send his address to the buddies of those he ate. That would have been the end of that.  But for whatever reason the devs like to keep that monster around thus he is a plot protected, Douche waffle. Be that doesn't make him a Marysue.

It does, actually. He acts shitty and he doesn't suffer consequences. And he's just the tip of the iceberg, as you have deckers engaging in cybercombat right in the commentary. Try that in meatspace with a bunch of streetsams and see what happens.

[CanRay]

Doesn't suffer consequences?

I guess folks missed the Safehouses e-book.   

[Dangermaus]

I didn't see anything in there concerning clockwork getting his comeuppance... hell, he and Netcat were getting along in that one.

[Ghost Rigger]

Perhaps he meant that the Jackpoint profile at the beginning of the PDF, which clearly belongs to someone whom has pissed off the whole community recently, is Clockwork's. But the point remains:he hasn't been kicked off Jackpoint and doxxed, despite making death threats against other Jackpointers and their child.

[Marcus]

It does, actually. He acts shitty and he doesn't suffer consequences. And he's just the tip of the iceberg, as you have deckers engaging in cybercombat right in the commentary. Try that in meatspace with a bunch of streetsams and see what happens.

Bad things have happened to Clockwork. But He is just still alive. (Which I don't love.) But not getting dead does not make one a Marysue.
Next fights in meat space happen all the time in SR, why is that an issue?

[Cappa101]

This Clockwork guy sounds like total dreck. Have the story arcs involving these "legendary shadowrunners" definitively concluded, or will any of these OP characters be making future appearance in SR?

[Ghost Rigger]

Bad things have happened to Clockwork. But He is just still alive. (Which I don't love.) But not getting dead does not make one a Marysue.

That's not the issue. The issue is that people's reactions to him do not line up with his actions. Think of it like this: what would happen if your character went onto Jackpoint and threatened the crotchspawn of Slamm-0! and Netcat? How long would it before every device you own has been bricked and every enemy you've ever made knows everything they could ever want to know about you?

Next fights in meat space happen all the time in SR, why is that an issue?

It's an issue because it's a good way to get kicked out of all but the scummiest establishments and convince everyone that you're a total psycho. I should imagine that it's more or less the same for matrix fights. These people are supposed to be veteran, respected members of the shadowrunning community that everyone looks up to as role models and turns to for information, and this is how they act?

[PiXeL01]

I honestly think there should not be a “cast”. Instead it should just be random users. The setting doesn’t need sitcom level drama, especially not without consequences.

JackPoint shouldn’t knit them together at impossible levels. Keep this sort of fiction to the novels :/