Shadowrun
Shadowrun General => Gear => Topic started by: SMDVogrin on <04-10-14/1536:15>
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So, I was flipping through some of my old favorites that just showed up for 5E, and I noticed the "fire more than 10 rounds" appears to be gone from both the HVAR and the Vindicator mini-gun. Did I miss something, or are they back to 10 rd bursts only?
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Given the way bursts function in 5e I think they just have to be standardized (with the exception of the "not enough bullets" rule.)
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Given the way bursts function in 5e I think they just have to be standardized (with the exception of the "not enough bullets" rule.)
... There's no special reason for that to be so in SR5 that I can think of, given that SR4's burst rules were largely the same. SR5 just made recoil progressive and removed one of the options relating to burst fire.
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It is pretty funny that the HVAR lost the "super machinegun" rules, which just makes it a laughably terrible rifle. The same is true for the Vindicator. It's inferior to other LMGs in essentially every way.
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It is pretty funny that the HVAR lost the "super machinegun" rules, which just makes it a laughably terrible rifle. The same is true for the Vindicator. It's inferior to other LMGs in essentially every way.
What?!? The Vindicator classified as a LMG, is only 6,000, has twice the ammo capacity of any other LMG, has a AP of -4 which is much better than any other LMG and it has a built in smart gun. Not sure how that classifies as inferior IMO.
Granted, the Ares HVAR lacks AP but is has a deep ammo bin for a AR, lots of built in RC and good accuracy. Not the best AR available but IMHO it's certainly not terrible.
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It is pretty funny that the HVAR lost the "super machinegun" rules, which just makes it a laughably terrible rifle. The same is true for the Vindicator. It's inferior to other LMGs in essentially every way.
What?!? The Vindicator classified as a LMG, is only 6,000, has twice the ammo capacity of any other LMG, has a AP of -4 which is much better than any other LMG and it has a built in smart gun. Not sure how that classifies as inferior IMO.
Granted, the Ares HVAR lacks AP but is has a deep ammo bin for a AR, lots of built in RC and good accuracy. Not the best AR available but IMHO it's certainly not terrible.
I don't always agree with Jim1701. But when I do, I prefer to tell everyone.
:)
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ROFL
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Given the way bursts function in 5e I think they just have to be standardized (with the exception of the "not enough bullets" rule.)
... There's no special reason for that to be so in SR5 that I can think of, given that SR4's burst rules were largely the same. SR5 just made recoil progressive and removed one of the options relating to burst fire.
Well, burst modifiers are based on the number of bullets fired so IIRC 3 bullets = -2, 6 bullets = -5, 10 bullets = -9. So if a weapon fired more bullets than normal then the dice pool penalty would have to be adjusted for them. Technically there isn't any reason why you couldn't do that though maybe balance could be an issue. You could just use a reversal of the "Not enough bullets rule" to create larger bursts if you wanted to. Just add dice for bigger bursts.
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Given the way bursts function in 5e I think they just have to be standardized (with the exception of the "not enough bullets" rule.)
... There's no special reason for that to be so in SR5 that I can think of, given that SR4's burst rules were largely the same. SR5 just made recoil progressive and removed one of the options relating to burst fire.
Well, burst modifiers are based on the number of bullets fired so IIRC 3 bullets = -2, 6 bullets = -5, 10 bullets = -9. So if a weapon fired more bullets than normal then the dice pool penalty would have to be adjusted for them. Technically there isn't any reason why you couldn't do that though maybe balance could be an issue. You could just use a reversal of the "Not enough bullets rule" to create larger bursts if you wanted to. Just add dice for bigger bursts.
Thing is, all of that was true in SR4.
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I dunno then. They don't ask me when they do this stuff, darn it. :(
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What?!? The Vindicator classified as a LMG, is only 6,000, has twice the ammo capacity of any other LMG, has a AP of -4 which is much better than any other LMG and it has a built in smart gun. Not sure how that classifies as inferior IMO.
Granted, the Ares HVAR lacks AP but is has a deep ammo bin for a AR, lots of built in RC and good accuracy. Not the best AR available but IMHO it's certainly not terrible.
I don't always agree with Jim1701. But when I do, I prefer to tell everyone.
:)
"I don't always Shadowrun, but when I do, it's SoyKaff." - Gundam, The Most Interesting Decker In Seattle
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Granted, the Ares HVAR lacks AP but is has a deep ammo bin for a AR, lots of built in RC and good accuracy. Not the best AR available but IMHO it's certainly not terrible.
See, I thought that too - "well, trade some damage for free RC..." Then I realized it has 1 more RC than an Alpha (not counting the shock pad that you can give to the Alpha, too), and it can't take barrel accessories - so it will have LESS RC than the Alpha due to lack of Gas Vent. And it holds 8 more rounds of ammo than the Alpha.
Whether I like it or not, the Alpha is the gold standard that my players are going to be comparing it to (especially since it's the same availability and pretty much the same cost). And compared to that, we might as well call it the "Excalibur".
I think that I'm just going to house-rule the 4e Supermachinegun rules back on (and the 15rd burst rule for the minigun, since the one player who has one likes that part of it).