Shadowrun
Shadowrun Play => Character creation and critique => Topic started by: 8-bit on <08-02-14/0326:59>
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Hello, I'm a fairly new Shadowrun player. I've never played any previous editions and my group just decided to start playing Shadowrun. I would really appreciate some help making my character more efficient and any advice that anyone can give me.
The obvious choice for Priority setups seems to be A for Resources, but I wanted to see if I could create an extremely skilled Rigger instead, so I set my priorities slightly differently, but I'm not sure how well it actually works out.
My current setup is: Metatype D (Human), Attributes C, Magic/Resonance E, Skills A, and Resources B.
Attributes:
Body 3
Agility 3
Reaction 4
Strength 1
Willpower 3
Logic 6
Intuition 3
Charisma 2 (Was 1, but upgraded with Karma)
Edge 5
Essence 4.55
Qualities:
Gearhead (-11 Karma), National SIN (+5 Karma), Allergy - Bees, Mild (+10 Karma), Weak Immune System (+10 Karma)
Skills:
Computer 6, Engineering 4, Gunnery 6 (+2 Ballistic), Pilot Aircraft 4, Pilot Groundcraft 4, Perception 6 (+2 Visual), Automatics 6, Electronic Warfare 6, First Aid 5 (+2 Gunshot Wounds), Con 5 (+2 Fast Talk), Athletics 1 (Bought with Karma), Navigation 1 (Bought with Karma), Armorer 1 (Bought with Karma), Sneaking 1 (Bought with Karma)
Knowledge Skills and Languages:
English N, Japanese 1, HTR - Street 4, Seattle City Streets - Street 4, Smugglers - Street 3
Augmentations:
Rating 1 Control Rig - Used (1.25 Essence) - 32,250 nuyen
Smartlink in Natural Eyes (.2 Essence) - 4,000 nuyen
Weapons:
2 Ares Crusader II's - 200 Regular Ammo, 100 Stick-n-Shock Ammo (Shared between the 2) - 2,860 nuyen
Ares Alpha - 100 Regular Ammo, 50 APDS Ammo - 3,450 nuyen
2 Concealable Quick-Draw Holsters - 550 nuyen
3 Spare Clips for each weapon - 45 nuyen
Gear:
Credsticks: 3 Silvers, 1 Gold - 160 nuyen, 1 Rating 6 Directional Jammers - 1,200 nuyen, 1 Rating 4 Fake SINs - 10,000 nuyen, Biomonitor - 300 nuyen, Micro-transceiver - 100 nuyen, Armor Jacket w/ Nonconductivity 4 - 2,000 nuyen, Renraku Sensei Commlink - 1,000 nuyen, Low Lifestyle (1 Month) - 2,000 nuyen, Capacity 4 Glasses w/ Image link, Flare Compensation, Vision Enhancement 2 - 1,675 nuyen
Rigger Gear:
Proteus Poseidon RCC - 68,000 nuyen
Programs: Browse, Encryption, Signal Scrub, Armor, Wrapper - 740 nuyen
Rating 4 Clearsight Autosoft - 2,000 nuyen
Rating 6 Ares Alpha Targeting Autosoft - 3,000 nuyen
Rover Model 2072 w/ Rigger Interface + Manual Operation + 1 Standard Weapon Mounts (AK-97 w/ 100 rounds of APDS Ammo) - 71,650 nuyen
3 MCT Fly-Spy Minidrones w/ Sensor Array Rating 3
Camera (Capacity 3 w/ Low-light, Flare Compensation, Vision Magnification), Camera (Capacity 3 w/ Thermographic, Flare Compensation, Vision Magnification), Laser Microphone (Capacity 2 w/ Select Sound Filter 2), Directional Microphone (Capacity 3 w/ Audio Enhancement 1, Select Sound Filter 2), Motion Sensor, Olfactory Sensor, Ultrasound, Radio Signal Scanner (Rating 3) - 20,250 nuyen
3 MCT-Nissan Roto-Drone w/ Standard Weapon Mount - Ares Alphas + Grenade Launcher + 100 APDS Round each +100 Stick n' Shock Round Each + 30 Flashbangs each + 30 Smoke Grenades each + 30 High Explosive Grenades each - 60,050 nuyen
Total Money: 287,000 nuyen (6 Karma spent) - 285,280 nuyen = 1,720 + (3d6 x 60) nuyen
Initiative: 7 + 1d6, Matrix (cold-sim): 8 + 3d6, Matrix (hot-sim): 8 + 4d6
Limits: Physical 3, Mental 6, Social 4
Karma Left: 4
Fixer (Specializes in Arms dealing): 6c/1l, Mechanic: 1c/6l
As a new Shadowrun player, I would greatly appreciate any and all criticism.
Edited on August 6 due to suggestions.
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Well, my first character for 5e was a rigger and I still have no clue how to build it 'right'. It seems that one of the best options is buying a swarm of rotodrones with sniper rifles and grenade launchers, a couple of spy drones and a van. And put sensors and jammers everywhere you can.
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You say you bought gymnastics, running, and swimming with karma, but did you spend 2 each (for 6 total) or 5 to buy the Athletics skill group?
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You say you bought gymnastics, running, and swimming with karma, but did you spend 2 each (for 6 total) or 5 to buy the Athletics skill group?
2 Each, I didn't realize the group was actually cheaper. I'll change the post to include the group, since it is cheaper. Thanks for pointing that out to me.
Well, my first character for 5e was a rigger and I still have no clue how to build it 'right'. It seems that one of the best options is buying a swarm of rotodrones with sniper rifles and grenade launchers, a couple of spy drones and a van. And put sensors and jammers everywhere you can.
Well, I guess there is no 'right' way to build a rigger, but I would assume some ways are better than others. I tried to keep my drone application fairly broad instead of all combat oriented, but your setup seems to be pretty interesting. I'll give it some thought.
I do have a question though. For the microdrones and minidrones, do I need to install sensor arrays for them to actually 'see' anything and provide information? I was under the impression they could do some undercover spying just on their own, but if they need sensor arrays to actually gather information, I may need to change some stuff around and rethink it a little bit.
Also, any advice on whether it's better to just stick to drones for combat, or to have a bunch of weapons of my own? My main reasoning was to make good use of the Firearms Skill Group, but maybe I don't need that much versatility with weapons and I can use it for something better, such as Outdoors or Stealth.
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8-bit
Vehicles and drones come with sensor arrays included.
Most vehicles and drones come factory-equipped with a sensor array (at a rating listed with their stats).
Drones under the current rules are very fragile. Even a light pistol stands a good chance of taking one out, which is why I've proposed a reworked set of rules to give riggers more options. You'll also find some common questions and suggestions you'll want to pose to your GM.
http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=17554.0
Feel free to take a look at a rigger I built for inspiration. I went the Control Rig route for substantial VR use, and essentially interface with the world entirely through drones. Not in any way "the" way to build a rigger, but he's worked out great for the game I'm playing him in currently.
http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=15964.0
I also wouldn't go for dual weapons on Roto-Drones; it doesn't really give you a benefit, and since Roto-Drones have paper mache for armor that's a lot of money potentially gone with a bullet or two.
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8-bit
Vehicles and drones come with sensor arrays included.
Most vehicles and drones come factory-equipped with a sensor array (at a rating listed with their stats).
Drones under the current rules are very fragile. Even a light pistol stands a good chance of taking one out, which is why I've proposed a reworked set of rules to give riggers more options. You'll also find some common questions and suggestions you'll want to pose to your GM.
http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=17554.0
Feel free to take a look at a rigger I built for inspiration. I went the Control Rig route for substantial VR use, and essentially interface with the world entirely through drones. Not in any way "the" way to build a rigger, but he's worked out great for the game I'm playing him in currently.
http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=15964.0
I also wouldn't go for dual weapons on Roto-Drones; it doesn't really give you a benefit, and since Roto-Drones have paper mache for armor that's a lot of money potentially gone with a bullet or two.
Looking back at p466 of SR5 is actually pretty disappointing. Most of the drones don't even have the defense pool of an Armor Vest with 1 Body, let alone an Armor Jacket which I think is pretty standard. Even the Steel Lynx has only a slightly better defense pool than your average metahuman with an Armor Jacket, but Bulky Dwarfs, Orks, and semi-bulky Trolls can get more dice and they can also get better armor. Well, this makes drones slightly less useful, since it's basically only an extra gun/super expensive distraction.
Anyways, thanks for the information about the sensor arrays, that is a relief that I don't have to spend extra there.
I took a look at your Rigger build, and I think it is an interesting concept, but I think I prefer to stay in the meatworld a little more. I can just control most combat drones with one Action Pass and use my meat body for extra attackers. I only really need to jump in if it's necessary, as going into VR on a mobile run is not always the safest thing to do.
Since you've pointed out that drones are so fragile, I am going to drop the Roto-Drone, as my only reasoning was for it was that it had two weapons to fire. What are your thoughts on the multiple weapons on the car? I feel like it's a serious enough investment with enough Armor and Body to keep. It probably won't stand up to anything designed to be Anti-Vehicle, but I feel like the car is useful enough to keep the weapons.
All right, a few more questions and then I'll finish this post. Do I need Electronic Warfare? From what I can tell, the only uses are Noise Reduction (Useful, but RCC gives Noise Reduction + Signal Scrub helps) and operating a Jammer (which I still can't figure out how it works, I thought you just used it and it provided Noise = to it's rating). What should I do with the extra money from getting rid of the Roto-Drone? I was thinking a) getting a few more Aztechknowledgy Crawlers fitted with Lethal guns, b) Some more spying drones + 1 Aztechknowledgy Crawler, c) More Jammers to help protect against hacking, or d) Some combination of the above. Finally, do I need to change my Priority System around? I really like the concept of having A for skills, since I can barely squeeze by with B for resources, but it seems like I can't get the 'best' out there and that I'm really limited unless I use some creativity.
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Since drones are so fragile I use them with long range weapons so that they stay away from gunfire.
Electronic warfare covers noise reduction, jamming and any and all sensor operation out there, including sensor targeting.
I think that rigger is better played a sort of secondary role. I play a combat medic and wheelman that happens to have a control rig, an RCC and some drones. Bring as much utility as you can.
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I don't see any major issues, I think ZB advice on drone survivability is spot on. I think you would probably want a fixer contact and an arms dealer contact.
I think the firearms skill group may lead the character into trouble. The character has a lot of guns, and some ok skill but lacks the rest of the package needed to be very survivable in person.
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Honestly i think juryrigger is a bit of a trap, sounds cool but not hugely beneficial in the long run. that karma would be better spent elsewhere tbh (couple ranks in a social skill would help you not auto-fail social skill tests for example). Given the lack of rules for armourer skill, i'd probably bump it down two ranks and take a spec in "firearms" to maintain the 6 dice. it frees up a skill rank which could get you a specialisation in "remote operation" for pilot air or a rank in Ewar (seems odd that a rigger wouldn't at least know the very basics of this skill).
Cybereyes are also a bit of a money sink for the benefits you get.
If you're going to be spending a lot of time piloting vehicles and drones then most of this stuff is just gathering dust.
I'd spec some basic glasses with image link/vision enhance/flare comp and leave it at that.
All the money you save here, put into your drone's sensor arrays.
its not explicit but every drone comes with a sensor array at a rating indicated by their stat-line.
each sensor array contains 8 sensors, you get to choose which ones are in by default. I'd personally go with a pair of cameras, laser mic, directional mic, motion sensor, olfactory as a base load-out and then buy low-light, vision mag, vision enhance etc for the cameras and some SSF for the microphones.
This makes them much more useful when spying on targets/facilities at night/at range/or in bad weather.
Just take the smartlink and implant it directly into your eye. its cheaper and less essence than the cybereye suite.
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Since drones are so fragile I use them with long range weapons so that they stay away from gunfire.
Electronic warfare covers noise reduction, jamming and any and all sensor operation out there, including sensor targeting.
I think that rigger is better played a sort of secondary role. I play a combat medic and wheelman that happens to have a control rig, an RCC and some drones. Bring as much utility as you can.
That's actually a good idea, I hadn't thought of that. Having the drones sort of be long range support fire seems reasonable. The only problem I have is, how am I going to get long range weapons? Unless you mean just Assault Rifles from a Long Distance (Which is a pretty heavy firing penalty, unless I'm missing something), then I need a Sniper Rifle, which you can only mount on a Heavy Weapon Mount. I cannot access Heavy Weapon Mounts (14F Availability) unless I get a Steel Lynx, which is a lot of money and I can probably only get one.
My goal was for this to be more utility, as I don't expect this character to dominate the battlefield (I'll leave that to combat Adepts and dedicated weapons specialists), but I did sort of want to hold my own in a fire fight. I think I might just tweak this character to provide more of a "drone overwatch" by just having microdrones scout out areas and watch our backs. I did also want him to be good at repairing anything that gets broken, which is why he has so many repair skills, but I'm not sure how useful that is on a run; that's more for after a run.
I don't see any major issues, I think ZB advice on drone survivability is spot on. I think you would probably want a fixer contact and an arms dealer contact.
I think the firearms skill group may lead the character into trouble. The character has a lot of guns, and some ok skill but lacks the rest of the package needed to be very survivable in person.
Thanks for the suggestions, I was thinking about a Fixer Contact only, since I have so little Karma, but I think I'll take Csjarrat's advice and drop Juryrigger for more karma for contacts. Something like a 5/2 Fixer and 6/1 Arms Dealer? Also, I think I'll change that firearms skill group, and maybe just go with Automatics for combat. That will free up some money and the skill group points. What should I place the skill group points in? I was thinking either Stealth, Outdoors, or maybe Biotech for some more utility.
Honestly i think juryrigger is a bit of a trap, sounds cool but not hugely beneficial in the long run. that karma would be better spent elsewhere tbh (couple ranks in a social skill would help you not auto-fail social skill tests for example). Given the lack of rules for armourer skill, i'd probably bump it down two ranks and take a spec in "firearms" to maintain the 6 dice. it frees up a skill rank which could get you a specialisation in "remote operation" for pilot air or a rank in Ewar (seems odd that a rigger wouldn't at least know the very basics of this skill).
Cybereyes are also a bit of a money sink for the benefits you get.
If you're going to be spending a lot of time piloting vehicles and drones then most of this stuff is just gathering dust.
I'd spec some basic glasses with image link/vision enhance/flare comp and leave it at that.
All the money you save here, put into your drone's sensor arrays.
its not explicit but every drone comes with a sensor array at a rating indicated by their stat-line.
each sensor array contains 8 sensors, you get to choose which ones are in by default. I'd personally go with a pair of cameras, laser mic, directional mic, motion sensor, olfactory as a base load-out and then buy low-light, vision mag, vision enhance etc for the cameras and some SSF for the microphones.
This makes them much more useful when spying on targets/facilities at night/at range/or in bad weather.
Just take the smartlink and implant it directly into your eye. its cheaper and less essence than the cybereye suite.
Thanks for the advice! Your comment on Juryrigger made me look back at its description, and I believe you are right; it really is not that useful to waste 10 karma on it.
The points in Armorer were for the idea that I can repair pretty much anything, but that doesn't help much when on a run. I'm thinking of dropping it to 3 or 2, getting that Remote Control specialization you mentioned, and maybe get Con at 2 or 3 (+2 Fast Talk)? I wasn't planning on really talking that much, I'm not gonna negotiate or intimidate anyone, but looking back at it, maybe some Social Skills are all right. The problem I see is that even with Con 3 + Fast Talk, I'm only getting 7 Dice. That's not likely to get me anywhere unless I spend some Edge, which would put it at 12 dice + Explosive dice.
Electronic Warfare seems to be something that everyone agrees I need at least 1 rank in, so I'll see how I am going to rearrange it. Can someone find the specific roll I make to operate a Jammer? I can't seem to find it, and the hits on any test there is don't seem to matter, as the Jammer just provides Noise = to it's rating, regardless of hits.
I was under the impression that I could command 2 drones per Action Pass through AR, so that's why I had the cybereyes for my "meat" body. However, I am thinking of dropping most of my personal weapons, which makes the expensive cybereyes somewhat less useful. I would still like to keep the smartlink in a pair of natural (or essence paid for) eyes, as the bonus is a little better. You mentioned putting a Smartlink right into your natural eye, but I can't seem to find that anywhere in SR5. Is it just getting the Smartlink upgrade from the cybereyes and paying for that? If you could reference the page for me, I would greatly appreciate it.
Upgrading the sensor arrays of the drones seems like a fantastic idea. Thank you so much for the suggestion, I'm glad to find my character can be improved upon and that I am learning some new things.
Thank you all for the advice and criticism, it really helped me a lot. I'll be updating the main post as soon as I can.
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Assault Rifle + Improved Range Finder = -3 Dice Pool Penalty out to 550m.
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The only problem I have is, how am I going to get long range weapons? Unless you mean just Assault Rifles from a Long Distance (Which is a pretty heavy firing penalty, unless I'm missing something), then I need a Sniper Rifle, which you can only mount on a Heavy Weapon Mount.
Actually, I think almost everybody here uses standard weapon mounts for sniper rifles. It is only logical, because they are not THAT big to be mounted on a heavy weapon mount. Sporting rifles and EBRs are roughly the size of an AR, sometimes an inch or two longer and the recoil is not that hard too. Gun H(e)aven 3 has some neat rifles, you might want to take a look.
About smartlink: page 454 has an 'Eyeware' table with smartlink stats. As you can see essence cost is there too, which means it can be installed directly into your meat eyes. You are only restricted from installing 'ware without an essence cost like cyberlimb enhancements.
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As for Sniper Rifles in Standard Weapon Mounts; clear it with your GM, don't count on it being allowed.
I've had it disallowed twice, which I'm quite frankly ok with. Just means you need to be a little bit closer.
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clear it with your GM
It is an answer for an almost every single question about the game ;) And it is a correct answer.
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Assault Rifle + Improved Range Finder = -3 Dice Pool Penalty out to 550m.
Wow, that is ... far to say the least. How often would you really be that far away though? Plus, Extreme range is unlikely, due to the fact that any other conditions would still bump it up to -6. I think I can get away without the range finders, since by the time I get a drone 150 meters away, I'll have a ton of Noise and other unpleasant things to deal with. If a drone is 150 meters away, is it too close? I would find it hard to believe that someone would target the drone 150 meters away as opposed to the humans in front of them. Thanks for pointing this out though, I'll take it into consideration.
The only problem I have is, how am I going to get long range weapons? Unless you mean just Assault Rifles from a Long Distance (Which is a pretty heavy firing penalty, unless I'm missing something), then I need a Sniper Rifle, which you can only mount on a Heavy Weapon Mount.
Actually, I think almost everybody here uses standard weapon mounts for sniper rifles. It is only logical, because they are not THAT big to be mounted on a heavy weapon mount. Sporting rifles and EBRs are roughly the size of an AR, sometimes an inch or two longer and the recoil is not that hard too. Gun H(e)aven 3 has some neat rifles, you might want to take a look.
About smartlink: page 454 has an 'Eyeware' table with smartlink stats. As you can see essence cost is there too, which means it can be installed directly into your meat eyes. You are only restricted from installing 'ware without an essence cost like cyberlimb enhancements.
Page 461 of SR5: "Vehicles may be equipped with a number of weapon mounts equal to their unaugmented Body ÷ 3 (round down). Standard weapon mounts may hold any assault rifle or smaller-sized weapon and 250 rounds of ammo. Heavy weapon mounts count as two weapon mounts and can hold any weapon and up to 500 rounds of belted ammo or up to Body rockets/missiles. All weapon mounts are operated remotely and can target a ninety-degree arc of fire (horizontal and vertical)."
Standard Mounts cannot hold Sniper Rifles unless I get permission from my GM, but as I've decided from above, I don't think I'll need 800 - 1,500 meters in range. 150 seems more than enough. I would rather have something that I know will be allowed through the rules than have to rely on permission from my GM and not get it, which would mean I would have to start over.
Thanks for clarifying that bit with the Smartlink installed in a Natural eye. I wasn't sure if that was how it worked, so I didn't include it yet. Thanks again everyone for the help, I'll be finishing this round of changes very soon.
After making changes, I have some leftover cash and karma. Is there anything anyone can think of that I'm missing? Again, I would like to thank everyone who helped me out already. Any suggestions are welcome.
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Don't underestimate shooting through walls. A drone armed with a sufficiently powerful weapon can fairly easily penetrate two or three walls from the exterior of a building, which pairs well with using sensor targeting to lock on to targets your recon drones find.
Also, take a look at the Stolen Souls book; Cyberspace Designs Dragonfly drones can carry a single dose of drugs or toxins, meaning you can inject a target with Narcojet (or other unpleasant stuff) fairly stealthily.
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Don't underestimate shooting through walls. A drone armed with a sufficiently powerful weapon can fairly easily penetrate two or three walls from the exterior of a building, which pairs well with using sensor targeting to lock on to targets your recon drones find.
Also, take a look at the Stolen Souls book; Cyberspace Designs Dragonfly drones can carry a single dose of drugs or toxins, meaning you can inject a target with Narcojet (or other unpleasant stuff) fairly stealthily.
What would you consider a sufficiently powerful weapon? I understand a Sniper Rifle is very powerful, but that needs special permission. Is an AK-97 a strong enough Assault Rifle? I could go up to 350 meters with only a -3 penalty (barring no other conditions) and I think APDS Rounds can pierce through walls, although I am not super familiar with all the rules. I still think 350 meters is a ridiculous range, that's about 1/5 of a mile.
Looks like I need to go out and buy some books. I don't have many books (Just SR5, Run & Gun, and Street Grimoire), but I'm interested enough in this game to invest in it. That Dragonfly Drone sounds interesting.
Can someone confirm I didn't mess something up with the Sensor Arrays? It's my first time doing this, and I don't want to be accidentally breaking rules.
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anything with a damage code over about 11 is good enough to be shooting through standard interior walls. most assault rifles/sports rifles/high end shotguns/sniper rifles are capable of that and yes, APDS helps too.
the crockett EBR makes for a good drone weapon given its long range, large clip and decent damage/penetration stats.
EDIT: just seen your comment about con 3 and smart talk spec, that looks good. you can't rely on the face being around all the time, and to be fair, having the skill allows you to complement his rolls with a teamwork test.
Imagine you're staking out a target for recon while the team are doing other things or are in different locations.
GM decides a traffic cop notices you've overstayed your parking allocation and comes to ask you what you're doing.
with CHA 2 and no skill ranks, you roll one dice at a maximum (there are lots of -ve mods for social tests) with a 1/3rd chance of getting a hit.
with the skill ranks and edge, you now stand a pretty reasonable chance of convincing him you're not up to no good, thus saving your ass and the mission.
A good char should have at least a couple ranks in a social skill for those "oh crap" moments, yours is much better for having that now.
You've got the right idea with the sensor suites but just beware that the sensor suite rating is limited by the size of the drone (check the sensor housing listing)
most light drones are capped at sensor rating 3 (which combines with the control rig 2 to give a limit of 5 to perception tests +/- whatever vision or audio enhance you have on there too).
larger drones like the steel lynx can take larger sensor suites, meaning the sensors within them have higher capacity.
a rating 3 sensor array contains upto 8 sensors with 3 capacity iirc
so your suite could look something like:
camera: image link, low light, flare comp
camera: Thermo, vision mag, vision enhance 1
directional mic: SSF 3
laser mic: SSF 3
omni-directional mic: spatial recogniser, audio enhance 1
motion sensor
olfactory sensor
laser range finder
this would be legal (if i've remembered the avail ratings correctly lol!)
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Plus, Extreme range is unlikely, due to the fact that any other conditions would still bump it up to -6.
That is true if you are jumped in. You can just 'send message' to your drone's pilot program to command it to attack a target. It can act autonomously.
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anything with a damage code over about 11 is good enough to be shooting through standard interior walls. most assault rifles/sports rifles/high end shotguns/sniper rifles are capable of that and yes, APDS helps too.
the crockett EBR makes for a good drone weapon given its long range, large clip and decent damage/penetration stats.
EDIT: just seen your comment about con 3 and smart talk spec, that looks good. you can't rely on the face being around all the time, and to be fair, having the skill allows you to complement his rolls with a teamwork test.
Imagine you're staking out a target for recon while the team are doing other things or are in different locations.
GM decides a traffic cop notices you've overstayed your parking allocation and comes to ask you what you're doing.
with CHA 2 and no skill ranks, you roll one dice at a maximum (there are lots of -ve mods for social tests) with a 1/3rd chance of getting a hit.
with the skill ranks and edge, you now stand a pretty reasonable chance of convincing him you're not up to no good, thus saving your ass and the mission.
A good char should have at least a couple ranks in a social skill for those "oh crap" moments, yours is much better for having that now.
You've got the right idea with the sensor suites but just beware that the sensor suite rating is limited by the size of the drone (check the sensor housing listing)
most light drones are capped at sensor rating 3 (which combines with the control rig 2 to give a limit of 5 to perception tests +/- whatever vision or audio enhance you have on there too).
larger drones like the steel lynx can take larger sensor suites, meaning the sensors within them have higher capacity.
a rating 3 sensor array contains upto 8 sensors with 3 capacity iirc
so your suite could look something like:
camera: image link, low light, flare comp
camera: Thermo, vision mag, vision enhance 1
directional mic: SSF 3
laser mic: SSF 3
omni-directional mic: spatial recogniser, audio enhance 1
motion sensor
olfactory sensor
laser range finder
this would be legal (if i've remembered the avail ratings correctly lol!)
Unfortunately, sniper rifles require a Heavy Weapons Mount (14F Availability), so I can't use them. Thanks for clarifying that bit about the sensor suites, I'll have to rearrange them to make sure it's all legal and everything. It won't be as badass as I would like it to be, but at least it will be cheaper and still useful. I'll make those changes later, or maybe tomorrow, as I have to go rather soon and won't be near a computer.
Plus, Extreme range is unlikely, due to the fact that any other conditions would still bump it up to -6.
That is true if you are jumped in. You can just 'send message' to your drone's pilot program to command it to attack a target. It can act autonomously.
If you're not in VR, can you still 'send message' to the drone's pilot program? I would assume through AR and a commlink that it's possible. Also, does the smartlink in the natural eye (not part of a cybereye) still have the wireless bonus? If it doesn't, that seems to sort of defeat the purpose of having a smartlink, I'll just put it into the glasses.
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You can send message via your console or commlink even in meatspace. If you have a datajack (or in your case - a control rig) then you have wireless for your smartlink.
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Steel lynx comes with a heavy mount and a couple of vehicles do as well so it's not totally out of reach. Remember you can also stick Underbarrel grenade launchers on drone guns for some extra bang bang or smoke coverage
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Thanks for the suggestions, I was thinking about a Fixer Contact only, since I have so little Karma, but I think I'll take Csjarrat's advice and drop Juryrigger for more karma for contacts. Something like a 5/2 Fixer and 6/1 Arms Dealer? Also, I think I'll change that firearms skill group, and maybe just go with Automatics for combat. That will free up some money and the skill group points. What should I place the skill group points in? I was thinking either Stealth, Outdoors, or maybe Biotech for some more utility.
I'd go 3/3, 4/2, or 2/4. Automatics is a good choice, nice and flexible, Biotech seems wise to me.
Assault Rifles come in a lot flavors across even in an edition as new as 5th, Assault rifles are general the standard mount on rotor type drones, their range isn't sniper range buts its plenty good for most situations, as Martinchaen pointed out. Take a look around, the books and I'm sure you can find ones that will fit your needs.
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Attributes:
Body 3
Agility 3
Reaction 6
Strength 2 (Was 1, but upgraded with Karma)
Willpower 3
Logic 3
Intuition 3
Charisma 2
Edge 5
Essence 3.3
I'd look into dropping STR & CHA back to 1, and use that karma to raise CHA from 1 to 2. The free'd up point then goes into Logic
I'd also look into Logic-6 & Reaction-4, a good VCR is going to make your Piloting tests easy to pass. Better to put those points into all your many Logic based skills.
Skills:
Engineering 6, Biotech 4, Gunnery 6, Pilot Aircraft 6 (+2 Remote Control), Pilot Walker 6, Pilot Groundcraft 6 (+2 Wheeled - Which I assume includes Cars), Perception 6 (+2 Visual), Navigation 6, Automatics 3, Con 3 (+2 Fast Talk), Electronic Warfare 1 (Bought with Karma), Athletics 1 (Bought with Karma)
I think your overskilled in Piloting sypes & not enough in other skills that you have to have as a Rigger as well.
Electronic Warfare, & Computer to start.
14 Piloting dice, likely needing 2 successes for very hard moves. You have over invested in that area.
I'd go something like this.
Electronics Group-6, Engineering Group-4
Automatics-6
Electronic Warfare-6
Etiquette-6
First Aid-6
Gunnery-6-Ballistic+2
Perception-6-Visual+2
Piloting Aircraft-4
Piloting Ground Craft-4
Stealth Group-1
Armorer-1
Navigation-1
Knowledge Skills and Languages:
English N, Japanese 1, Aircraft - Interests 4, Groundcraft - Interests 4 (If these two are too broad I can change to Jets and Cars), Fixers - Street 3
IIRC in 5E its said that your Active Skills have attached Knowlege checks to them. And you don't need to know about fixers, just have one.
So I'd drop both those Air/Ground/Fixers skills for stuff that you need. Area Knowledge of your town, Smuggling Knowledge, Security Procedures, etc etc.
Augmentations:
Rating 2 Control Rig - Used (2.5 Essence) - 72,750 nuyen
Smartlink in Natural Eyes (.2 Essence) - 4,000 nuyen
If you do the swap of Log/Rea I metioned above, then some Reaction Enhancers would go a long way here.
Being Human I'd also look into some full on Cybereyes-2 & give them all the bells & whistles.
Gear:
Credsticks: 3 Silvers, 1 Gold - 160 nuyen, 1 Rating 6 Directional Jammers - 1,200 nuyen, 1 Rating 4 Fake SINs - 10,000 nuyen, Biomonitor - 300 nuyen, Micro-transceiver - 100 nuyen, Armor Jacket w/ Nonconductivity 4 - 2,000 nuyen, Meta Link Commlink - 100 nuyen, Low Lifestyle (1 Month) - 2,000 nuyen, Capacity 4 Glasses w/ Image link, Flare Compensation, Vision Enhancement 2 - 1,675 nuyen
Priority-B Cash & you bought the lowest grade Commlink ? No, just No.
Rigger Gear:
Proteus Poseidon RCC - 68,000 nuyen
Programs: Encryption, Signal Scrub, Armor, Wrapper - 660 nuyen
Rating 4 Clearsight Autosoft - 2,000 nuyen
Rover Model 2072 w/ Rigger Interface + Manual Operation + 1 Standard Weapon Mounts (AK-97 w/ 100 rounds of APDS Ammo) - 71,650 nuyen
2 Shiawase Kanmushi Microdrones w/ Sensor Array Rating 6
2 MCT Fly-Spy Minidrones w/ Sensor Array Rating 6
2 Aztechknowledgy Crawler Small Drones w/ 1 Standard Weapon Mount (AK-97s w/ 100 rounds of APDS Ammo) - 17,300 nuyen
No Rotodrones ? I'd invest in way more Aircraft than you have. Drop the Crawlers & get something that flys.
Total Money: 295,000 nuyen (10 Karma spent) - 294,400 nuyen = 800 + (3d6 x 60) nuyen
Fixer: 5c/2l, Arms Dealer: 6c/1l
Make your Fixer a specialist in Arms (6/1 or 5/2) and it shouldn't be at issue to then have a solid Mechanic (1/4) - Every Rigger needs a Mechanic Contact.
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You can send message via your console or commlink even in meatspace. If you have a datajack (or in your case - a control rig) then you have wireless for your smartlink.
Thank you, that answered my question.
Steel lynx comes with a heavy mount and a couple of vehicles do as well so it's not totally out of reach. Remember you can also stick Underbarrel grenade launchers on drone guns for some extra bang bang or smoke coverage
I'm not exactly overflowing with cash, as my idea for a Super Skilled Pilot only leaves me with Priority B for Resources. The underbarrel launchers sound interesting, I'll ponder that for a bit. I still have yet to figure out the sensor thing, I am a little busy at the moment, but it's on my list for this character.
Thanks for the suggestions, I was thinking about a Fixer Contact only, since I have so little Karma, but I think I'll take Csjarrat's advice and drop Juryrigger for more karma for contacts. Something like a 5/2 Fixer and 6/1 Arms Dealer? Also, I think I'll change that firearms skill group, and maybe just go with Automatics for combat. That will free up some money and the skill group points. What should I place the skill group points in? I was thinking either Stealth, Outdoors, or maybe Biotech for some more utility.
I'd go 3/3, 4/2, or 2/4. Automatics is a good choice, nice and flexible, Biotech seems wise to me.
Assault Rifles come in a lot flavors across even in an edition as new as 5th, Assault rifles are general the standard mount on rotor type drones, their range isn't sniper range buts its plenty good for most situations, as Martinchaen pointed out. Take a look around, the books and I'm sure you can find ones that will fit your needs.
Is that setup Loyalty/Connection, or Connection/Loyalty? I figure I can dump most of my stuff into connection, as it's better to be able to get the gear I need then for them to actually care that much about me. I know it's dangerous dealing business with them, but I would probably have to go to them anyways to get the higher end stuff.
I'd look into dropping STR & CHA back to 1, and use that karma to raise CHA from 1 to 2. The free'd up point then goes into Logic
I'd also look into Logic-6 & Reaction-4, a good VCR is going to make your Piloting tests easy to pass. Better to put those points into all your many Logic based skills.
I think your overskilled in Piloting sypes & not enough in other skills that you have to have as a Rigger as well.
Electronic Warfare, & Computer to start.
14 Piloting dice, likely needing 2 successes for very hard moves. You have over invested in that area.
I'd go something like this.
Electronics Group-6, Engineering Group-4
Automatics-6
Electronic Warfare-6
Etiquette-6
First Aid-6
Gunnery-6-Ballistic+2
Perception-6-Visual+2
Piloting Aircraft-4
Piloting Ground Craft-4
Stealth Group-1
Armorer-1
Navigation-1
IIRC in 5E its said that your Active Skills have attached Knowlege checks to them. And you don't need to know about fixers, just have one.
So I'd drop both those Air/Ground/Fixers skills for stuff that you need. Area Knowledge of your town, Smuggling Knowledge, Security Procedures, etc etc.
If you do the swap of Log/Rea I metioned above, then some Reaction Enhancers would go a long way here.
Being Human I'd also look into some full on Cybereyes-2 & give them all the bells & whistles.
Priority-B Cash & you bought the lowest grade Commlink ? No, just No.
No Rotodrones ? I'd invest in way more Aircraft than you have. Drop the Crawlers & get something that flys.
Make your Fixer a specialist in Arms (6/1 or 5/2) and it shouldn't be at issue to then have a solid Mechanic (1/4) - Every Rigger needs a Mechanic Contact.
The Str & Cha is a good point, as I don't really need them to be that high. My only concern is that have 1 Strength makes me useless for any carrying or running purposes, and that Charisma 1 doesn't give me extra contact points, since upgrading it to 2 is technically after picking out contacts. Is Logic really better than Reaction? I guess the real question is how difficult is piloting? I wanted to make a seriously badass pilot who can perform really complex maneuvers, but if I only need 2 successes, then I probably don't need that many dice.
Not that I'm saying your wrong, but why Electronics 6? I would rather just have Hardware 6 for repairs, what is Computer and Software used for as a Rigger? I just want to know. As an extremely inexperienced Shadowrun player, what does the Ballistic specialization cover? Etiquette? I mean, I see the point of it, but I would rather have Con (+2 Fast Talk) to be able to get out of situations. Where is the Athletics group? I don't plan on being in VR all the time, what if I need to run? Or jump, or swim to save my life? Is Navigation really not that important? I thought it would be, but it might not. I'm not saying your changes are bad, I'm just curious for some explanations.
The Knowledge skill stuff is a good catch, I completely forgot about that. Thanks for pointing that out.
If I do the swap, I don't have money for Reaction Enhancers. I literally have 800 nuyen leftover (well, I gotta redo sensor arrays, but it shouldn't be much more than that) and I don't even have any mega combat drones, most of my stuff is barely equipped. I couldn't afford Used Rating 1 Reaction Enhancers if I wanted to. So, the swap is still something I will consider, but I don't think the Enhancers are gonna make it.
What do you suggest for a commlink? Mine is basically a throwaway only used to communicate with my team. Do I need something better? Keep in mind my money situation is very tight.
I originally had a Rotodrone, but as it has been pointed out earlier in this thread, drones are extremely fragile. So, I'm reluctant to invest a lot of money into more guns and more expensive drones for something that can be taken out super easily. I'm fine with Dropping the Crawlers, but what do you suggest I replace them with? I like the idea of flying drones, but I'm just not seeing any alternatives that are amazing for combat. The Optic X-2 seems to be rather limited with its maneuverability, as it can't just backup, it has to turn around, and it can't hover, it has to keep moving forward. Same with the Cyberspace Designs Dalmation. Really the only alternative is a Rotodrone, which just seems to serve the exact same purpose as the Crawlers while being more expensive. If I'm missing something, feel free to tell me, as I am extremely new to this game.
The Fixer suggestion seems reasonable, as does the Mechanic. I'm assuming you use Connection/Loyalty, so what are your opinions on giving the Mechanic more Connection? I understand the Loyalty part, but does he/she need to ability to get more advanced parts, or is working out of a garage good enough for repairs? I would greatly appreciate your knowledge.
Overall, I don't see too much of a problem with your changes, and the ones I do have a problem with may just be because I am inexperienced at Shadowrun. I won't change anything on the front page yet, but I'll take your suggestions into consideration. I am eager to read your reply.
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tbh, your RCC will do everything a commlink does and it'll do it better thanks to cyberprograms like browse and edit.
its just huge (briefcase) whereas a comm is a smartphone sized thing.
an all singing-all dancing commlink is handy, but not essential for your archetype if you've got a high-end RCC anyways. when you're on-the-job you'll be in the matrix via your RCC so wont need the commlink for message sending.
off-the-job, a reasonable spec commlink as a day-to-day, browse the web kind of thing would be do-able.
for combat mate, rotodrones are ok. just accept that you'll lose them and move on. they're cheap enough that you can take 3-4. stick the 500NY assault rifle on there with a 125NY laser sight on it and get decent targeting/manuever autosofts on the RCC. have them fly about and lay down suppressive fire and they'll cause all sorts of issues for your enemies (they'll have similar dicepools to most mooks). they're cheap enough to repair yourself or just buy new when they get shot up.
Only combat drone worth spending money on is the steel lynx, and even then, a moderately equipped HTR team can take it out so you'll need to be good with a wrench or be really good friends with someone who is.
computer is great for matrix perception checks, matrix searches and probably a few other things that slip my mind. software is only useful for dealing with databombs, so doesn't help a rigger too much.
hardware is nifty for cracking maglock and security camera cases or repairing/upgrading electronics like RCC's/decks/goggles etc.
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I fixed the Sensor Arrays, changed up the Active and Knowledge skills, changed up the contacts, added a better commlink, added a targeting autosoft, and replaced the Aztechknowledgy Crawlers with MCT-Nissan Roto-drones.
About the only thing I don't like is that my Strength is really low, and my Physical limit is almost nonexistent. However, that is not as important as the improvements that have been made.
I am now completely out of karma and still nearly dead broke, but I think your guys suggestions have really improved my character. I would like to thank everyone who has posted advice in this thread, it has helped me a lot!
tbh, your RCC will do everything a commlink does and it'll do it better thanks to cyberprograms like browse and edit.
its just huge (briefcase) whereas a comm is a smartphone sized thing.
an all singing-all dancing commlink is handy, but not essential for your archetype if you've got a high-end RCC anyways. when you're on-the-job you'll be in the matrix via your RCC so wont need the commlink for message sending.
off-the-job, a reasonable spec commlink as a day-to-day, browse the web kind of thing would be do-able.
for combat mate, rotodrones are ok. just accept that you'll lose them and move on. they're cheap enough that you can take 3-4. stick the 500NY assault rifle on there with a 125NY laser sight on it and get decent targeting/manuever autosofts on the RCC. have them fly about and lay down suppressive fire and they'll cause all sorts of issues for your enemies (they'll have similar dicepools to most mooks). they're cheap enough to repair yourself or just buy new when they get shot up.
Only combat drone worth spending money on is the steel lynx, and even then, a moderately equipped HTR team can take it out so you'll need to be good with a wrench or be really good friends with someone who is.
computer is great for matrix perception checks, matrix searches and probably a few other things that slip my mind. software is only useful for dealing with databombs, so doesn't help a rigger too much.
hardware is nifty for cracking maglock and security camera cases or repairing/upgrading electronics like RCC's/decks/goggles etc.
The RCC is that large? I was under the impression the majority of it was inside your head, in fact I thought nearly everything was implanted inside your head. I also though a commlink was much smaller, as you can implant it in weapons, or hide it under your sleeve, or put it just about anywhere. I might be wrong.
I took your advice on the drones, and although it is not exactly what I want, it's probably the best I'll get with my limited supply of money. I also appreciate your explanation of the uses of Hardware and Computer, you have definitely convinced me that they are useful. Thank you for the help.
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Control rig=implant that hooks up your motor cortex to vehicle
RCC=broadcast equipment that controls drones and runs autosofts
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Control rig=implant that hooks up your motor cortex to vehicle
RCC=broadcast equipment that controls drones and runs autosofts
Oh, right. I always get those two mixed up. I guess because you need both as a Rigger anyways.
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The Str & Cha is a good point, as I don't really need them to be that high. My only concern is that have 1 Strength makes me useless for any carrying or running purposes, and that Charisma 1 doesn't give me extra contact points, since upgrading it to 2 is technically after picking out contacts. Is Logic really better than Reaction? I guess the real question is how difficult is piloting? I wanted to make a seriously badass pilot who can perform really complex maneuvers, but if I only need 2 successes, then I probably don't need that many dice.
Not sure on that Cha thing, Don't believe its been said that you loose the Contacts if its raised in the final stage of CharGen.
what does the Ballistic specialization cover? Etiquette? I mean, I see the point of it, but I would rather have Con (+2 Fast Talk) to be able to get out of situations. Where is the Athletics group? I don't plan on being in VR all the time, what if I need to run? Or jump, or swim to save my life? Is Navigation really not that important? I thought it would be, but it might not. I'm not saying your changes are bad, I'm just curious for some explanations.
CS covered the Electronics issue.
Ballistics pretty much covers nearly all weapons. I mean, not Missile Launchers I don't think. But all your "guns"
Well at 7 Dice I really didn't feel you were "conning" anyone. Where as Etiquette helps you fit in, not stand out, so that you hopefully don't need to Con in the first place.
I dropped Athletics for Stealth. You can change it. But I thought not getting caught/needing to run, was more important than after the fact getting running. That said, both are things you can buy with karma as you grow.
If I do the swap, I don't have money for Reaction Enhancers. I literally have 800 nuyen leftover (well, I gotta redo sensor arrays, but it shouldn't be much more than that) and I don't even have any mega combat drones, most of my stuff is barely equipped. I couldn't afford Used Rating 1 Reaction Enhancers if I wanted to. So, the swap is still something I will consider, but I don't think the Enhancers are gonna make it.
I'm not at my book, but, maybe drop VCR down to R1. I'm not a Rigger, but from what I've read on the threshold reduction. I'd never get R3 VCR any more & even R2 is going to make most stuff really easy. Basically unless your Rigging is repeatedly doing stuff out of a Transformers or Fast & Furious movie, I think your safe for the typical high speed engagement.
What do you suggest for a commlink? Mine is basically a throwaway only used to communicate with my team. Do I need something better? Keep in mind my money situation is very tight.
Personally, I'm a fan of the Hermes Ikon. Solid quality w/o the Price of the Avalon or Fairlight. And more than good enough for all the times you don't have your RCC lugging along w/ you.
I originally had a Rotodrone, but as it has been pointed out earlier in this thread, drones are extremely fragile. So, I'm reluctant to invest a lot of money into more guns and more expensive drones for something that can be taken out super easily. I'm fine with Dropping the Crawlers, but what do you suggest I replace them with? I like the idea of flying drones, but I'm just not seeing any alternatives that are amazing for combat. The Optic X-2 seems to be rather limited with its maneuverability, as it can't just backup, it has to turn around, and it can't hover, it has to keep moving forward. Same with the Cyberspace Designs Dalmation. Really the only alternative is a Rotodrone, which just seems to serve the exact same purpose as the Crawlers while being more expensive. If I'm missing something, feel free to tell me, as I am extremely new to this game.
IMHO w/ Repair Costs & Combat Firepower, NO drone is good at combat. Seriously, even the Steel Lynx is wounded or destroyed with a couple guys focusing on it. So IMHO. You want drones that can retreat quickly & get there by stealth. So the Roto for me is solid. Buy up 2-4 of them & use them at Long/Extreme ranges for suppressive fire from AR's, Smoke/Booms from GL's, and Silenced direct fire from Sniper Rifles. 2 Roto's w/ Remingtons w/ Silencers & 2 Rotos with Alphas is all the firepower you'll ever need IMHO. And 1-3 is all you'll need at Char-Gen.
The Fixer suggestion seems reasonable, as does the Mechanic. I'm assuming you use Connection/Loyalty, so what are your opinions on giving the Mechanic more Connection? I understand the Loyalty part, but does he/she need to ability to get more advanced parts, or is working out of a garage good enough for repairs? I would greatly appreciate your knowledge.
For the Mechanic my concern was Loyalty = Price Break on Repairs. I'm less concerned about him being able to acquire me a Gauss Rifle and more concerned about him cutting me a deal on repair costs which in SR5E are through the roof. But that is just my opinion.
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Not sure on that Cha thing, Don't believe its been said that you loose the Contacts if its raised in the final stage of CharGen.
CS covered the Electronics issue.
Ballistics pretty much covers nearly all weapons. I mean, not Missile Launchers I don't think. But all your "guns"
Well at 7 Dice I really didn't feel you were "conning" anyone. Where as Etiquette helps you fit in, not stand out, so that you hopefully don't need to Con in the first place.
I dropped Athletics for Stealth. You can change it. But I thought not getting caught/needing to run, was more important than after the fact getting running. That said, both are things you can buy with karma as you grow.
I'm not at my book, but, maybe drop VCR down to R1. I'm not a Rigger, but from what I've read on the threshold reduction. I'd never get R3 VCR any more & even R2 is going to make most stuff really easy. Basically unless your Rigging is repeatedly doing stuff out of a Transformers or Fast & Furious movie, I think your safe for the typical high speed engagement.
Personally, I'm a fan of the Hermes Ikon. Solid quality w/o the Price of the Avalon or Fairlight. And more than good enough for all the times you don't have your RCC lugging along w/ you.
IMHO w/ Repair Costs & Combat Firepower, NO drone is good at combat. Seriously, even the Steel Lynx is wounded or destroyed with a couple guys focusing on it. So IMHO. You want drones that can retreat quickly & get there by stealth. So the Roto for me is solid. Buy up 2-4 of them & use them at Long/Extreme ranges for suppressive fire from AR's, Smoke/Booms from GL's, and Silenced direct fire from Sniper Rifles. 2 Roto's w/ Remingtons w/ Silencers & 2 Rotos with Alphas is all the firepower you'll ever need IMHO. And 1-3 is all you'll need at Char-Gen.
For the Mechanic my concern was Loyalty = Price Break on Repairs. I'm less concerned about him being able to acquire me a Gauss Rifle and more concerned about him cutting me a deal on repair costs which in SR5E are through the roof. But that is just my opinion.
I treated it as if the Charisma change didn't affect anything.
Thanks for the explanation on Ballistics, that makes sense. I can see your point about Etiquette, but I'll pull one of Csjarrat's examples:
GM decides a traffic cop notices you've overstayed your parking allocation and comes to ask you what you're doing.
with CHA 2 and no skill ranks, you roll one dice at a maximum (there are lots of -ve mods for social tests) with a 1/3rd chance of getting a hit.
with the skill ranks and edge, you now stand a pretty reasonable chance of convincing him you're not up to no good, thus saving your ass and the mission.
I'm just not seeing where Etiquette helps me there, as I think its better to be able to lie my ass off about my big Van with a bunch of weapons in it than being able to fit in. The Con check is also meant to be used with Edge (Which might be naive, but I feel like 5 edge means I can spend one to push the limit on a test), so currently I'm rolling 12 dice + Explosive 6s. So, although I like your suggestion of Etiquette, I feel like Con is a little more useful for getting out of sticky situations. The point about Athletics and Stealth makes sense, although I don't think I'm sneaking past much with 4 dice and a limit of 3. Better something than nothing I guess. You're right about being able to upgrade later, I don't have to get everything right away.
I guess your right about the Control Rig, but my inspiration for an ace pilot of any craft came from this story (Hopefully I'm not breaking any rules): http://www.shadowruntabletop.com/fiction/redeye-flight/
To me, that is seriously badass how she pilots, and I just love the idea of doing the most out of the world maneuvers without even having to think about it.
I went with the Renraku Sensei due to money problems. I can always buy a better one later.
That is actually a pretty awesome idea for the drones. I can already picture the amount of mayhem those would cause. I need to go back and look at the numbers, but I'll see what I can do to fit them in.
I understand that Loyalty = price breaks, but are there parts that a Connection 1 contact can't get? I don't need weapons or anything from the Mechanic, it's more of "does he/she have the tools and parts available to repair my broken stuff". If that isn't a problem, then I might as well dump all the points into loyalty.
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I guess your right about the Control Rig, but my inspiration for an ace pilot of any craft came from this story (Hopefully I'm not breaking any rules): http://www.shadowruntabletop.com/fiction/redeye-flight/
To me, that is seriously badass how she pilots, and I just love the idea of doing the most out of the world maneuvers without even having to think about it.
I went with the Renraku Sensei due to money problems. I can always buy a better one later.
I understand that Loyalty = price breaks, but are there parts that a Connection 1 contact can't get? I don't need weapons or anything from the Mechanic, it's more of "does he/she have the tools and parts available to repair my broken stuff". If that isn't a problem, then I might as well dump all the points into loyalty.
Here's how I look at the VCR & your Cash.
Your talking about 1/4 ? Of your starting funds. Allocated, basically, to reducing a "hard" maneuver from 2 Hits to 1 Hit needed. And reducing EXTREME maneuvers from 3 Hits to 2 Needed. 9 Dice is going to average 3 Hits.
Not counting your Edge, I think your still in shape to pull most moves out fairly easily. You just might need edge to save your bacon in a combo of highly dangerous move + bad dice rolling comes into play. Which shouldn't be more than once a mission or so, in most cases.
Again, that is based on my minimal understanding of the VCR in 5E as I'm currently playing a magic user. But I have read up on the section a little.
IMHO, I'd shoot for VCR-1 now, grade dependent on cash for other options........... And then shoot for a VCR-2-Alpha/Beta/Delta as a long term goal.
Sensei? Is that the L3 one for 1K. That is my next favorite one at Char-Gen after the Ikon.
For for the parts/contact. If you were asking him to repair a Helo or Tank or something w/ an Assault Cannon mounted on it. Then sure, maybe Connection is going to come into play. But the NPC is a Mechanic. He should have a full repair shop. Basic/Upgrade car parts shouldn't be an issue at all. Even Drones have to be pretty common at repair shops in 2075.
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Here's how I look at the VCR & your Cash.
Your talking about 1/4 ? Of your starting funds. Allocated, basically, to reducing a "hard" maneuver from 2 Hits to 1 Hit needed. And reducing EXTREME maneuvers from 3 Hits to 2 Needed. 9 Dice is going to average 3 Hits.
Not counting your Edge, I think your still in shape to pull most moves out fairly easily. You just might need edge to save your bacon in a combo of highly dangerous move + bad dice rolling comes into play. Which shouldn't be more than once a mission or so, in most cases.
Again, that is based on my minimal understanding of the VCR in 5E as I'm currently playing a magic user. But I have read up on the section a little.
IMHO, I'd shoot for VCR-1 now, grade dependent on cash for other options........... And then shoot for a VCR-2-Alpha/Beta/Delta as a long term goal.
Sensei? Is that the L3 one for 1K. That is my next favorite one at Char-Gen after the Ikon.
For for the parts/contact. If you were asking him to repair a Helo or Tank or something w/ an Assault Cannon mounted on it. Then sure, maybe Connection is going to come into play. But the NPC is a Mechanic. He should have a full repair shop. Basic/Upgrade car parts shouldn't be an issue at all. Even Drones have to be pretty common at repair shops in 2075.
Page 45 of SR5: Thresholds table: Easy - 1, Average - 2, Hard - 4, Very Hard - 6, Extreme - 8-10. That means my rating 2 rig makes Hard tests a threshold of 2, and Extreme tests anywhere from 6-8 hits needed. Not that that isn't strong, it is, since the possibility of having an Extreme test is very unlikely, but a rating 1 rig makes even Hard tests 3 hits still. Unless I'm interpreting it wrong and most vehicle tests don't even come close to Extreme on the scale, it still can be fairly difficult.
Another things on page 266 of SR5: "When you’re jumped into a vehicle, drone, or other device, the limits of that device are increased by the rating of your control rig. This includes vehicle and drone Sensor, Speed, and Handling, and the Accuracy of mounted weapons when used by the rigger. The control rig also connects more smoothly through an RCC when operating in VR." Seems pretty beneficial to me, but I should point out that I have never been in a Shadowrun game ever, so maybe those stats are already high enough. That section also only relates to jumping into vehicles, not just giving them commands, so that is another thing.
However, your point is sound, and I think I probably will drop it, if I need the money. It actually constitutes about 1/3 of my money, but I want to see what else I can rearrange first, and if I need excess cash, then I will lower it to rating 1, since it does give me about 40k more nuyen.
Yes, the Renraku Sensei is the 1,000 nuyen one that's right in the middle. I personally think it's good for a commlink that isn't too expensive yet still is functional.
Thanks for clarifying about the contact, I probably can drop the connection to one. However, one last question, what about Aerial vehicles? Obviously, I can't afford one at Char-gen, but I plan on getting a Banshee at some point, simply because it is such a cool plane. Would repairs for that require more parts?
If I come off as being rude, I don't mean to, I greatly appreciate your advice and input. I'm just one of those people that likes to understand "the why" of everything.
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aerial vehicles are very much GM/game dependent.
If you think about the setting and the uses of manned craft and specifically in relation to their need for landing pads/strips + hangars as well as air traffic control clearance; its just not something that you can really hop into if you're playing a reasonably realistic game of shadowrun.
Given the fact that-in setting you can achieve pretty much everything you need to with drones (except moving decent numbers of passengers), they're just not that useful either.
A small, fast recon drone covered in ruthenium paint and equipped with a tooled sensor suite can achieve just as much recon as a manned craft, land in half the space, can be stored in a backpack and costs a fraction of the price too.
They really come in more useful in merc/paramilitary/corporate HTR style campaigns where you have an organisation behind you to get you flight path clearances or where you're in an open warfare zone so people don't give a fuck.
Really, most of the vehicle stat blocks are there for the GM's usage when the runners encounter a corp/police/etc owned helo/cruiser/APC etc. most of them are vastly outside the scope of what a lot of people would deem to be appropriate for a PC to own and use in a "standard" shadowrun
repairs are no different for planes than cars, but obviously each pip of damage cost phenomenally more money to repair (so treat her well!) as the base cost of the vehicle is used to determine the repair value.
as for VCR, have a think about how you want this guy to function. if you're gonna be spending a lot of time in VR, then its totally worth getting the level two rig now as the bonuses to handling and perception via sensors are really damn useful. (especially on R3 sensor suites like on microdrones)
If you're doing the vast majority of your stuff through AR piloting or instruction sending, then you can easily get by with an R1 rig and put your cash elsewhere.
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Page 45 of SR5: Thresholds table: Easy - 1, Average - 2, Hard - 4, Very Hard - 6, Extreme - 8-10. That means my rating 2 rig makes Hard tests a threshold of 2, and Extreme tests anywhere from 6-8 hits needed. Not that that isn't strong, it is, since the possibility of having an Extreme test is very unlikely, but a rating 1 rig makes even Hard tests 3 hits still. Unless I'm interpreting it wrong and most vehicle tests don't even come close to Extreme on the scale, it still can be fairly difficult.
Check out the Rigger & VCR sections.
I don't have the page # but it basically lists off the examples of moves & the thresholds associated with them, IE, 1-3 w/ crazy stuff at 4+.
Like I said above, unless everything your doing is a move out of a Michael Bay movie, I think your fine.
Another things on page 266 of SR5: "When you’re jumped into a vehicle, drone, or other device, the limits of that device are increased by the rating of your control rig. This includes vehicle and drone Sensor, Speed, and Handling, and the Accuracy of mounted weapons when used by the rigger. The control rig also connects more smoothly through an RCC when operating in VR." Seems pretty beneficial to me, but I should point out that I have never been in a Shadowrun game ever, so maybe those stats are already high enough. That section also only relates to jumping into vehicles, not just giving them commands, so that is another thing.
True. I look at it as....... If my base vehicle has good stats, then a VCR isn't doing much. &/or I can only be jumped in to 1 thing so most commands default to not using the VCR for bonus stats.
Thanks for clarifying about the contact, I probably can drop the connection to one. However, one last question, what about Aerial vehicles? Obviously, I can't afford one at Char-gen, but I plan on getting a Banshee at some point, simply because it is such a cool plane. Would repairs for that require more parts?
As CS put it, Aerial vehicles fall into a whole different level of campaign.
The only thing I could see a dedicated Air-Rigger starting out with in 5E is a Yellowjacket.
If you went that route then I'd look at different contacts w/ a dedicated aircraft mechanic v/s an auto mechanic, but that's me.
No, not coming off Rude at all.
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I've taken your advice and I dropped the rig to rating 1. That freed up a lot of cash, so I now have 3 Roto-drones with Ares Alphas. I can't wait to try them out and see how much mayhem they can create. I really like the way my character looks right now, he seems like he's gonna be a lot of fun to play. I'm gonna run him for my Sunday game night this week, so unless you guys think I have something that can be improved, I think this is probably my last edit on this character. I really appreciate all the advice that everyone has given me, so thanks for helping me out!
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Could you please post feedback about your experience here? I'm interested about your field exam!
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Could you please post feedback about your experience here? I'm interested about your field exam!
Sure, I'll let you know probably sometime on Monday.
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I'll be interested to hear too.
The idea of VCR-1 & RE-3U just seems like a good starter combo to me & I hope it works out really well.
I know I'll be looking into something similar if we ever get around to a Chicago campaign at some point.
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So, we finished our first session last night, and it went pretty well. Everyone at the table was still familiarizing themselves with the rules, so it was a rather basic run.
We met with Mr. Johnson and he gave us the job of extracting a Biologist from a Shiawase subsidiary, with the condition that we have no casualties at all.
The decker tried to pull blueprints and stuff from the matrix, but apparently rolled absolutely horribly and got no information for us whatsoever. Fortunately, our mage was able to get some information with a Watcher spirit, and my drones were able to get a layout of the whole building.
Next night, we disguised my van to look like it had medical supplies so we could sneak in the back. The scientist was on the 5th floor of 7, so we figured it would be easier to start from the top. We sent our infiltrator to the roof of the building (she had gecko gloves and such). The face was able to get us through the couple of security guards into the building, where the decker then jacked in. He was able to loop the security feeds so our infiltrator could actually get to the scientist. Unfortunately, as she was leaving, a security guard showed up and she didn't shoot immediately on sight. She was able to knock him out, but not before he got the message out that we were here. She pulled the scientist into the elevator, and the decker hacked it to go straight to the garage where I had parked. A few goons showed up, but my drones wiped them up pretty quickly. I didn't get to use the grenades or anything, since we were trying to be sneaky and have no casualties, but I did knock out 2 of the goons with the Stick-n' Shock ammo. The only problem we had was when the mage fumbled throwing a Flash bang (why the mage was throwing one ... I'm not sure), so the GM decided it blew up next to my tire and popped the tire. So, my car's gonna need a little TLC, but overall, we got out of there with no problems at all. My drones made the fight at the end of the run a piece of cake, so we got a nice bit of cash.
Thanks for the help building the character guys, I had a lot of fun playing him!
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sounds great, well done!
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Congratulations!
How were the rolls with your dice pools & thresholds?
Any issues hitting what you needed?
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Congratulations!
How were the rolls with your dice pools & thresholds?
Any issues hitting what you needed?
Nope, not at all. I wasn't doing anything extreme, but I had no real problems staying stealthy while jumped in for recon, and driving/shooting was still a piece of cake. Although, I have to say I was glad that I didn't even use smokes or anything, since it was slow enough leaving the building with only 3 tires as it was. No, no issues here, unless we get in a ridiculous high speed chase and I roll badly (thank you 5 edge), I don't think I needed that rating 2 Rig, so that was a good call by you guys. While I can see this guy won't be working super miracles with drones/cars, he is more than proficient enough at it to be a useful asset to the team and to be fun to play. Again, thanks guys for helping me create this character, I've had quite a bit of fun even just from one session.
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Awesome, glad it worked out well.