[White Ronin]

Whoa... am I having a serious failure to comprehend (I hope)...

Muscle replacement, toner, and augmentation all say they're incompatible with augmentations that enhance STR and/or AGI.  Wired flexes are incompatible with anything that raises REA (other than reaction enhancers... as long as you bend over and accept the Wireless stick).  Does this mean that pretty much any cyberjock is going to be unable to use a suprathyroid because it'll conflict with everything?

Hoping I've just failed to understand.

[Critias]

Nope, that sure is how it reads.

[Michael Chandra]

Don't forget Synaptic Boosters, it also clashes with those.

It's how it reads, though frankly the descriptions read kinda copy-paste to me, so I submitted a question to the FAQ to be sure they intended for the Suprathyroid Gland to not be stackable with Synaptic Boosters. Completely didn't realize it also clashes with everything else, which means that, if intended, despite its serious pricetag it's utterly worthless.

[Xenon]

incompatible does not mean you can't install both at the same time.
it just mean you don't get the incompatible benefits from both wares.

For example, Suprathyroid gland is the only cyber or bodyware that increase body attribute.

You still get the body attribute bonus even if you also have synaptic booster, muscle augmentation and muscle toner.

[Michael Chandra]

Would you consider +1 Body worth 0.7 essence, 140k + extra lifestyle costs?

[Xenon]

Would you consider +1 Body worth 0.7 essence, 140k + extra lifestyle costs?

No (unless maybe if you are very starved at attribute points but still have essence and resources to burn), but i would for sure consider it if I didn't also had invested into muscle augmentation and muscle toner (or muscle replacement). Even if i already had improved reflexes or synaptic boosters.

Too bad it is off limits at chargen...

[Michael Chandra]

And that is why not stacking with the bioware augmentations is definitely broken. At that cost and availability, which incidentally makes it impossible to get in Missions unless you get it Used, it sounds extremely fair that it would stack.

Agi+Str of Cyber vs Bio is 40% essence, 252% nuyen. Reaction Enhancers at 50% essence would then be valued at anything inbetween 200% and 300% nuyen, let's assume the worst case. That puts the +1 Rea at 39k and 0.15 essence. +1 Agi and +1 Str is worth 63k and 0.4 essence. That leaves 38k nuyen, 0.15 essence and +25% lifestyle for the +1 Body.

[Mirikon]

Indeed, as written, Suprathyroid gland is utterly useless, and far, far too expensive. If that was as intended, and not simply an oversight, then the person who wrote that section needs phonebooking.

[Michael Chandra]

I'd consider it an oversight and houserule it myself as compatible with other Bioware even when they state "no other". We don't have to worry about an official ruling with Missions, since to get it with a 5/4 contact would cost 350k normal and 157.5k used, the latter of which would cost you all of Season 5 while living on the Street.

[Ghoulfodder]

I have a similar concern about the Adrenaline Pump, which boosts Strength, Agility and Reaction (and Willpower). RAW that's incompatible with Muscle Toner, Muscle Augmentation, Wired Reflexes, Synaptic Booster & Reaction Enhancers.

The exception appears to be Muscle Replacement, which could generously be read as compatible with Adrenaline Pump and Superthyroid Gland because it says "

it cannot be combined with other augmentations to the muscles

"  my emphasis.

And yet Adrenaline Pump and Superthyroid Gland make no mention of being incompatible with anything. Including each other.

There appear to be three or more different restrictions on combining things here. Some to everything (magic included), some to Augmentations and some to certain types of Augmentations.

It seems sensible to rule that Adrenaline Pump and Superthyroid Gland stack with everything, because they have no restrictions in their description and they are gland / chemical based, not actual replacement / enhancement of the thing you're trying to effect. I could see an argument not to stack with cyber because it isn't really natural, but not bioware. I presume the augmented maximum would still apply, so it's not like you could be a human with Agility 6  (Muscle Toner R3 - 9), Adrenaline Pump R4 to boost to 13.  (yikes the crash on that is going to hurt)

[Michael Chandra]

Augmented Maximum always applies except to Cyberlimbs and Wireless Wired Reflexes + Reaction Enhancers.

[Xenon]

if one augmentation state that it is incompatible but the other does not - then they are both incompatible with each other. note that incompatible does not mean you can't get both at the same time; just that you need to select which bonus you want to use at what time.

[Michael Chandra]

I'd use them as using the best of the two myself. E.g. RE3+SB1 would be +3 Rea, +1d6 Initiative.

[calaen]

As to adrenaline pump, the bonuses aren't the reason to have that thing.  The reason to have that thing is it'll keep you fighting at top capacity when you should have already gone for a nap on the floor - an important thing when the floor happens to be in an MCT zero zone, or an Aztechnology installation.

[firebug]

As to adrenaline pump, the bonuses aren't the reason to have that thing.  The reason to have that thing is it'll keep you fighting at top capacity when you should have already gone for a nap on the floor - an important thing when the floor happens to be in an MCT zero zone, or an Aztechnology installation.

Though you can't start with it, a Pain Editor is cheaper and much less essence for that effect, save that it also changes your stats a bit and doesn't have a time limit measured in seconds.