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Help me find balance

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The_Gun_Nut

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« Reply #30 on: <09-14-10/1721:03> »
Not surprising.  Two different sites saying opposite things.  Lemme check Webster.

Webster's uses bonuses as well.  Here http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/bonus.

Urban Dictionary is the Wiki of dictionaries.  Written by random people.  Not to say that they don't know, and might even have experts chiming in, but it still leaves certain words suspect.  Oh well.  Bonii sounds slightly phallus.  Phallii?

EDIT:  And that is the latin, according to Webster.
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anotherJack

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« Reply #31 on: <09-14-10/1725:22> »
Hmmm, it seems to be just "phalli". Don't ask me why, latin's studies are far…
Me am french, me am not speaking good english, but me am trying to correct this.

The_Gun_Nut

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« Reply #32 on: <09-14-10/1759:50> »
It's gotta be one of those weird things that pop up in languages.  Like "I before E except after C."
There is no overkill.

Only "Open fire" and "I need to reload."

FastJack

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« Reply #33 on: <09-14-10/1843:54> »
It's gotta be one of those weird things that pop up in languages.  Like "I before E except after C."
I before E except after C or in Weird or when it sounds like AY or ...

Doc Chaos

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« Reply #34 on: <09-15-10/0118:58> »
Plural of bonus is "boni" in german, guess we stick to latin...
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The_Gun_Nut

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« Reply #35 on: <09-15-10/0539:42> »
Looks like an "across the pond" thing, then.
There is no overkill.

Only "Open fire" and "I need to reload."

FastJack

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« Reply #36 on: <09-15-10/0855:08> »
Look at those silly Europeans trying to figure out the rules for American English.

Like we even HAVE rules. ;D

Doc Chaos

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« Reply #37 on: <09-15-10/0859:52> »
English doesn't just borrow words; on occasion, English has pursued other languages down alleyways to beat them unconscious and rifle their pockets for new vocabulary.
-James Nicoll
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Mäx

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« Reply #38 on: <09-15-10/1004:27> »
Gun nut - Or instead of 50+ dice you have him possesed by a force 10 spirit = 20 hardened...
Which does you exactly nothing against a called shot from Barret loaded with APDS or AV rounds doing a minimum of 14P damage with -8AP.
"An it harm none, do what you will"

anotherJack

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« Reply #39 on: <09-15-10/1012:14> »
I wouldn't say 6 to 7 success more than a standard character is nothing.
Me am french, me am not speaking good english, but me am trying to correct this.

The_Gun_Nut

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« Reply #40 on: <09-15-10/1017:37> »
What do you mean 6 or 7?  He just needs one.  The -8 AP drops hardened armor down to 12.  The called shot drives the damage up past the modified hardened armor and thus full damage is taken.

It makes me curious, though.  In which order is armor affected?  Or is it all affected equally in small amounts?
There is no overkill.

Only "Open fire" and "I need to reload."

anotherJack

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« Reply #41 on: <09-15-10/1028:17> »
Yes, the shooter just need one success, but as the target, you take a standard character, with a decent armor (equal to higher than 8, it's not like it would be hard), then you take the same, but possessed. The possessed one will benefit average 6-7 successes more than the standard one on his resistance test since he rolls 20 dices more. Whether you apply the AP to the immunity or the worn armor does not change the gap of dices pools between the two characters. So no, it does not do exactly nothing against the super-called-shot-of-the-death-with-a-super-powerful-weapon-and-super-ammo.

If you have to guess an order, I'd say the spirit's immunity applies only to the character's body (it doesn't posses his clothes), so it's nearly the last armor unless he has something under his skin. But it doesn't change anything about the attack DV, no problem, it's over 20, the character takes damages as normal.
« Last Edit: <09-15-10/1034:24> by anotherJack »
Me am french, me am not speaking good english, but me am trying to correct this.

The_Gun_Nut

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« Reply #42 on: <09-15-10/1033:59> »
The burden of hits is on the target, though.  Even if he has 20 dice to roll more than the other guy, then that is still only 6 or 7 damage less that he takes.  The base 15 damage still translates into a huge hit, and starts putting on penalties.  A second, quick, called-shot-to-the-face will likely produce another hit for another chunk of damage.  Now the guy is at a distinct disadvantage, because (1) he cannot see where the attack is coming from and (2) he's already walking around with damage modifiers.  If the spirit pops off his Concealment power (because, why wouldn't you?) then the sniper now has a pretty hard time of just seeing the guy.

If I were the possession guy, I would bail on that situation.  Sure, I just survived a sniper shot (possibly two!) but that is no guarantee that I'll survive the next 3 seconds.

And all this is assuming that there isn't more than one sniper team.
There is no overkill.

Only "Open fire" and "I need to reload."

anotherJack

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« Reply #43 on: <09-15-10/1038:11> »
True. Now compare it to a normal character with same amount of experience : first shot, the character is dead, end of the story. See the gap ?
Me am french, me am not speaking good english, but me am trying to correct this.

The_Gun_Nut

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« Reply #44 on: <09-15-10/1107:31> »
No, I don't.  If you have brought that kind of attention upon yourself, where the hiring of snipers is necessary, then you have earned it.

Now, tell me what else the possession mage can do, besides cast spells and summon spirits?  Same as other mages, pretty much, and they had to belong to a traditon that allows channelling metamagic, and had to purchase the metamagic.  And still all he can do is be tough.

A street sam spends money and gets that, he doesn't need to spend any karma.  Recall that you can upgrade armor to be hardened.  And dog pile a lot of it on, by spending money.  The mage has to bind the spirit, as well, and have a goodly number of services available.  Which also costs money.  Armor tends to be cheaper than binding ritual equipment.  Especially the crazy stacking kind.  And, again, those services can be depleted, as normal, by someone with banishing.

There is also an RP aspect that some folks are forgetting:  Most spirits hate to be bound.  Only the possession traditions of magic could possibly have exceptions (the Loa from voodun is an example).  Long term service "beefing up" the mage may become grating on the spirit, especially if all the mage does is treat it as a meat shield.  It has to be a partnership, and using any power expends a service.  If any mage wants to make up a possession tradition and flat out ignores the role playing aspect of it, then slap him/her with the appropriate penalties.

I see possession as powerful, but rare.  I haven't had anyone try to abuse it in my games, but then, I feel what's good for the goose is good for the gander, and my players know it.  If they start abusing their power, then I have ways of dealing with it.
There is no overkill.

Only "Open fire" and "I need to reload."