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Maglocks

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Reaver

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« Reply #15 on: <10-09-13/1734:41> »
I've reread the text about maglocks (p363) several times but I'm still not sure about the answer to my question. Can you always bypass a maglock by opening the case and tinkering with the electronics or does it work only for card readers and keypads and not, for example, with a print scanner?  Thanks!
ah, and a subsidiary question, can you hack the fingerprints of a person by reading the SIN in his/her commlink? re-thanks!

(Boy do I HATE maglocks as they are written as to how they really work, and are wired. But they have to be this way....**)

As written, no you don't need any tools to bypass most maglocks. but they help (see tools section). it's done this way so a simple armored door doesn't spoil a shadowrun :P

maglocks (Magnetic locks). use electro magnets to hold the door in place, you can pop the hinges on the door and it will still  hold fast. For the top of the line ones, you have to cut a hole in the door to bypass them! The security access port (this would be the keyreader, facial/hand/thumb/retina scanner, etc) has no direct control of the door at all, it just sends signals to a PLC. The PLC reads the inputs and decides if it is valid, IF it is, it sends a signal down a different electrical branch to the Transformer PLC, which sends a signal to the door's electromagnet to de-energise, thus releasing the door. There is an all of 3 wires. a signal, a neutral/ground*, and a hot**)

There is no way to bypass a today's good maglock door from the portal itself. they are designed that way.

* Not needed if it is a Solid state device. the Signal wire will provide this function.
** Not needed if it is a Solid State device. The Signal wire will provide this function.


I've set up magnetic doors in everything from gas stations to nuclear power planets, to biologic departments at hospitals..... and I mean doing everything from the frame up. (running the wire, installing the transformers, the magnet system, the Sensor, the control wires, the PLC, the power to the PLC and everything electrical and control in between.)
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GiraffeShaman

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« Reply #16 on: <10-13-13/1720:20> »
I'm not sure if this still applies, but it used to be that you needed special means to get around a voice recog. system. The fact that it's listed as a lockpicking specialty seems to indicate this is no longer the case, but perhaps it's a typo. The idea used to be is that they are extremely rare and meant to be a pain in the ass for runners to get around. Many runner groups I've seen are completely unprepared for voice recog systems as they were written under the old rules.

A few ways they could be gotten around:

1. Voice of an actual authorized user.

2. A recording of an authorized user using an audio deck. The quality of the audio deck is tested versus the lock.

3. An Adept using Voice Control power

Voice Control power is still able to be used against voice recog. in SR5. Pg. 311. "If you use this trick to fool a person or a voice recognition system, make an Opposed Test using your Impersonation + Charisma [Mental] against the voice recognition system's rating X 2, or against the Perception  + Intuition of characters the adept is trying to fool, adding the level of this power as a bonus to your dice pool."

Weird. Reading the security area, it reads much like the old rules for the more exotic lock types like voice recog. It seems to indicate there that you have to do certain things other than lockpicking to get by them, just like it use to be. There being a specialization for voice recog systems kind of confuses the issue. Until I know some official ruling on the matter I'll probaly just do it the old way, as it makes more interesting security problems to get around.

A key line on pg. 364 SR5 "Characters can only defeat voice recognition systems by "speaking" with the voice an approved user-by using a recording, some other simulation, or the real voice."

« Last Edit: <10-13-13/1730:00> by GiraffeShaman »

witchdoctor

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« Reply #17 on: <10-13-13/2035:33> »
Not to be a contrarian but aren't we forgetting the fact that most maglocks with a keycard or similar authentication feature require a matrix connection on some level? I'm just bringing this up as a legitimate, and quite useful, strategy is to hack whatever security measures they have set up and fool the door into letting you in.

Kincaid

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« Reply #18 on: <10-13-13/2108:30> »
Not to be a contrarian but aren't we forgetting the fact that most maglocks with a keycard or similar authentication feature require a matrix connection on some level? I'm just bringing this up as a legitimate, and quite useful, strategy is to hack whatever security measures they have set up and fool the door into letting you in.

It's not required, but it's certainly a possible route.  A decker could edit the file of approved keycards to include one the PCs already have.

Quote
A key line on pg. 364 SR5 "Characters can only defeat voice recognition systems by "speaking" with the voice an approved user-by using a recording, some other simulation, or the real voice."

And here's where we learn the value of a copy editor.  Contrast that sentence with, "The first step to bypassing a maglock..." (p. 363).  This makes clear (well, in a "by the rules of the English language" way, not in the "this is what every reasonable reader will come away with" way), that bypassing a maglock is always a 2-step (or more) process.  To consolidate my readings:

1. There's no such thing as a generic maglock.  All maglocks specify the means of entry (keypad, voice recognition, etc.)
2. Assuming it's on the Matrix, all maglocks can be overcome by a decker.  I'm also assuming once the rigger book is out and CCSS riggers (eqv.) get more rules, riggers will be handy here too.  As it stands now, there's no practical way for a rigger to generate marks, aside from also being a decker.
3. Given that overcoming a maglock is a 2-step process, Locksmith is rolled for both these steps (pop the case, mess with the guts).
4. There are pieces of gear that replace the 2-step process for groups without a Locksmith who do their legwork.  Walking up to a voice authenticator and using a recording is a one-step process, obviously, and exists outside of the rules I cited from page 363.  Sequencers are sort of an exception here since they require step one (pop the case).  If you're already rolling Locksmith to pop the case, there's no point to having the sequencer.  If you're the "shoot the case off" type, then a sequencer makes sense.
5. I expect (and barring an official ruling, will GM) that shooting off the case with anti-tamper circuits will automatically trigger the alarm.
6. Locksmith is very handy, but by no means a cure-all.  The three guards standing next to the door will probably notice if you pop open the case and start messing with the wires.  Legwork, people!  Find a disgruntled ex-employee, buy him dinner, find out about the types of locks used.
« Last Edit: <10-14-13/1054:58> by Kincaid »
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Csjarrat

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« Reply #19 on: <10-14-13/0504:59> »
can't believe a pink mohawk player hasn't popped up and suggested demolition skill yet :-)
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martinchaen

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« Reply #20 on: <10-14-13/0738:18> »
You don't need to be a pink mohawk player for that, Csjarrat. All it takes is a miniwelder...

Lysanderz

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« Reply #21 on: <10-15-13/1455:03> »
Or a well placed HE grenade. I gotta wonder if the new Advanced Demolitions rules will be less mathmatical than the old ones. I hated that I had to teach myself advanced arithmetic just to play a game. But damnit, I figured it out.

DWC

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« Reply #22 on: <10-15-13/1606:21> »
If you want to get really crazy with maglocks (and don't care in the slightest about life safety concerns), they can be set to be sprung closed, with the magnet pulling the bolt back to release the door.  Then the simple expedient of current the power conduit running into the door doesn't bypass the lock.

Reaver

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« Reply #23 on: <10-15-13/1616:16> »
If you want to get really crazy with maglocks (and don't care in the slightest about life safety concerns), they can be set to be sprung closed, with the magnet pulling the bolt back to release the door.  Then the simple expedient of current the power conduit running into the door doesn't bypass the lock.

Real life magnetic locks don't have a bolt per say... it is usually the entire door frame that is used as a magnet in conjunction with a metal door. Which is why magnetic doors are almost impossible to force open.

but again, this is where we have to seperate reality from fiction to have a good story :D
Where am I going? And why am I in a hand basket ???

Remember: You can't fix Stupid. But you can beat on it with a 2x4 until it smartens up! Or dies.