[gradivus]

The ability to "operate itself" is listed as a Wireless bonus, which doesn't necessarily mean that the wireless antenna doubles as tiny arms. I would imagine that is basically just the device feeding you pain killers through an IV, since the books refer to the medkits being attached to the patient, I'm picturing an IV and the finger thing for O2 and sticky pads with leads for defilabusting.

Also probably using matrix information / processing to aid diagnostics and tell you what to do based on comparison of your vitals/what it can detect with millions of case histories.

Only house rule we do use is to not have a second limit on wounds healed based on First Aid skill. One limit is enough.

<emphasis mine>
Wuxing had a tremendous overstock on heal spell formulas so the world court ordered a limit on how much a medkit could heal... I mean this is all apout the corporations sticking it to us poor folk.

[Jack_Spade]

Bullets&Bandages p.16 explains the capabilities of medkits quite well:

"Published Shadowrun materials describe a number of systems that can deliver autonomous medical care using a variety of different terms: medkit, autodoc, stabilization unit, and more. All of these describe different medical expert systems and/or computers that analyze medical data and direct patient care. Medical expert systems generally fall into two categories. A medkit, as the name implies, is a kit that contains medical supplies as well as a medical expert system. Medkits can operate autonomously in a limited role by monitoring a patient’s biometric status, giving medications, administering gases, and more, but they often require a metahuman operator for hands-on tasks. An autodoc, on the other hand, is a medical expert system built on a more functional drone platform that is usually self-propelled and generally includes robotic appendages With these added features, an autodoc can perform a more robust range of hands-on tasks and is designed to function independently from a metahuman operator."

[Grand Magister Oberyn]

So exactly how big is the Savior Medkit compared to the regular med kit. It seems like a tube of injectable microtech would be super small even if it required a constant stream of them it couldn't be bigger than a portable injector harness. No one at the missions table knew for certain and when we looked at it the text said it used the same rules as other medkits.

Why risk CFD if the medkit isn't even smaller

[Novocrane]

So exactly how big is the Savior Medkit compared to the regular med kit

these advanced medkits combine cutting-edge nanotech and advanced expert systems.

The savior’s supply of nanites is limited, and it must be restocked every time it is used.

It's a single use nanite injector, and an expert system. What's an expert system?

The medkit includes drug supplies, bandages, tools, and a (talkative) doctor expert system that can advise the user on techniques to handle most typical medical emergencies (including fractures, gunshot wounds, chemical wounds, and poisoning, as well as offering advice for the treating of shock, handling blood loss, and of course performing resuscitations).

The expert system is the thing that talks you through whatever medical emergency you're experiencing / treating.

[Grand Magister Oberyn]

So exactly how big is the Savior Medkit compared to the regular med kit

these advanced medkits combine cutting-edge nanotech and advanced expert systems.

The savior’s supply of nanites is limited, and it must be restocked every time it is used.

It's a single use nanite injector, and an expert system. What's an expert system?

The medkit includes drug supplies, bandages, tools, and a (talkative) doctor expert system that can advise the user on techniques to handle most typical medical emergencies (including fractures, gunshot wounds, chemical wounds, and poisoning, as well as offering advice for the treating of shock, handling blood loss, and of course performing resuscitations).

The expert system is the thing that talks you through whatever medical emergency you're experiencing / treating.

Right so the nanite injector is pretty small. How big is the Expert system? Does it still have/require all those other things? The drugs and bandages and tools I mean. Or do the nanites do it all and are smaller?

Is a Savior Medkit the same size as a Rating 6 Medkit?
Is there some other advantage to it that I'm missing?

[Novocrane]

The expert system is the size of a 2070s computer. Most of the bulk of a medkit (bandages, other gear) is replaced by the nanite injector. I suggest reading the saviour medkit again for rule comprehension.

[Grand Magister Oberyn]

I really appreciate the feed back. I looked through it again. I guess its just in the flavor that it sounds like it should be smaller than a R6 medkit. Here's the most relevant text I could get out of the book.

SAVIOR MEDKIT Originally developed by Shiawase Biotech but now available from several corps, these advanced medkits combine cutting-edge nano-tech and advanced expert systems. When activated, the medkit injects enough nanites to last five minutes into its subject. The savior then acts as a Rating 6 medkit and follows all the normal rules for medkits (p. 450, SR5). If the patient is bleeding out, the savior’s nanites act as a trauma control system (p. 148) for the duration. The savior’s supply of nanites is limited, and it must be restocked every time it is used.

sounds like it should be smaller... but then suddenly its still the same size as a standard one. I was really hoping to have something my cat-bugler could carry with her. I already have quite a bit to carry as far as gear goes and I was hoping for something that could go in an injector harness

Thanks again

The expert system is the size of a 2070s computer. Most of the bulk of a medkit (bandages, other gear) is replaced by the nanite injector. I suggest reading the saviour medkit again for rule comprehension.

[Rooks]

Wonder if you could put savior nanites in a auto injector

[Duellist_D]

The Savior Medkit consists of a bunch of nanites and a talkative computer, a R6 Medkit is the size of a backpack.
Since i doubt the Savior will inject several dozend liters of nanites into your body, I'd say its pretty small in itself. Putting it into an Auto-injector sounds like a really nice idea.

[jim1701]

I really appreciate the feed back. I looked through it again. I guess its just in the flavor that it sounds like it should be smaller than a R6 medkit. Here's the most relevant text I could get out of the book.

SAVIOR MEDKIT Originally developed by Shiawase Biotech but now available from several corps, these advanced medkits combine cutting-edge nano-tech and advanced expert systems. When activated, the medkit injects enough nanites to last five minutes into its subject. The savior then acts as a Rating 6 medkit and follows all the normal rules for medkits (p. 450, SR5). If the patient is bleeding out, the savior’s nanites act as a trauma control system (p. 148) for the duration. The savior’s supply of nanites is limited, and it must be restocked every time it is used.

sounds like it should be smaller... but then suddenly its still the same size as a standard one. I was really hoping to have something my cat-bugler could carry with her. I already have quite a bit to carry as far as gear goes and I was hoping for something that could go in an injector harness

Thanks again

The expert system is the size of a 2070s computer. Most of the bulk of a medkit (bandages, other gear) is replaced by the nanite injector. I suggest reading the saviour medkit again for rule comprehension.

I don't see how you get "same size as a regular medkit" from that.  It functions LIKE a regular medkit, it has nothing to do with its size.  I would also point out that a regular medkit has 6 uses between refills yet a savior needs to refilled after each use. 

[Grand Magister Oberyn]

So it comes from the The savior then acts as a Rating 6 medkit and follows all the normal rules for medkits. This unfortunately includes size. . It explicitly states that except for the way it inserts nanites which serve as a stabilize system that will persist for 5 min it will remain the same. I think that they had every intention of making this a smaller more portable yet still effective medkit, with the idea that this would give you the five minutes to make an escape to a place with a good medkit or a street doc or wait for doc wagon to show. But we're on as written rules for missions.

I love the idea about just grabbing the nanos out of the kit and using them but apparently they are interactive with the expert system which means that they wont be effective if they aren't part of an active medkit system.

Technically you might be able to link them to a bio monitor and have them work but I'm not sure that's missions legal or if you still need the expert system to decide where/what they do.

I really appreciate the feed back. I looked through it again. I guess its just in the flavor that it sounds like it should be smaller than a R6 medkit. Here's the most relevant text I could get out of the book.

SAVIOR MEDKIT Originally developed by Shiawase Biotech but now available from several corps, these advanced medkits combine cutting-edge nano-tech and advanced expert systems. When activated, the medkit injects enough nanites to last five minutes into its subject. The savior then acts as a Rating 6 medkit and follows all the normal rules for medkits (p. 450, SR5). If the patient is bleeding out, the savior’s nanites act as a trauma control system (p. 148) for the duration. The savior’s supply of nanites is limited, and it must be restocked every time it is used.

sounds like it should be smaller... but then suddenly its still the same size as a standard one. I was really hoping to have something my cat-bugler could carry with her. I already have quite a bit to carry as far as gear goes and I was hoping for something that could go in an injector harness

Thanks again

The expert system is the size of a 2070s computer. Most of the bulk of a medkit (bandages, other gear) is replaced by the nanite injector. I suggest reading the saviour medkit again for rule comprehension.

I don't see how you get "same size as a regular medkit" from that.  It functions LIKE a regular medkit, it has nothing to do with its size.  I would also point out that a regular medkit has 6 uses between refills yet a savior needs to refilled after each use.

[jim1701]

As far as I'm concerned there are rules FOR medkits and rules ABOUT medkits.  Functionality is the former and size is the latter.  If you choose to make things more difficult than they need to be then knock yourself out I guess.

[Novocrane]

So it comes from the The savior then acts as a Rating 6 medkit and follows all the normal rules for medkits..

The size of a medkit (short of B&B's optional rules) is not a rule or game mechanic, it's a description.

Wonder if you could put savior nanites in a auto injector

I don't see why not.

Hard nanites use conductive tissue and other surfaces and UV radiation to communicate. They do not use the Matrix, and so they do not show up as icons in the Matrix.

Once introduced, nanites become active in about a minute. Nanoware systems are considered to be always active unless a nanohive implant is present.

I doubt the expert system and nanites are communicating. CFD prompted greater security in nanotech, and external to internal communications would be the opposite of that.