[Typhus]

I have a Reaction of 2 and a Pilot of 2.  I own a Ford Americar.

I get on the freeway and accelerate to 60 mph.  I now have a -4 dice pool penalty and need 4 hits not to crash on my first Handling test.  How do I not automatically crash and die?  I can't turn on the autopilot, it only has a skill of 1. 

Save me?

[Michael Chandra]

You start by making your GM read the rules about when a test makes sense. Or you turn on GridGuide. We've had this debate already.

[Shinobi Killfist]

You start by making your GM read the rules about when a test makes sense. Or you turn on GridGuide. We've had this debate already.

He said when he makes his first handling test. He didn’t say you’d get one for just driving. So if the GM throws any obstacle at you, a driver with average agility and actually trained in the skill auto fails at every test at like 60mph or faster. Same with your auto pilot.

I can’t be the only GM that occasionally tosses a driving test at the players. Heck the Chicago missions called for multiple tests just due to bad weather.

Im guessing the answer is edge is your only hope.

[adzling]

The test only happens when something prompts it, such as "following another car without being spotted" per 6e core page 200.

So you wouldn't crash just from day-to-day driving.

However as soon as you try something simple, like "following another car without being spotted" then you die.

So the moral of the story is don't drive during a mission, only during down-time.

[Stainless Steel Devil Rat]

Yeah you're not supposed to even be rolling handling tests unless a crash is plausible in the given circumstances.

I'd argue that even extends to making opposed piloting rolls during a chase.  Not unless you lose the opposed roll, and making you crash is what the winner is specifically trying to do.


So if you're tooling down I-5 in downtown Seattle at 60MPH and you want to get over a couple lanes to make your exit, your GM shouldn't be making you roll.  That's everyday driving kind of stuff.

A ghoul runs out in front of you though, and you want to not hit him? THAT's what handling tests are for.  And yeah, you'll probably make some roadkill. It's what would happen to regular people driving regular cars at high speed and something unexpected suddenly happens.

[Michael Chandra]

If you're driving a shitty car with a shitty driving skill without using GridGuide at a speed that kills your shitty dicepool and are dumb enough to force your gm to give you a handling test that even when reduced to threshold 1 for being way easier than a u-turn at high speed you still will fail, your character deserves to burn to a crisp. There, entire debate summarised.

[Iron Serpent Prince]

If you're driving a standard car with an above average driving skill in any area without GridGuide at a speed that shouldn't kill your above average dicepool and are dumb enough to still be playing a CGL Shadowrun game, your character deserves to burn to a crisp. There, entire debate summarised.

Fixed that for you.

[Hobbes]

AGridguide is just the autopilot.  Most vehicles the dice pool is not great.  RAW Anything unexpected that happens on the highway will likely result in a massive pile up.  Even a threshold 1 test. 

The Reaction 5, Pilot 1 Shadowrunner will frequently fail simple tests at highway speeds, and then have to make a crash test.  At least the crash isn't instantly fatal like in 5th. 

The Speed modifier is a killer, it should kick in later.  Or something.

[BeCareful]

A thought occurs: this is related to PCs. Something "unexpected" requires you to make a test. So...

"Okay, you successfully cut off your pursuer, causing them to slam on the brakes as you swerve into the off-ramp.

"The Americar behind your pursuer tries to avoid them, spins out, and rear-ends their van. GridGuide scrambles to redirect traffic, but you drive away from a six-car pileup, and counting."

(Also, wow, this has been a wild ride from start to presumable finish)

[Shinobi Killfist]

 The rest of the PCs may want to avoid driving but the rigger May mop up here as they are the only people with dice pools to handle the penalties for even average speeds.  Lone star beat cops will be crashing like mad trying to chase you at pretty low speeds. Even in a good car when dropping 2 to 3 dice out of 5 ouch.

[Kirklins]

So one thing that bothers me is that functionally a crash is a glitch, not a failure.

So what if it went like this? The handling test is an extended test. Each subsequent roll gets another die with fixed value of 1 put in the result pool. Eventually the handling target will be met or we'll get a glitch (and crash).

Feels clumsy, but I'll throw it as a starting point.

[Gareth]

So one thing that bothers me is that functionally a crash is a glitch, not a failure.

So what if it went like this? The handling test is an extended test. Each subsequent roll gets another die with fixed value of 1 put in the result pool. Eventually the handling target will be met or we'll get a glitch (and crash).

Feels clumsy, but I'll throw it as a starting point.

I'm thinking of instead junking the Speed Interval,

The handling scores are already pretty severe for "ordinary" drivers,

As an alternative Speed interval could be used something like this:

If # of Speed Intervals > Pilot Skill, foe gains one Edge (if no foe present then GM uses the Edge as a re-roll against the pilot),

Much less severe and incorporates the Edge rules,

(Totally not a complete rule, but perhaps the starting point),

[Michael Chandra]

Eh, ordinary drivers use GridGuide and at best use their driving skills to park or to get out of a faraday cage garage into gridguide's domain.

[Gareth]

ordinary drivers use GridGuide and at best use their driving skills to park

There are cars today whose "autopilot" can automate parking...

But that aside, the "ordinary driver" you are talking about likely only has a skill of 0 or 1,

There's a massive jump between that and "competent to dive",

I, personally, am "competent to drive", but I doubt I have a skill level of 5 or 6 despite driving regularly (my job involves a fair amount of travel, but I'm not a professional driver) and mostly managing to not crash,

But the listed cars - given the penalties (and likely pilot assistance), I'd expect basic difficulties (i.e.: handling scores) in the range of 0 - 2 or so at worst...

[Michael Chandra]

Handling tests are not for any kind of normal operations. Unless you're going to do something really fancy, there's no need to ever roll. Even having to hit the breaks to avoid hitting someone hardly is worthy of a Handling test. At that point, your dicepool is merely to convince your GM you can drive normally, no need for a Handling test.

If as a 'competent to drive' non-professional-driver someone tries to perform a vehicle stunt with a crappy car, then to quote Chicago: "He had it coming!"

The only thing I agree with is that you shouldn't crash if you fail your (opposed so no Handling-based threshold) tailing test.