[Beaumis]

The concealability modifiers table table in P. 420 CRB lists bullpup assault rifles at +4 and "normal" assault rifles at +6. However, the CRB only lists two weapons as bullpup, the FN P93 Praetor SMG and ArmTech MLG-12 grenade launcher. Run & Gun has only one weapon, the Ontario Arms Equalizer mention the term "bullpup". Judging from the art of this and previous editions (both in german and english books) the following assault rifles would quality as bullpup:

• FN HAR (German CRB)
• Ares HVAR (RnG)
• HK XM30 (RnG)
• Nissan Optimum II(RnG)

How do other tables play this? Do you just ingore the bullpup assault rifles entry on the table and consider all ARs +6 or do you go by each individual gun and make a judgement call? And if so, based on what?

[Namikaze]

Quite honestly, I've never looked that deeply at the concealability table.  I've never had an issue with just using the +6 modifier for all assault rifles.  But if someone at one of my tables brings it up, then sure I'd give the +4 for the rifles that look bulpup as you specified.

[Imveros]

Same here. At my table, when it is assault rifle time, that means its rock and roll time! No one has ever tried to hide an assault rifle during rock and roll time. That's what SMGs and Machine Pistols are for

[8-bit]

I can agree here as well. Hell, most people, even the stealthy ones, don't even have Palming as a skill at our table. People rock concealable holsters with extra concealable outfits for a reason, so that the little Pistols, Machine Pistols, and SMGs can go fairly unnoticed without a whole lot of hassle for tests. I don't think I've seen someone try to hide an Assault Rifle, Sniper Rifle, Shotgun, or Launcher at our table, and I suppose if they did the test would come into play. It doesn't show up often though, so I never really thought about it. I guess I agree with Namikaze, if it happened, then I don't see much of an issue with it. I would still wish them good luck trying to hide an Assault Rifle in their jacket.

[Csjarrat]

Yeah, unless this was being hidden on a large ork or troll I'd probably stick with the idea that it's nigh-impossible to hide something as large as that. I haven't had it tried as yet though!

[jim1701]

I can agree here as well. Hell, most people, even the stealthy ones, don't even have Palming as a skill at our table. People rock concealable holsters with extra concealable outfits for a reason, so that the little Pistols, Machine Pistols, and SMGs can go fairly unnoticed without a whole lot of hassle for tests. I don't think I've seen someone try to hide an Assault Rifle, Sniper Rifle, Shotgun, or Launcher at our table, and I suppose if they did the test would come into play. It doesn't show up often though, so I never really thought about it. I guess I agree with Namikaze, if it happened, then I don't see much of an issue with it. I would still wish them good luck trying to hide an Assault Rifle in their jacket.

Who said they were hiding it in their jacket?   

[Beaumis]

Interesting. Thanks for the input so far. My table has used the concealment table as an indicator for size in lack of any other information. The difference between bullpup and "normal" rifles is also the line we have drawn between "fits in a large backpack" and "needs a sports bag" or something similar. The ARs are generally kept in cars and bags but given how available and not forbidden quite a few of them are, I was curious how other tables played them.

[Csjarrat]

I can agree here as well. Hell, most people, even the stealthy ones, don't even have Palming as a skill at our table. People rock concealable holsters with extra concealable outfits for a reason, so that the little Pistols, Machine Pistols, and SMGs can go fairly unnoticed without a whole lot of hassle for tests. I don't think I've seen someone try to hide an Assault Rifle, Sniper Rifle, Shotgun, or Launcher at our table, and I suppose if they did the test would come into play. It doesn't show up often though, so I never really thought about it. I guess I agree with Namikaze, if it happened, then I don't see much of an issue with it. I would still wish them good luck trying to hide an Assault Rifle in their jacket.

Who said they were hiding it in their jacket?   

"Is that an assault rifle in your pocket or are you just happy to see me?" Winked the elf seductively...

[8-bit]

Who said they were hiding it in their jacket?   

We always assumed it was hiding in clothing. If you have a bag that is big enough to completely obscure the form of a weapon, then the weapon isn't noticeable. If someone is suspicious, they don't look at your bag or feel it, they open it and take a look around. We never have a test if that happens at our table, because we assume the person checking your bag isn't blind that a 3 foot or longer gun is sitting in your bag. We also assume that they don't just look around, they actually move stuff to make sure there aren't any hidden pockets or anything. Then again, it might be different at other tables, but that's how we have always played it.

[jim1701]

That's what I get for trying to be subtle. 

[8-bit]

That's what I get for trying to be subtle. 

Sutle *

8-bit no understand nooances of speech.

Seriously though, that went way over my head. My bad.

[jim1701]

Hey, if every joke worked I could quit my day job.   

[adzling]

bullpup assault rifles with short barrels can get almost as short as many SMGs
Just sayin'.

[Namikaze]

bullpup assault rifles with short barrels can get almost as short as many SMGs
Just sayin'.

You're absolutely right.  Unfortunately, short barrels aren't an option in SR right now. 

I'd love to see more in the way of modifications, like changing the chamber of the gun, lengthening or shortening the barrel, retrofitting the firing mechanisms, etc.

[Herr Brackhaus]

If SR3's Cannon Companion and SR4's Arsenal is anything to go by, weapon mods like short and long barrels are just a sourcebook away.