[Zelte]

Ok, this HAS to have come up (and complained about) many, many times:
The situation is that a Player with a weapon set to full auto, has a full mag in the weapon and a target at point blank (melee distance).
The Player wants to go "Full Hollywood" and burn the entire clip into the single target.
The rules that exist for burst fire, long burst, and suppressive fire are diametrically opposed to this action. The existing rules give a bonus to hit and a deficit for the Target to defend.
There aren't really any damage bonuses or the ability to try to put LOTS of rounds on Target that is close enough to touch.
This is especially depressing when the "Gun Bunny" is set up to drop the Target for good, but can only click off 2 called shots (to the face) and has to take a back seat to the Combat Adept that can deliver a flaming upper-cut that would K.O. a truck.

[A second question is: What can a "Gun Bunny" do to improve their lethality that does not involve toting around guns that belong attached to Tanks and Battleships?]

[Jack_Spade]

There actually is such an action: Take a look at Run&Gun p. 119:
Brain Blaster allows you to forgoe the defense penalty to get +2 DV. Combine that with a called shot (Vitals) action for a hefty +4 DV

[Kuirem]

Net hits increase the DV of your attack so any bonus dice to hit or malus to dodge will gives you extra damage.

[adzling]

What Kuirem said, -9 to your opponents dodge pool for full auto will indeed rack up the damage due to net hits staging damage up.

Net hits increase the DV of your attack so any bonus dice to hit or malus to dodge will gives you extra damage.

[The Bald Man]

I'm surprised your gun bunny is having trouble 'keeping up' with damage.  Melee damage is harder to boost than ranged. 
But gun users will want:
-high base damage: so pick the right weapon, and right ammo (explosive)
-high AP: look for ammo that boost this. (apds)
-multi fire capability: more bullets -> less defense hits -> more damage
-high limit: pick the right weapon  and mods (custom grips smartgun)

Obviously, boost to agility and skill are welcome (smartlink, reflex recorder, ware, etc)

Is your gun bunny using a light pistol? and your melee adept a troll?

[Kiirnodel]

Another thing to remember is that it might take time to empty that full clip. Firing off more than 10 bullets in a controlled manner takes that extra split second that equates to an extra action on another pass.

So just spraying a target down just takes that little bit longer, but you can still do it. Plus it taking an extra attack means you deal more damage because of another hit.

[ClaytonCross]

Lets say your a "Gun Bunny". You likely have:
6 agility
6 skill with all fire arms
5 Strength (for Natural Recoil Compensation of 4)
Smart link Vision Mod in their eyes
a weapon like the Ares Alpha that does 11DP, has -2 AP, 2RC, and a 7 ACC (with smart link)
Drop the grenade launcher for gas vents 3 (giving +3 RC)
Armor Piercing rounds with -4AP
Firing Full auto

your roll for hit is  AGI 6 + Skill 6 + Smart link (Eyes) 2 - 1 RC over flow (Limit 7 with Smart link Eyes) = 13(7)
Versus standard defense of (reaction 5 + intuition 5) 10 - 9 for full auto = 1 defense dice....
target absorbs against DV11 + 4 (for approximate net hits) with Body 5 (maybe) + Armor 10 (maybe) - 6 AP
So... that's 15 - 3(maybe) for 12 physical damage.
If we assume they have 5 strength, 5 body, and 5 reaction then they have 15 health and live... barely.. with 3 health
If they have 3 Strength, 3 body, and 3 Reaction (normal stats) they are down and likely 1 into 3 overflow.

So no, your not likely to point blank 1 shot a full health Ork or troll, but any other wimpy body builds will be unconscious or paste. Non-goblinoid deckers, riggers, mages, and faces are likely gone but you would expect your street samurai and goblinoids to take the hit and live but with a hearty -4 to all dice pools but defense.

Of course you could use Brain Blaster/called shot (Vitals) Jack_Spade mentioned and trade 3 net hits for +4 damage for a gain of 1 but that's not going to do much.

Or even better, use a point of edge which will likely give you at least 2 more hits even if you only have 1 edge or 4 if you have 5 edge.

At that point your going to drop anything that is not built to tank. If they are they are still looking at a hefty negative to dice pools but then they are doing their job just as well as you are doing yours.

[A second question is: What can a "Gun Bunny" do to improve their lethality that does not involve toting around guns that belong attached to Tanks and Battleships?]
Really if your not carrying a big gun your not a "Gun Bunny". I mean you could use skill wires or adept Improved Ability to raise your skill 3 for another hit but its not going to change your world as much as a higher DP weapon and some armor piercing rounds. I would also recommend that if you have a good weapon you next priority is armor. Because you should get the first shot (maybe last) shot on the adept being that your ranged but some armor might ensure that if he hits you, that you get that second shot.

[Tecumseh]

I'm surprised no one else mentioned it, but Run & Gun has an optional rule for exactly this scenario. See p. 110:

RG6: DAMAGE FOR NO DEFENSE
If an attack decreases a target’s Defense Test pool below
0 dice, additional penalties are added to the DV
of the attack at a rate of 1 DV per two lost dice. This
makes Full Auto or Burst Fire attacks against unaware or
restrained foes truly deadly.

Thus, Full Auto and its -9 dodge penalty get translated into a +4 DV bonus. That basically turns your Ares Alpha into an assault cannon. Hope you have a good dry cleaner.

[Zelte]

Thank you to all.
And as you probably surmised; I am new to the game mechanics. I'm also balancing: 2 first time players (gun bunnies); 1 player who wants to be a character from a novel and not a working system of skills, attributes, and gear (a mage not geared for healing or destruction), and SIR MinMaximus the Melee combat Cyber Adept with .6 remaining Essence; Unstoppable and Indestructible.

[ClaytonCross]

SIR MinMaximus the Melee combat Cyber Adept with .6 remaining Essence; Unstoppable and Indestructible.

So he has 0 magic as an adept? Because reduction in Essence lowers your magic score equally. Hints a high 6 magic with 5.5 essence loss = 0 magic = 0 Adept ppt....Cybernetics and Magic generally don't mix well the same way healing spells are reduced by lose of essence and technomancers can't use magic. have used exceptional attribute to raise magic to 7 then taken a data link an some bio were under 1 essence loss to make a adept decker with 6 ppt.

[Novocrane]

Hints a high 6 magic with 5.5 essence loss = 0 magic = 0 Adept ppt

There are ways around that being an total deal breaker for an adept.

[Reaver]

Have to see that Adept's sheet, but willing to bet its a FUBAR character....

[kyoto kid]

...also consider other types of ammo.  EXEX increases the DV by +2  and grants -1 to AP.  APDS modifies the weapon's base AP by -4.  If you have Hard Targets there is also an ammo mod called Handload which can either add +1 to the DV or grant and additional -1 to the AP

For example my Gunslinger adept has a  decked out Krime Boss with internal smartlink and customised grip which gives her an accuracy limit of 6 (7 with her enhanced accuracy power). She usually loads it with EXEX handload which makes the weapons base DV 16P (yes that's one less than an assault cannon) and -2 AP.  As It also has burst fire capability she can reduce a target's dodge pool ensuring more net hits.  On average roll vs. an opponent's dodge she usually scores 3 net hits.

She named it "Pink Cloud" for a reason.

For her Remington 950 she uses Handload APDS which gives the weapon a total AP of -9. with a base DV of 12.  Remember that if the net DV is higher than the modified armour, damage is Physical so even someone in FBA will be a hurting unit or down. (and with her limit and pool, it is often the latter).

Full auto may be cool and totally cinematic, but it takes a lot of Recoil Comp to not lose a good chunk of your pool which can decrease the number of successes as well.  There are better ways to make that lead you sink into them be more effective.

Keep in mind part of the Shadowrunner's Creed:  "Conserve Ammo".

[Mirikon]

Thank you to all.
And as you probably surmised; I am new to the game mechanics. I'm also balancing: 2 first time players (gun bunnies); 1 player who wants to be a character from a novel and not a working system of skills, attributes, and gear (a mage not geared for healing or destruction), and SIR MinMaximus the Melee combat Cyber Adept with .6 remaining Essence; Unstoppable and Indestructible.

The two newbies aren't a problem. The mage is also not bad. In fact, a mage focused as an investigator, or some other non-combat role can be a huge asset to the party. They need to have at least SOME combat ability, of course, but a mystic private eye type character leads to a LOT of interesting plots.

No, your problem is with the one you name SIR MinMaximus, and from what I'm hearing, he's well deserving of something I call the 'Phonebook Method for Keeping Games Fun'. It is really simple:

Step 1: Get a phonebook (I prefer the Metro Atlanta phonebook, for thickness). If you can't find a phonebook, use any suitably large book, though make sure it is paperback.
Step 2: Beat offending player about the head and shoulders with phonebook.
Step 3: Repeat as necessary, until the stupid stops, or the player loses consciousness.
Step 4: Run a game without idiots trying to break things.


Seriously, though, you need to take that player to the side, explain to him that his level of cheese is breaking things, and tell him to tone it down or find another table.