Shadowrun General => General Discussion => Topic started by: Banshee on <09-16-22/0913:34>

Title: Survey: Augmentations
Post by: Banshee on <09-16-22/0913:34>
Ok gang, pretty sure I already know most if the answers but now is the time to weight in on what your wishlist items are for the new augmentations book.

Tell me what you want to see!
Title: Re: Survey: Augmentations
Post by: Hobbes on <09-16-22/1301:57>
Body Sculpting and Cosmetic Augmentations.  Hopefully cheap and low to no Essence as it's theoretically commonplace and done frequently.  Multiple times a year for those on the cutting edge of fashion.

Cyberlimb, Cyberbody, Cybertail options.  I suspect you know the wishlist.

Initiative and Minor Action boosts, feel free to recycle the options from previous editions.  (Move by Wire, Synaptic Boost, ect, ect). 

Utility options.  We have basic stat, skill, and combat boosts in the CRB.  Samies could use some more random toys though.  Again, many examples in previous editions.

MAD and Cyberware Scanner counter measures for Augmentations and Weapons.  Stuff for the sneaky Samurai on the go.

More Social 'ware. 

Qualities and Martial Arts for Cyber'd up Monsters.

Title: Re: Survey: Augmentations
Post by: Dreamwalker on <09-16-22/1632:54>
Seems like Christmas came early this year. :o

For starters:
Title: Re: Survey: Augmentations
Post by: Banshee on <09-16-22/2032:42>
What did the Germans do to the booster?
Title: Re: Survey: Augmentations
Post by: Dreamwalker on <09-17-22/0753:55>
The German version appends a sentence, which translates as follows: The [Simsense Interface Overdrive] only works in conjunction with a control rig, hence only for rigging.

Effectively barring deckers and technomancers from this option for a (matrix-focused) intuition-enhancement. Very frustrating ...
Title: Re: Survey: Augmentations
Post by: Banshee on <09-17-22/1301:07>
The German version appends a sentence, which translates as follows: The [Simsense Interface Overdrive] only works in conjunction with a control rig, hence only for rigging.

Effectively barring deckers and technomancers from this option for a (matrix-focused) intuition-enhancement. Very frustrating ...

Huh ..  well that is a straight out misinterpretation we clearly only limited it to VR and said nothing about control rigs
Title: Re: Survey: Augmentations
Post by: Typhus on <09-17-22/2004:07>
Simple, effective, and fun cyberlimbs.  The current rules really need simplification and improvement. 

For simplicity, I'd rather they start with stats equal to the user's baseline, and get modded from there.  For amping up the interest, I'd love to see special abilities you can't get other ways.  The original limbs were designed into the game 30 years ago, and really haven't changed much.  Meanwhile our conception of how this can work has changed a bit over the years.  Time for "neolimbs".  It can be a version that's "better" than the baseline ones, so long as their capabilities are better.  Then people can still have the old ones if they want, but for folks who just want something simple and always more powerful than their meat bod, cyberpunk style, they'd have a go-to option. 
Title: Re: Survey: Augmentations
Post by: Michael Chandra on <09-18-22/1008:44>
Special cyberlimb sets that allow one to move differently. o,o Raptor legs for fast running, gorilla leg+arm set for easy climbing, that kinda thing.
Title: Re: Survey: Augmentations
Post by: KarmaInferno on <09-19-22/0155:50>
I'd get rid of per-cyberlimb attribute increases entirely.

Have the limbs be always the same as the rest of the body. If you want to boost attributes, get one of the other attribute boosting pieces of 'ware. Muscle Replacement/Toner/Augmentation, etc. Fluff it so that the boost also gets integrated into the limbs in some way if you need to. At most perhaps get an Essence discount on the boosting 'ware per cyberlimb or part you already have.

At the very least make cyberlimbs start at whatever Agility and Strength the existing unaugmented attribute rating the host body has. Starting them at 2 and eating up a point of capacity for every point of attribute just makes cyberlimbs garbage compared to other types of attribute boost, especially since you have to buy it per limb and anytime you do a whole body action you lose all benefit from the cyberlimb attribute boosts.
Title: Re: Survey: Augmentations
Post by: Finstersang on <09-19-22/1236:39>
I wholeheartedly agree in regards to the Cyberlimbs. Right now, capacity is the biggest problem. If you want limbs with decent Agi and Strength values, thereīs hardly enough space left for interesting gadgets and weapons, especially if you go for realistic limbs. IMO the best way to fix the issue would be a return of Custom Cyberlimbs that start with higher base stats without giving up capacity.

Some more suggestions:

Title: Re: Survey: Augmentations
Post by: Hobbes on <09-19-22/1655:21>

  • Donīt skimp too much on "niche" ware! These are often way better to reflect a characterīs weird life choices and priorities than the big pieces of ware that everyone takes for the flat dice pool bonuses. A waste compartment (a.k.a. shit compressor) and Tremor Compensation are way more flavourful for an Ex-Military Sniper than just the boring olī Muscle-Toner/Wired Reflexes Combo ;)

Please.  And make the costs consistent.  Pick Pocket Fingers that give a bonus to Palming should cost less than a Reflex Recorder for Stealth.  And so on. 

Stuff that grants edge to a dice roll should be cheaper than stuff that grants edge to your pool.  And in general should be in line with Sunguard Jewelry or similar gear.  i.e. cheap.

Implants that neutralize/immunize/reduce status effects would be neat.

Action Economy stuff.  "Gap Closer Reflex Bundle" Refund the minor action to Move if you close to melee.  Auto Dodge/Auto Block.  Threat Detector - Automatic Prone from Blast attacks. 

Title: Re: Survey: Augmentations
Post by: KarmaInferno on <09-19-22/2125:54>
Regarding 4th Edition: I dearly missed the more messed-up options like "Jarhead"-style Cyborgs or the "Dark Magic" Cyberzombies in 5th Edition - especially as a GM! Not every option has to be open (or "attractive") for the actual players. Sometimes, you just want to throw a -2.3 Ess. Troll with Cyberpsychosis and tank tracks for legs at the party and wreak havoc 8)

You can kinda do this with Transhumanism from 6th World Companion.

It's basically a kind of Initiation for Mundanes. You spend Karma to get Grades just like Initiation, but instead of magical power each Grade level adds a point of Essence Hole that can be filled with augmentations without affecting your actual Essence rating.
Title: Re: Survey: Augmentations
Post by: MercilessMing on <09-20-22/1127:07>
Medical port.  We've got the optional rule to "imagine there's a medical port".  Now make one, so samurai can heal better.

I agree with the general sentiment around cyberlimbs and wish they were set up in a way that you purchase them to match your attributes, require natural attributes of a certain level to acquire, and let the STR/AGI inside them be further augmented via Muscle Replacement cyberware.  More synergy between muscle systems and cyberlimbs would be appreciated and cure longstanding issues.  (The fluff around muscle replacement as "vat grown muscles and calcium treatments" should be changed to be more artificial, because that's describing a bioware system and doesn't jibe with augmentation overdrive). 
Make cyberlimbs as easy as possible.

+1 to the tin foil hat augment, even if it becomes a manatech solution.

Echolocation ears

Eyes in the back of your head

Drug injectors

Social/cosmetic ware: face plates, along with manufacturing equipment to make them based on video or scan data?  face shaping ware?

For NPCs: How about some thought control, a little puppet tech to keep your troops in line, keep them in the meat grinder longer?

More specialized fingertip compartments, smuggling compartments, and skin pockets.  Autopicker fingertip compartment is the low hanging fruit here.

I know swappable cyberlimbs were a thing and that's likely to come back right?  I really enjoy cyberlimbs and the gadgets they can sport, just keep the bookeeping to a minimum, please don't invent subsystems with their own stats and mods and tests and skills to use.

Also when writing about augments, mention interesting ways they can be hacked: removable limbs popping off the body, for instance.

Title: Re: Survey: Augmentations
Post by: Greysword on <09-21-22/0002:34>
Ok, since you asked  ;)

How about new rules (maybe optional) that provide magic immunity to individuals that have cyberware, based on their Essence score.  Physical magic (like physical combat or manipulation spells) might not be effected, but Mana based combat spells and those in the illusion, health, or detection categories may be effected.  Of course, those that impact machines will still impact the cyber'd person.  I think you have the idea, though. 

The goal is to even the playing field with the mage clan, if possible.

Also while I have you, proper Addiction (and recovery) rules would be nice.

Thanks for listening!
Title: Re: Survey: Augmentations
Post by: KarmaInferno on <09-21-22/1232:57>
Expanding on the False Face idea, some sort of bodysculpting 'ware, for both meat and synthetic cyberlimbs. Subcutaneous bladders that can be adjusted to change your body shape.
Title: Re: Survey: Augmentations
Post by: Greysword on <09-22-22/0008:27>
If I may, I would also like to request a review the state of cybersecurity in this edition. 

As it stands, a cyber'd up gorilla of a man only has three options to keep that two-bit dime store decker wannabe from completely taking over his chrome filled body.  1) a comlink with (at best) a 3/1 defense/firewall rating; 2) a cyberjack (which has a high essence and nuyen cost); and 3) a rigger control console (not built nor optimized for this purpose).

Now, it's been said that the chromed monsters of the sixth world should work with their decker to keep them safe.  However, what happens in-between runs when Cyber Sam walks into his local Stuffer Shack to buy a Charleston Chew and finds himself jumped by a group of go-ganger initiates looking to prove themselves?  Normally not a problem, except one is a matrix wiz who can paralyze Sammie with just a thought, allowing his kin to do the rest.

The best cyber protection, from a cost standpoint, comes from option 3, implanting a RCC (even a "scratch built junk" version), as it only costs 0.3 Essence and the price of the console.

It seems to me that cyberjacks could probably have a (significantly) reduced essence cost, as it is likely a neural interface (like a DNI) with a micro-circuit board.  Another option might be a version of the cyberjack that cannot interface with a cyberdeck, permitting only the defensive qualities.  Of course, perhaps instead of implanting a regular comlink, the cyber-comlink might have better D/F ratings, since it interfaces directly with a person's brain.

In any case, it only took five (in game) years for armor and cybersecurity to fall way behind (way, way behind) their opposite attack forms.  With everyone running around with un-securable technology, the 2080's will be known as a decker's golden age.

Thanks for listening!
Title: Re: Survey: Augmentations
Post by: Hobbes on <09-22-22/0919:26>
You forgot Wireless off.

And consider, if the Sami gets an option to be decker proof, does the decker get an option to be bullet proof?

Scratch built Junk RCC, build it into your Bike, not your head.  Run Silent, Run Deep program.  Hope for best.  Ultimately Wireless bonuses in 6th are pretty small.  Wireless off isn't a terrible option.
Title: Re: Survey: Augmentations
Post by: Greysword on <09-23-22/0126:37>
Turning off wireless is a great option, but the corps want everyone to be wireless on, and that includes runners.  They build whiz features for that. 

As for the second option listed, I don't think a Sami will every be able to fight off a "real" decker (especially with a low to mid Willpower score).  However, they should have enough defense from tech to be able to fend off the average teenager with dreams of being a decker, themselves.

The reason for the ask is not because there is a work around (wireless off).  Instead, it looks like the only ones that have decent cybersecurity are deckers and riggers.  Everyone else gets a max 3 firewall, and only if they pay for the best comlink.  That is a large disparity in five years time.

Maybe I'm being unreasonable, and I apologize if I am.  I just see a significant hole in basic cybersecurity in a world that lives and breaths through their wireless connections.
Title: Re: Survey: Augmentations
Post by: Aria on <09-23-22/0400:47>
Have you checked out Banshee's thought's on the matrix values of commlinks?  We use this as a houserule!
Title: Re: Survey: Augmentations
Post by: Greysword on <09-23-22/1738:45>
Thanks Aria!  Do the alternate D/F numbers in your spreadsheet come from this?

LOVE your character generator spreadsheet, BTW!!
Title: Re: Survey: Augmentations
Post by: Beta on <09-25-22/1815:02>
I'm a big fan of a lot of the oddities toward the back end of chrome flesh, that is the symbiotes, the nanite based ware and equipment, and the geneware -- but thematically all the odd little enhancements.  I'm not asking that everything be ported over to 6e, and I admit I've yet to make the character that uses Smart Articulation or Skeletal Pneumacity, but those sorts of things get my brain racing, making me think of the sort of character (PC or NPC) that would make use of them, and so it widens my SR world more than something that fine-tunes popular enhancements does.  (and for that matter I have used the enhanced stomach that lowers your lifestyle cost, the electrical-eel type gland, and one or two other odd-ball things that I could squeeze in more for flavour/RP than anything else.  Although I really wised that the electrical-eel gland had an option that let you re-charge devices at a slow rate, would have made increased RP utility).

I second the suggestion above to have more things that use the wild die.  I wasn't a huge fan of the wild die, but since it is part of the rules might as well make use of it -- I do like how it works out for some weapons in Firing Squad.

Given the heavy demand on minor actions for characters with low reaction enhancements, relatively cheap ware that lets some specific minor action be done freely, or two minor actions to be combined, could be interesting?  Although likely too easily also used by those who already have a lot of minor action options.

Anything that helps generate edge outside of combat.  Avoiding abuse could be a challenge, but I like the idea of a character getting edge because they were 'doing their thing' really well, be that parkour or looking good or being unnoticed.  (I could also see exotic geneware giving targeted edge for specific skills, where it gives more instincts from some species good at the skill in question).