[Stainless Steel Devil Rat]

So, um...will the Neo-Tokyo Shadowrun Missions stay 5E until the campaign finishes, or will the campaign convert to 6E (a process likely to be painful and confusing for everyone involved)?


If we don't convert, Missions isn't promoting the new products (one of the big reasons for its existence).  If we do convert, how many players does Missions lose in the process?  This is why I wasn't expecting a new version until 2021...


Having just paid for all the relevant modules for HeroLab, I suspect I'll be rather annoyed if everything I bought is useless by the end of the year.

I'm highly interested (and invested) in this answer as well, and I suspect that even if I knew the answer I couldn't share it yet by this point.

But we do have a precedent to look at: 4 to 5e.  They STILL have the rules for converting season 1-4 characters to 5E in the FAQ. I'd imagine something similar is coming for 5E to 6E SRM.

Why do people keep saying edge is gone, but then in the next sentence say edge is everywhere?

Peeps it cannot be both gone and everywhere, that doesn't make any sense. As Edge is obviously not gone, so explain it's mechanics.

Well those who know didn't (or couldn't) say in detail during the early podcasts. Those of us bandying it in the forum are paraphrasing, and some (even me) may have gotten misconceptions about what was said in deliberately vague terms.

As best as *I* understand, Edge is primarily a rules system (although apparently, it may also be an attribute as well).

The take-home I got was Edge represents advantages you have in any opposed conflict: fighting, vehicle chases, social interactions, etc.
One example they gave is if you're fighting a ganger in a dark alleyway and you have low light vision and he doesn't, rather than that manifesting as a dice penalty instead you get a point of edge. Edge refreshes every scene rather than every mission, and so it kind of replaces both the reroll and situational bonuses/penalties mechanics from 5E.  They said you can spend edge in 6E to do things like reroll dice, but also to do many more things even healing a box of damage.

[Michael Chandra]

More recap:

1 pass per turn, 1 initiative roll per combat, edge can be used to alter initiative order.
1+dicecount Minor & 1 Major actions. Trade 4 minor for a second major. R+I+xd6 score.
Movement is a Minor action.
Grunts can be combined into 1 attack per up to 5 grunts.

Spells no Force: modular spell components to allow for eventual easier own spell design.   Instead can amp up spell (e.g. not M/2 damage but amp with 2 but 4 more drain, boost the area, elemental effects, etc) which simply increases drain.
Different healing spells e.g. just heal or also fix specific elemental damage status effect.
Elemental effects apparently more interesting mechanic-wise (e.g. on-fire status).
Matrix 2 skills for legal vs non legal.
Matrix attributes are way different now since no more limits.
No more Marks.
Hacking approach in advance between attack and sleaze (penalty if your action doesn't fit approach)
Decks cheaper but Cyberjacks added to help with matrix defense, allow you to customise your attributes more.

Chargen: metahumans less expensive, including at lowest prio level available (with less SAPs). Metahumans have additional SAP-expenditure options.

Almost everything gearwise available at chargen. You want to launch rockets? Go ahead. Just keep in mind the law will come after you.

[Beta]

The 1 and 2 Glitch thing is on maneuvers list I take it?

Yes, it was explicitly chosen from the list of edge options in the mini-combat play out they did.  Chosen just because "I've never been able to do this before"  Other options seemed to include using 2 edge to get an additional die on a roll.

[Lormyr]

The 1 and 2 Glitch thing is on maneuvers list I take it?

Correct. 5 cost if I recall correctly.

[Beta]

Why do people keep saying edge is gone, but then in the next sentence say edge is everywhere?

Peeps it cannot be both gone and everywhere, that doesn't make any sense. As Edge is obviously not gone, so explain it's mechanics.

All just based on the podcast:

They got rid of the 5th edition Edge system (where Edge ~ Luck).

They introduced a new system, also called edge (where Edge ~ situational advantage). 

The new edge is something you use all the time, that re-sets for every situation, and which has much more incremental effects compared to using edge in 5th.

[Marcus]

The 1 and 2 Glitch thing is on maneuvers list I take it?

Yes, it was explicitly chosen from the list of edge options in the mini-combat play out they did.  Chosen just because "I've never been able to do this before"  Other options seemed to include using 2 edge to get an additional die on a roll.

I will wait to see what the rules say, but that makes me deeply concerned. The math on that is gonna be really bad if you like large pools.

[Stainless Steel Devil Rat]

The way they made it sound (or maybe I'm already conflating other people's opinion for what was said) was that you don't reroll all failures like in 5E... rerolling 1 die = 1 edge expenditure

[Michael Chandra]

>Weapon ranges are now more like Anarchy (e.g. five broad ranges/buckets) rather than specific ranges in meters for each weapon type
So I may as well snipe with a pistol instead of a sniper rifle? Boooooo.

No, there's 5 global ranges and each weapon has its own Attack Ratings for specific ranges. The example they gave was that an Ares Predator has 10 in the first 2 ranges, while a Sniper Rifle still has an attack rating in the Extreme range category.

Minor/Major instead of Free/2SimpleOr1Complex means different action economy, so I'm not discounting it yet. With AR-vs-DR being a way to score Edge, Armor will definitely be relevant.

I don't think having to track Edge will be that bad, since all we need is some kind of counters. Plenty of those around. But we'll see how annoying it becomes.

Decks + Cyberjacks combination is probably meant for you to have more combination options, so you can finetune your matrix abilities more. Makes more sense than being strictly locked down by only specific combinations being available.

JM Hardy says that Limits no longer are needed because the problem they were meant to solve (which I liked them for) no longer is a concern to them with the new system.

Oh, and No Future physical print will become dual-statted, while there will be some kind of pdf update for that as well.

I agree with the concern about a bad roll being both a failed cast and horrible drain.

Lormyr, with probably more damage (since no more massive soak pools) and less attacks per turn, it might not be that bad. But we'll see how annoying or good the new Edge system turns out.

[Ghost Rigger]

JM Hardy says that Limits no longer are needed because the problem they were meant to solve (which I liked them for) no longer is a concern to them with the new system.

But I loved having that problem.

[Marcus]

The fact is if 1-2 are glitches and 5-6 are still successes then your success chance == your glitch chance. Then Obviously Scaling that means you're increasing both equally. Which means your odds of one being more then other also scales. So the higher your pool, the higher your glitch chance and Critical glitch (if that is still a thing) also increases. It means the better you are at something then from the system perspective the more likely you are at screwing it up, while doing it. That is very not good from the player perspective.

Game theory default assumption is that players will be successful. So as soon as you roll dice you add the chance for failure, the more rolls the greater the chance of failure. Now we usually mitigate this fact by having characters be very "good" at what they roll, ie making it very unlikely to fail, but when that changes to the better you are the more likely you are to screwing it up, well see above.

[Lormyr]

Lormyr, with probably more damage (since no more massive soak pools) and less attacks per turn, it might not be that bad. But we'll see how annoying or good the new Edge system turns out.

I agree, I can't have a final thought until I know the exact options for both sides. I know my game mechanics and math quite well though, and that math presently looks ugly.

[Marcus]

Well we can ask on the 29th, and see these joker have clue of what they are doing. I seriously hope they are ready to errata some stuff. I don't even want to be at the table when some serous players sit down and start rolling with something like a 50% glitch chance.

[Stainless Steel Devil Rat]

Well we can ask on the 29th, and see these joker have clue of what they are doing. I seriously hope they are ready to errata some stuff. I don't even want to be at the table when some serous players sit down and start rolling with something like a 50% glitch chance.

We are talking about glitches being on 1s and 2s ONLY when someone spends edge offensively to make it so for an opponent, right? Because that's the way I understand this topic works.

[Banshee]

Well we can ask on the 29th, and see these joker have clue of what they are doing. I seriously hope they are ready to errata some stuff. I don't even want to be at the table when some serous players sit down and start rolling with something like a 50% glitch chance.

We are talking about glitches being on 1s and 2s ONLY when someone spends edge offensively to make it so for an opponent, right? Because that's the way I understand this topic works.

yes, it is only when someone spends a bunch of edge (I dont have my copy in front of me right now) but I think it is a 5 point edge boost so it is a doozy and rightfully so will have a major impact when used properly

[Michael Chandra]

Well we can ask on the 29th, and see these joker have clue of what they are doing. I seriously hope they are ready to errata some stuff. I don't even want to be at the table when some serous players sit down and start rolling with something like a 50% glitch chance.

We are talking about glitches being on 1s and 2s ONLY when someone spends edge offensively to make it so for an opponent, right? Because that's the way I understand this topic works.

yes, it is only when someone spends a bunch of edge (I dont have my copy in front of me right now) but I think it is a 5 point edge boost so it is a doozy and rightfully so will have a major impact when used properly

Player: "Hey, our research said this one guy doesn't get along well with technology, right?"
GM: "Yes?"
Player: "And he's wielding a modern gun?"
GM: "Yes...."
Player: "Okay, he must have Gremlins. I'm making him glitch on 2s as well."
GM: "... Frag."