[Kanly]

~Bullpup: they have a more advantageous Conceal modifier too, which seems to be based of size. So that table could help maybe?

[Dracain]

Since quickening is rather easy to cheese, I figured a house rule might be nice, so I came up with two ways to deal with it. 

A:  You can only quicken an amount of spells equal to your initiate rank

or

B:  Quickening has levels, and you can only quicken an amount of spells equal to your quickening level. 

I prefer A personally, but either work. 

[martinchaen]

I think our house rule for quickening is that you have to spend at least as much karma as the force of the spell you want to quicken.

Want to quicken Force 6 Detect Enemies? Costs at least 6 karma. This helps with the exploitation factor. Not sure if we made it so that you also only get the benefit of extra karma spent in terms of dispelling.

[Tuoweit]

I am building an Aspected Magician as an NPC, and I came across an oddity with Mentor Spirits:  Many of the Magician bonuses for Mentor Spirits are either casting-specific or conjuring-specific.

To work around this and make Mentor Spirits way more useful for Aspected Magicians (and slightly more flexible for full Magicians), I plan to use this house rule: 

The Magician bonuses for Mentor Spirits that apply to "spells, preparations, and rituals" can alternatively apply to summoning the appropriate category of Spirit, according to the Magician's tradition (e.g. Combat Spirits for Dragonslayer, which would be Fire spirits for Hermetics or Beast Spirits for Shamans).  Conversely, Magician bonuses which apply to summoning a specific kind of Spirit can alternatively be applied to the spells, preparations, and rituals of the appropriate category (e.g. Water Spells for Sea, which would be Illusion for Hermetics and Detection for Shamans.)  This is an either/or choice, the Magician doesn't get both bonuses.

(Rat's a bit of a special case, since its bonus is strictly for Alchemy.  For completeness I'd allow Rat the choice of either bonus to Man, following the above rules.)

[JackVII]

With some of the opposition to the recent progressive recoil errata, I thought about what house rule I could implement to create a happy medium between the two rule sets. Here's what I came up with so far. It does a bit of a hit to FA users, but FA seems pretty powerful at the moment, particularly the simple action 6-round burst.

SA: Works as errata
BF: Requires the Take Aim action or a full action phase of non-shooting actions to clear progressive recoil. This use of the Take Aim action does not provide the standard benefits of Take Aim, it only clears progressive recoil, If no progressive recoil exists, Take Aim works as normal.
FA: 6 & 10 round FA bursts are both Complex Actions and otherwise work as errata.

[WellsIDidIt]

I've restructured firearms in my games. I did this in SR4 as well, but here is the basics layout:

Skill Group: Firearms
Pistols
Longarms
Heavy Weapons

Instead of using automatics, which I found to be non-sense, Pistols includes everything up to SMGs (if it can be fired one handed basically) and Longarms covers everything short of a machine gun. Heavy Weapons isn't changed at all.

Another house rule I use involves gunnery. If a vehicle mounted weapon is being fired while the vehicle is not moving, the player may use the appropriate non-gunnery attack skill.

So a player firing a mounted machine gun can use Heavy Weapons if the vehicle is not moving.

[Geewaagh]

Movement issue for me:

- Too fast of movement rate
-Poof, I'm across the make on first pass before anyone can do anything
- Spend complex action to sprint, get 0 hits? You do nothing for your init pass, sorry! (I hate tell PCs that)
- Rate is too varied.  AGL 7 goes 7x faster than AGL.  This seems unreasonable. Level the playing field a bit please.  World record is not 7x fast in sprint than I am, and I am pretty low on AGL scale.

My Movement Fix
Neither my NPC's or PC's ever use movement outside of pass one (mostly) or pass two.  Could they move on pass three? sure! do they? not that often. Based on that, I think I will house rule the following:

- Movement cost you a free action and goes in pass 1 and pass 2, even if you only get one init pass.  You still get to move in 2nd pass for free action move.
- Movement is based on AGL+3, not 2x.  This means a 3 AGL is still AGLx2, but slows down top end a bit and speed up bottom end a bit.
- Movement rate is all you get during your 2 free passes.
-Sprinting: Complex like usual, but you get Movement Rate + net hits instead of just net hits. If you do nothing but sprinting for two passes, it get you back up to the 4x AGL from RAW.

Comments?  Glaring isssues?

[Michael Chandra]

You're screwing over Mages, who already need their Free Actions to center AND to counterspell AND to give their Spirits instructions, and their full Complex action to attack. Same for Melee characters, who need that movement more than gunbunnies.

The smoothing over of Movement rate seems nice though, helps balance things a bit more and it's a bit more fair to sprinters. Can't say if the exact way it's done is how I'd do it but the idea is nice.

[Namikaze]

I thought that once you started moving, you kept the movement rate throughout the whole Turn.  If you walk or run it doesn't cost you an action (that only happens with sprinting).  And with sprinting, your hits add to your movement, not replace it.

Characters walk normally (pp 161-162).  When they exceed their Agility x2 in meters in a Turn, they are classified as "running"  (pg 162).  Running is used for any movement up to agility x4 (pg 162).  When a character sprints, they increase their distance traveled in that Action Phase by 1 meter per hit (for dwarves and trolls) or 2 meters per hit (for everyone else) (pg 162).

I think you've got the way that movement works wrong, but I could just be mis-interpreting your post.

[Michael Chandra]

I thought that once you started moving, you kept the movement rate throughout the whole Turn.  If you walk or run it doesn't cost you an action (that only happens with sprinting).  And with sprinting, your hits add to your movement, not replace it.

You're correct (and intended movement that you cancel counts as well), however, you can use all of your movement rate in a single pass. If you try Sprinting then and don't score hits, your movement allowment won't go up so you end up not being able to cover any extra distance.

[Geewaagh]

Michael:
If you exceed walk in RAW, you lose all free actions for rest of turn anyway.
I see your point, though, and maybe could consider it as movement in addition to free action.

What I wanted to control was spreading out movement over two passes instead of "poof" your there.
My experience thus far with the game is that if there are melee types on the board and want to be in contact with enemy or if there is a place you want to be, then place your self there. Because movement is large and instantaneous on first phase.  All other games I have played lets you pull the trigger before someone can be own you from 24 meters away.  Just seems like all the movement rules could be removed and just ask character where he wants to be at status of his pass.

Namikaze
I understand the movement system in the rules. And yes, once you go over walking, you are considered running for rest of turn. But all the physical movement happens when you want it too.   In my table, that means all of it on first pass.  I play on tactical map. Most is in doors so 20 meters is a pretty large distance. At stat of my players passes, they put themselves where they want and there they stay unit end of combat. No one really moves, IMO.

Which also drives me to another idea. Anyone ever use Zones in the FATE system?  Think it could work for shadowrun?

[Namikaze]

See, I interpreted the rules to imply that movement happens throughout the 3 seconds of the Action Phase.  I guess I just sort of smoothed out the movement throughout the turn in my head.  Though I could see with a tactical map how this might be an incredibly difficult thing to do.  Now I understand what you're going for here.

Perhaps say that movement works like this:

Any turn that your total movement has exceeded AGI x2 is considered running and gets the benefits and penalties of such.  To move beyond that in a single turn requires Sprinting with a Running test to determine how far they can push beyond that limit?

[Kanly]

How would you cover charging? When an opponent is within walk range but you still want to run up to attack in melee.

[Michael Chandra]

See, I interpreted the rules to imply that movement happens throughout the 3 seconds of the Action Phase.  I guess I just sort of smoothed out the movement throughout the turn in my head.

Yeah, it represents such movement but it got turned into 'doesn't matter when you take it', which is an abstraction that has both upsides and downsides.

[Namikaze]

How would you cover charging? When an opponent is within walk range but you still want to run up to attack in melee.

A charge attack shouldn't be possible unless you're running.  That's how the rules currently cover it, at least.  If I want to charge a target 3 meters away from me on my first Action Phase, then I can't get the charge bonuses.  Weird.

That should maybe be changed too.  Perhaps if the attacker is outside of Reach of the weapon being used, they can declare a charge action (Complex, Melee Attack with movement)?