[All4BigGuns]

As for dice pools system in SR5, why not have them as such:

Base attribute + skill (in # of dice to be rolled), and then have a range of difficulties to succeed (the higher the difficulty, the more heroic the result)

If anyone has played Star Wars D6, then you'll understand what I mean about the "Range of Difficulties".

Kind of what I was thinking. For a more clear idea of what I mean by the target number per die thing, see the Old World of Darkness (vastly superior to the new one to my way of thinking--at least pre-revised).

[Ragnarok]

As for dice pools system in SR5, why not have them as such:

Base attribute + skill (in # of dice to be rolled), and then have a range of difficulties to succeed (the higher the difficulty, the more heroic the result)

If anyone has played Star Wars D6, then you'll understand what I mean about the "Range of Difficulties".

Kind of what I was thinking. For a more clear idea of what I mean by the target number per die thing, see the Old World of Darkness (vastly superior to the new one to my way of thinking--at least pre-revised).

The scary thing is is that Wikipedia classified SR4's system as very similar to nWoD's system.

[Kylen]

See, my ONLY issue with 4A at the moment, other then Initiative, which I believe is THE big issue with it, is the fact that 2/3s of the die is worthless to the player. The chances of rolling 5s and 6s on 12 dice? Not nearly as high as you think. My DM knows how many times I've busted all out with 20+ dice for an attack and got 1, count it, 1 hit. A MAJORITY of the dice I had were 2s, 3s and 4s. No ones, and a single 5.

Now, I'm not saying that every number except 1 needs to be a hit. That's just foolish. I'd LIKE to see 4-6 be hits. That still leaves room for error via luck, but given the fact that our characters are PROFESSIONALS in their chosen fields, I personally think they should have a 50/50 chance (I know the actual odds don't break down like that) of a hit on every die they throw. Then again, I don't tend to use a lot of Edge. I mean, this isn't Dark Heresy after all.

[All4BigGuns]

See, my ONLY issue with 4A at the moment, other then Initiative, which I believe is THE big issue with it, is the fact that 2/3s of the die is worthless to the player. The chances of rolling 5s and 6s on 12 dice? Not nearly as high as you think. My DM knows how many times I've busted all out with 20+ dice for an attack and got 1, count it, 1 hit. A MAJORITY of the dice I had were 2s, 3s and 4s. No ones, and a single 5.

Now, I'm not saying that every number except 1 needs to be a hit. That's just foolish. I'd LIKE to see 4-6 be hits. That still leaves room for error via luck, but given the fact that our characters are PROFESSIONALS in their chosen fields, I personally think they should have a 50/50 chance (I know the actual odds don't break down like that) of a hit on every die they throw. Then again, I don't tend to use a lot of Edge. I mean, this isn't Dark Heresy after all.

At a base it is foolish, however, circumstances can make the chances of success just that easy, hence the variable TN on the die through modifiers. It goes both ways as well as such a system could push a difficulty to 6 requiring (exaggeration but barely possible) 6 or 7 hits to succeed. Things like range, high ground and attacker in melee would affect those with smartlink adding dice (though affecting the target number in a positive manner might not be bad considering there would likely be more negative modifiers than positive).

[Crimsondude]

As for dice pools system in SR5, why not have them as such:

Base attribute + skill (in # of dice to be rolled), and then have a range of difficulties to succeed (the higher the difficulty, the more heroic the result)

If anyone has played Star Wars D6, then you'll understand what I mean about the "Range of Difficulties".

Kind of what I was thinking. For a more clear idea of what I mean by the target number per die thing, see the Old World of Darkness (vastly superior to the new one to my way of thinking--at least pre-revised).

The scary thing is is that Wikipedia classified SR4's system as very similar to nWoD's system.

Because it was based on nWoD with D6 instead of D10.

[Ragnarok]

JM:

And that's why I consider SWD6 and CWoD's systems as being among the best rpg systems out there.

[Mirikon]

Personally, the systems I prefer are SR4, D&D 3.5, M&M2, and Hero 5th. With the exception of Hero System, they are all fairly simple systems, that can scale easily to different power levels. Hero system, of course, is anything but simple, but it provides a very good tactical experience.

Personally, you would have to pay me (very well) to even touch mechanics like SR3, Heroes Unlimited, Marvel's FASERIP, D&D4, or M&M3. Especially the last two. The creators of those two drekheaps need to be thrown on a pyre of their own sourcebooks.

[FastJack]

See, my ONLY issue with 4A at the moment, other then Initiative, which I believe is THE big issue with it, is the fact that 2/3s of the die is worthless to the player. The chances of rolling 5s and 6s on 12 dice? Not nearly as high as you think. My DM knows how many times I've busted all out with 20+ dice for an attack and got 1, count it, 1 hit. A MAJORITY of the dice I had were 2s, 3s and 4s. No ones, and a single 5.

Now, I'm not saying that every number except 1 needs to be a hit. That's just foolish. I'd LIKE to see 4-6 be hits. That still leaves room for error via luck, but given the fact that our characters are PROFESSIONALS in their chosen fields, I personally think they should have a 50/50 chance (I know the actual odds don't break down like that) of a hit on every die they throw. Then again, I don't tend to use a lot of Edge. I mean, this isn't Dark Heresy after all.

Step 1: Get 100 Karma.
Step 2: Purchase Legendary Positive Quality from Street Legends (Hits on 4,5,6).
Step 3: Profit.

[JustADude]

See, my ONLY issue with 4A at the moment, other then Initiative, which I believe is THE big issue with it, is the fact that 2/3s of the die is worthless to the player. The chances of rolling 5s and 6s on 12 dice? Not nearly as high as you think. My DM knows how many times I've busted all out with 20+ dice for an attack and got 1, count it, 1 hit. A MAJORITY of the dice I had were 2s, 3s and 4s. No ones, and a single 5.

Now, I'm not saying that every number except 1 needs to be a hit. That's just foolish. I'd LIKE to see 4-6 be hits. That still leaves room for error via luck, but given the fact that our characters are PROFESSIONALS in their chosen fields, I personally think they should have a 50/50 chance (I know the actual odds don't break down like that) of a hit on every die they throw. Then again, I don't tend to use a lot of Edge. I mean, this isn't Dark Heresy after all.

Step 1: Get 100 Karma.
Step 2: Purchase Legendary Positive Quality from Street Legends (Hits on 4,5,6).
Step 3: Profit.

That's not Missions Legal by any chance, is it?

[Stahlseele]

As long as Bull himself hasn't said no anywhere yet, i think it is legal . .
But i don't think that something like that would get by the cranky old ork.

[JustADude]

As long as Bull himself hasn't said no anywhere yet, i think it is legal . .
But i don't think that something like that would get by the cranky old ork.

Oh, wait, they have to have earned at least 500 karma. No way a Missions character is going to last that long, so the point is moot.

[Kylen]

Now, I keep seeing reference to a target number. I never referenced such a thing, and to my knowledge there are VERY few times in 4A that you have such a thing, specifically crafting to my knowledge, and I think high resource purchases.

I'd just like my character who is specialized in lockpicking to have a much better then average chance at picking that lock then some slothead who just loaded up a skillsoft at the highesft rank.

[Stahlseele]

The Target Number in SR4 is always 5 or 6 and each roll of 5 or 6 on a single die constitutes a hit.
And then you need a specific number of hits to achieve what you set out to do with that roll. Or rolls, in the case of extended tests.
So, technically, there is no TargetNumber ever in SR4. And with legendary status, you can get a hit on a roll of 4 too.
SR4 only has hit yes/no and enough hits yes/no.
SR3 had Target numbers that went all over the place from 2 if you were fortunate to 20 if you were unfortunate.
And then you still needed a specific number of successes(managed to roll the TN of X with 1 dice) to do certain stuff.
TN of 2 means nothing if you need 10 successes and only have 5 dice to roll with . .

[WellSpokenRunner]

When I was GMing SR3, I loved to mess with my team by saying "roll all your dice and just tell me how many 6s you get so you can roll again."

[All4BigGuns]

The Target Number in SR4 is always 5 or 6 and each roll of 5 or 6 on a single die constitutes a hit.
And then you need a specific number of hits to achieve what you set out to do with that roll. Or rolls, in the case of extended tests.
So, technically, there is no TargetNumber ever in SR4. And with legendary status, you can get a hit on a roll of 4 too.
SR4 only has hit yes/no and enough hits yes/no.
SR3 had Target numbers that went all over the place from 2 if you were fortunate to 20 if you were unfortunate.
And then you still needed a specific number of successes(managed to roll the TN of X with 1 dice) to do certain stuff.
TN of 2 means nothing if you need 10 successes and only have 5 dice to roll with . .

The only way you could get down to needing a 2 on a die to get a success/hit, was through difficulty modifiers, which in my opinion, sometimes something is so easy that there is little possibility of failure, but just enough such possibility that a roll is still needed--mainly the possibility that fragging it up severely will have BAD consequences.