[Frost]

I've decided to change things up a bit. The group I GM is of the "Prime Runner" style and operates in a legal capacity under a security firm that one of the players started. Its a cover for them to launder money and lets them take certain legal job in addition to the usual illegal shadowrun work. Well, I've decided to create a very unique situation and issue them a government contract to set up security for a facility that is being built in the Redmond Barrens. They'll be responsible for establishing physical security (i.e. Sentinel drones, razor wire, pits full of ill-tempered sea bass), hiring security personnel (riggers, deckers, etc), and purchasing drones, vehicles and other equipment for traveling to and from the facility. The part I'm having trouble with is how large of a nuyen figure would you give these guys to do this job. It'll be like a normal contract where they have to do the job under budget and within X amount of time to get a bonus.

This may seem a little far fetched but this one is going to be a fun one. The player who started the security firm tends to be more common sense and analytical while the others tend to be more...impulsive. There will be mirth aplenty. I'm spitballing around 7.8 million nuyen in funds for purchasing equipment and hiring personnel, plus another 1.2 million nuyen off the books for bribes, hiring local gang muscle, etc. I know those amounts might seem ridiculous, but I kind of want them to go crazy with the idea. I don't think they'll go too crazy with the stealing of funds after I impress the amount of oversight they will have, but they've surprised me before.   

[Marcus]

I would be very careful, in giving any team a large standing slush fund, and I would always advise against any sort of large scale regular income. Speaking from experience at some point you game losses the essence of shadowrun, and you're just playing D20 Modern.

[Spooky]

If you have fun with it, go for it. In my experience, runners want to set up something mostly permanent, at least as a team base.

[Tecumseh]

There are a lot of questions here, including basics like:

1) How big is the facility? A building? A factory? A city block?
2) What are the potential threats to it? Just the local gangers, or are professionals going to come sniffing?
3) What are the consequences of a security breach? Inconvenience? Catastrophe?
4) How long does security need to be provided? A week? A year?

If you want a number, one approach would be to start with the overall project size from the government's standpoint and make the overall security budget 16-20% of that.

Then, since a lot of this isn't well-defined, you're going to have to decide how much things cost, like IC, the hired help, etc. including the cost-to-quality ratio for each. Presumably the players will enjoy this process as part of their legwork; otherwise don't do it.

The end result will be be the budget surplus - which could grow or shrink depending on how effectively they negotiate with the subcontractors - which represents the players' profits/earnings. This might be a fun risk/reward equation as they attempt to cut corners and pocket as much as possible for themselves, just like all good Johnsons do.

Come to think of it, maybe the better approach is to start with how much profit you want them to earn, then back into the other figures from there. You, the GM, want the players to have ¥500k at their disposal. Their estimated profit margin is 10%, so let's assume that the overall security budget is ¥5MM, and the overall project is ¥25MM. That still gives them the fun of spending the ¥4.5MM while doing their best to optimize the budget.

You can tweak any of those figures (profit, profit margin, security budget, overall budget) to your liking. Whatever makes the most sense in your world.

[Reaver]

You also want to be careful here, as "professional armed security" doesn't pay as well as many people think it does. (and by "Professional armed security" I am talking paramilitary security, as I have had many dealings with them over the years working as a contractor in 2nd and 3rd world countries).

On average, they make about 1/3 to 1/2 of a journeyman's pay rate. Which means around $500 to $1200 a week. (About $2000 to $5000 a month!)

To be perfectly honest, from my experience those that join up with paramilitary security firms are not doing it for the money, they are doing it for "private" reasons, or simply don't have other life skills to fall back on.


***and yes, the quality of service is tied directly to the pay rate!

[ShadowcatX]

Where in the world are you working that $5,000 a month is half a journeyman's payrate?

[Marcus]

LOL some place where a Union is alive and well.

[ShadowcatX]

Every working adult being a multi-millionaire by the age of 50 would require much more than a union in my eyes.

[Reaver]

My base pay rate is $71.75/hr.
x1.5 after 8 hours.
Weekends doubletime.

Even with only a 40 hour week (which I haven't worked in YEARS!) I make a little over $11k a month.

Need me to be a Foreman? 20% more.
Need me to be a safety officer?  15% more.
First Responder? 35% more.


The wages are high because no one wants to be tradesmen anymore. They all want to study "Gender Studies" And the "humanities" and pour coffee at Starbucks for $11/hr.

(So if you are young, and looking for a career, consider the Trades!) 

[DigitalZombie]

I think your numbers are fine as is. 

For ease of play and better opportunities for "incidents' I would split the project up in multiple stages. With not all the funds being available to begin with. They get a total of 9 million for the project- with some knowledge checks/whatever they estimate it will cost them around 8.7million,  leaving them with 300k for partying..... Unless they cut some corners ( which of course is more fun).

For ease of play let's say 4 stages.  Each stage has a budget, time limit goals and bonus/penalty according to results.  ( aaand also an incident,  opportunity to channel some funds to own pockets by cutting corners,  shady deals,  backdoors,  conflicting interests etc, dealing with the crazy mage in the basement themselves as they blew the "wards against toxin shamans" account on whiz new cyberware for their streetsam). 

The security part is split in 3: meat,  magic and matrix.
Maybe split resource wise in 65% physical security,  20% matrix security and 15% magical security.  Where ever they decide to cut corners is where they will have to deal with more incidents.

I would give them an upper limit on how much they could safely steal for themselves.  With a hardcap on how much they could steal without getting automatically caught.

[Overbyte]

I agree with Digital Zombie (and Frost), it's probably best if you handle it in stages.
Many contracts, especially government ones set aside a large pool of money for a project, but don't release that money until milestones are met, reviews completed, etc.

[Seras]

My base pay rate is $71.75/hr.
x1.5 after 8 hours.
Weekends doubletime.

Even with only a 40 hour week (which I haven't worked in YEARS!) I make a little over $11k a month.

Need me to be a Foreman? 20% more.
Need me to be a safety officer?  15% more.
First Responder? 35% more.


The wages are high because no one wants to be tradesmen anymore. They all want to study "Gender Studies" And the "humanities" and pour coffee at Starbucks for $11/hr.

(So if you are young, and looking for a career, consider the Trades!)

In my next life I will be...alas Im to old. I am happy as a nursery school teacher though...another job that no one wants ;-)