[VajraSupremus]

I'm not particularly versed in Scientology, but the idea is that these being come from primarily Astral space, at least the Horrors do. Invae would more likely have physical bodies that they take with them to here, but being that their bodies can't exist here, they perform Merges. Horrors could be completely Astral, stuck on planets when the mana in that area ebbs away, trapping them there and putting them into a torpor due to the lack of power, while others may scramble for the few sites of energy to be inevitably found.

Sorry, I just realized that I got Horrors mixed up with Shedim, but looks like you still got what I was trying to say.

Well, basically Scientology says that we are under attack from ghosts from outer space (Thetans) that slowly drive us insane (that's the reason why Psychology is BS). See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xenu if you're interested in the details.

Are there "normal" metaplanes in your game universe too, or do you want to replace them with alien planets completely ?

There are. Metaplanar dimensions will be either seperate Astral dominions, or areas that are coterminous with celestial bodies(suns, moons, comets, planets). This kind of diversity helps bring up the idea of a homeworld for Invae, and other spiritual beings. Horrors seem most certainly astral, being essentially sapient negative emotions and mana, with attractions to life- infused worlds for sustenance.

[Mason]

How would you imagine the planets of Bugs and Shedim to be like? It seems like a bit of a stretch to me that there is a planet out there where insect life has developed that is identical to that of our planet in most regards, and that their astral presence is greater than that of our home-grown bugs.

The idea of Shedim from outer space would bear some resemblance to Scientology's alien ghosts theory, though. In your game universe, Hubbard might really have been on the right track.

Ender's game.


As for the topic at hand, wouldn't every spirit having a planet make us a type of spirit? If we leave our bodies, that is? Shouldn't that then mean that whenever we leave our bodies (our 'anchors', if you will) that we can be summoned by an extraplanar entity? Could that mean that spirits which pop up here unexpectedly are on a metaplanar quest? If we are spirits, would that make us spirits of man? When we summon spirits of man, are we summoning ancestor spirits, spirits of fellow mages that failed to return from the metaplanes, or what? If we are spirits, can we eventually learn materialization and transcend the need for physical bodies (for a time)?

[ArkangelWinter]

That would certainlt add a new danger to being awakened, being summoned yourself. Could explain freaky nightmares, unsolved disappearances, and any number of strange things.

[VajraSupremus]

Not really though. The theory implies the existence of planetary bodies for only some spirits. Most metaplanar dimensions, like the Elemental Planes for the five known elemental spirits, are Astral, though other little "colonies" can exist( small star home to Fire spirits, Water in space holding Water spirits, etc.)in physical space.

Metahumanity is a physical entity, as is most life on Earth. So unless we develop magic that can conjure us, i doubt we'll be summoned anytime soon.

[ArkangelWinter]

Metahumanity is a physical entity, as is most life on Earth. So unless we develop magic that can conjure us, i doubt we'll be summoned anytime soon.

Still, parts of metahumanity that can Astral Project being "called" while projecting would make an interesting plot device.

[VajraSupremus]

Metahumanity is a physical entity, as is most life on Earth. So unless we develop magic that can conjure us, i doubt we'll be summoned anytime soon.

Still, parts of metahumanity that can Astral Project being "called" while projecting would make an interesting plot device.

Extremely so. Sorta like a spirit using the metahuman version of their "True Name" to bring them there.

[Jareth Valar]

Something VERY similar to this has been the running theory at our table for a long time now.

As a matter of fact, the last campaign (3+ years) we just ended a few months ago merged Shadowrun and Warhammer 40,000 (somewhat, LONG convoluted metaplot ) with this concept.

Horrors = Chaos (Daemons specifically), Invae = A form of scout/pre-invasion force. The reason they look like our bugs is the same reason that when we go to the metaplanes our astral form gets altered to appear to "blend in". 

[Sichr]

Ive got that W40K vs. SRA idea also...for one shot run, since my players tend to be quite militant I want to give them taste of real warfare . Planned that for this years xmass session

[Jareth Valar]

LOL, works wonders omae.

We did a lot of stuff from the Dark Heresy, Deathwatch, Rogue Trader stuff. I even have a direct conversion from their damage system (for gear at least, mever used most of it, but once you know the math it's hard to stop ) to SR4 that everyone at our table thought worked near perfect. (i.e. Unarmored vs. bolter round = chunky bits). Glad to share if interested.

Might be a bit much for most people, but, everyone likes a different flavor.   

[Sichr]

Indeed

[Jareth Valar]

If you have access to the Dark Heresy stuff the math is pretty simple. Add the Min damage and the Max damage and divide the whole thing by 3 (round normal). We just used Pen as AP straight

That makes an auto pistol 5P with SA/FA; a shotgun is 6P, etc.

It gets ugly when you do the advanced weapons, for example:
AutoCannon 18P, AP -4, SA/BF/FA
Heavy Stubber 6P, AP -3, FA
MP Lascannon 25P, AP -10, SS (yes I know lasers are AP-half, but this makes more sense
IG Boltgun 7P, AP -4, SA/BF

That's not even the Astartes stuff. 
Their boltgun is like a BF panther cannon (only 1 more damage) 

[Dampfish]

That would certainlt add a new danger to being awakened, being summoned yourself. Could explain freaky nightmares, unsolved disappearances, and any number of strange things.

As well as comas. People don't wake up because their spirits have been summoned to another plane.

[Irian]

What if Horrors and Shadow spirits and Invae live on the astral planes(or even physical areas) of other planets

Nice theorey, but I think it doesn't fly. Why? Because the metaplanes are much more than any other planet could be. There's a metaplane with cowboys, equipped with clockwork-cyberware riding on dinosaurs, for example. That simply doesn't feel like another planet. You could try to explain horrors with "from another planet", ok, but many, many other things you cannot explain that way. So personally I would say, no, it's pretty unlikely, that the metaplanes - the place where all these beings come from - are simply different planets, connected by the astral space. They are much more than that, not even bound by the same basic physical laws as our world. Another planet would follow similar rules, but the metaplanes aren't bound by these rules. Thus they aren't simply a physical place somewhere else and thus cannot be another planet.

[VajraSupremus]

What if Horrors and Shadow spirits and Invae live on the astral planes(or even physical areas) of other planets

Nice theorey, but I think it doesn't fly. Why? Because the metaplanes are much more than any other planet could be. There's a metaplane with cowboys, equipped with clockwork-cyberware riding on dinosaurs, for example. That simply doesn't feel like another planet. You could try to explain horrors with "from another planet", ok, but many, many other things you cannot explain that way. So personally I would say, no, it's pretty unlikely, that the metaplanes - the place where all these beings come from - are simply different planets, connected by the astral space. They are much more than that, not even bound by the same basic physical laws as our world. Another planet would follow similar rules, but the metaplanes aren't bound by these rules. Thus they aren't simply a physical place somewhere else and thus cannot be another planet.

You kinda missed the follow-up, unless i wasn't clear. The potential for other specific spiritual beings to have physical counterparts to their metaplanar homes is incredibly viable. Similar to Primordial spirits who make homes on our world, there could parallels on other planets like this. That's the theory. Not just Invae or Horrors, but any spirit with a penchant for territorial proclivities. Anywhere from Hive-worlds and giant crypts full of corpses to play with or anything a spirit's power could conjure into being.

[ArkangelWinter]

And besides, who says our concepts of physics or even logic would apply to strange dual-naturex beings? Especially of the "alien and superior" type, like F6+ spirits