[Ultra Violet]

It is more a fluff goes rules thinking...
The origin of a new AI. Not as a fighting war drone more like an understanding and caring companion a friend of metahumanity and an ambassador to them.
Another house rule could be a reversion of the "Synthetic Sympathy" quality so called "Biologic Sympathy" and gives the AI the same bonus for socializing with sapient living beings.
Or in other words it is not a real point in that discussion, only an idea for an interesting maybe (N)PC.

[Bradd]

I'm unlocking the thread by request, but I ask that folks please try to stay on on topic: How to handle cheap emotitoys so that they don't upstage much more expensive software. Tangents are OK, but if you'd like to discuss a side point at length, please start a new topic.

Wraith235 pointed out something interesting: The cheap toy version of this should only be Device Rating 2, and yet it can run a rating 6 emosoft. I think that's further evidence that the toys are not running fully capable sensorsofts. (The alternative is that they're better computers than most military commlinks, which I hope we can agree is absurd.)

Anyway, I don't personally have any issue with the emosoft, so I don't want to get bogged down in arguing about it. I don't think the drone version is as much of a problem either, although I'd still use it like an assistant rather than like a medkit. And I don't want to get into solutions that involve Mr Johnson being antagonistic, as I don't think that makes for a fun game.

[Wraith235]

first off Thank you for the Unlock

so the last point of this if the pure software

in Order to run this at a rating 6 several things are needed

Fairlight Caliban Comlink (or greater but Im sticking to the basics) 8000(10,000 if implanted)
Response 6 module  - 8000
System 6 - 3000
Firewall is immaterial
and the software 3000

for a total of 22,000

you also need a Camera of some flavor

I maintain that the camera has to be able to handle the Data its retrieving for the program and therefore would need to have a response and system equal in order to handel that staying with the model of Response --> System ---> programs

easiest way is Cybereyes
Normalware eyes have a DR of 3 (as they are headware) so we have to go with Alphaware+ in order to pump up the response to 6(just going to stick with Alpha because Im sticking to the basics

Alphaware eyes 1,000 - 3,000 (I personally only believe in rating 4 unless essence is an issue)
Response 6  8000
System    6   3000

for a grand total of 34,000 Minimum or 36,000 if its implanted(this is important believe me)

now the benifits

-1)no way to visibly tell or suspect that the Face is using it (100% Discreet)
-2)no required Sensor test to detect the meta human your using it on
-3)by having the response R6/Sys6/(most likely a 6 firewall) on your Commlink and cybereyes you by default increase your Wireless security by a good amount

-4)*** ONLY if If the Commlink is implanted*** you are Immune to Jamming and spoof attempts due to the DNI between the Comm and Eyes

downsides
Essence cost
Cash intensive

now I Wrote up all 3 posts to show a few points
#1 in order to run these Items at 100% efficiency its not nearly as cheap as initially thought
#2 Show the Security Discrepancy and strengths of each way of Running them
#3 Validate the Cost of Running each model over the other ( I think I failed on the Drone version but you cant win them all)
#4 Prove that the Lower cost versions dont upstage the more expensive Software

Wraith235 pointed out something interesting: The cheap toy version of this should only be Device Rating 2, and yet it can run a rating 6 emosoft. I think that's further evidence that the toys are not running fully capable sensorsofts. (The alternative is that they're better computers than most military commlinks, which I hope we can agree is absurd.)

Im still a proponent of the fact that the software Chipped into the toys,  Hardware is more stable than software and could theoretically draw more power to run it thereby compensate for the Discrepancy between DR and the software levels.

Aside from the "(agreeably) Absurd Military computer Idea" its the only sound way to explain it

We have at least 1 thing Similar now (IRL) and thats Wired Ethernet vs. Wireless (weak example I know)

I do apologize whole heartedly for the Roundabout way I had to take to get to this point hopefully I have given some valuable information as to this question (albeit Long winded)

[Mäx]

I maintain that the camera has to be able to handle the Data its retrieving for the program and therefore would need to have a response and system equal in order to handel that staying with the model of Response --> System ---> programs

Just so that those less familiar with the system don't get confused.
This part is purely a houserule on Wraith part and not something based on RAW.

[Wraith235]

I maintain that the camera has to be able to handle the Data its retrieving for the program and therefore would need to have a response and system equal in order to handel that staying with the model of Response --> System ---> programs

Just so that those less familiar with the system don't get confused.
This part is purely a houserule on Wraith part and not something based on RAW.

not looking to argue so I'll respond once to this and leave it at that

it goes off the Idea of the Data pipeline ... now .. IRL ... what happens if you have a 100MB Connection from your Router and only a 10 MB Ethernet card .... 10 MB Data comming through the Pipe


Same Idea Applies here

Commlink (with Software) Flowing to the eyes gets bottled by the lower response ....

Ultimatly its the GM's call

and Im done

[The_Gun_Nut]

First, I'd like to second (or third, or whatever it's up to) the idea of using the Emotitoy's dice pool as an assisted roll, rather than stacking it onto the character's dice pool.  It strikes me more as an assistant than a straight up dice adder, like the software.

Second, I think that carrying one of those to a meet might project an air of non-professionalism to the Johnson.  Carrying one, blatantly, that is.  I'd impose a dice penalty for obvious or standard "off the rack" toys.  One could, however, simply strip one of the non-mobile ones down to it's chassis and hide it on oneself, getting wireless feeds from it.  Essentially, it would "whisper in your ear."  A Johnson that insists on wireless security would spot the signal, however, so there could be trouble there.

Third, the emotitoy is hard coded.  It is firmware, not software.  There are only so many updates or upgrades it could handle before becomming utterly obsolete (and in a fairly short time, given technology advancements).  I'd impose a SOTA penalty on the older models, which might force people to constantly upgrade their toy.  Which means buying a new one fairly regularly.  Software, OTOH, can be upgraded much more easily and will keep ahead of the obsolescence curve for a longer period.  Eventually, something better will show up, but the advantage of direct DP additions combined with a discreet platform (ones headware) and easy, cheap updates (your hacker might be able to get a cracked version, even) would make the software's initial apparent high price tag look pretty competitive.

[Ultra Violet]

The DR limit is only a limit if you want it to be.
RAW says: The rating of the emotitoy is the rating of its built-in empathy software.
That means it is especially designed for that purpose. There are other equipment that are designed for a purpose and most of them do not follow the standard rules for Commlinks or DR.
Now we look at the rules, and look there are some soft- and hardware rules that allows it to use upper rating software on a lower rating system. (see Program Options: Ergonomic & Optimization or Optimization as Commlinks Modification)
This rules do not really count or in this case, we don't need them at all, because we talk about a toy that is especially designed to do so. And equipment that follows one purpose, follows its own rules (its rating = dice pool bonus for a specific test or a set of tests). If you want some examples look at the different rating-based gear in the books and you will see.
i.e. an Autopicker-6 is NOT a state of the art super computer but it gives its user +6d for a test, like the toy we talking about...