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Bullets that tear you to bits

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Medicineman

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« Reply #30 on: <03-19-12/1715:16> »
« Last Edit: <03-19-12/1725:18> by Medicineman »
http://english.bouletcorp.com/2013/08/02/the-long-journey/
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Xzylvador

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« Reply #31 on: <03-19-12/1802:21> »
lol, last couple of posts made this thread a whole lot better.

That second one would be a pretty darned cool mod for the Ruger Super Warhawk... but it would probably end up being as big as the last one.
"But how did those guards know I was carrying a weapon?! I had it in a concealed holster!"

CanRay

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« Reply #32 on: <03-19-12/1834:12> »
I fired EX rounds once and Chuck Norris ran away!
He didn't run away, he was running towards you the long way around the planet.  ;D
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CitizenJoe

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« Reply #33 on: <03-19-12/1911:53> »
EX rounds are made of the new compound Norrisite.  One gram will destroy an entire building.

crisses

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« Reply #34 on: <03-19-12/1921:10> »
He's not a troll -- at least not intentionally.  He's my son, and he asks me these types of questions all day & night.  Sometimes his ideas are good (i.e. need minor tweaking).  Sometimes his ideas are ridiculous (read: completely unworkable).

So here's the type of conversation I might have with my son on this:

A bullet is already explosive.  There's a measured shaped charge in the bullet casing that when smacked by the gun's hammer causes a small explosion IN your gun that propels the bullet out hopefully in the intended direction (which is why there's a barrel to help you aim & why a crit glitch can jam your gun and burn your hand).  There are hollow-point bullets, etc. etc.  But what type of explosive could you put in the tip of a bullet that wouldn't be set off by the initial explosion in the gun, but would explode on impact?  (and who wants to test these new bullets out?)

Are EX & Ex-Ex Rounds the best science has to offer in 2070?  Who knows.  However, I would never want to put (name your volatile explosive of preference) in the tip of a bullet to try to find out.  These types of weapons could theoretically be possible (with much moderating on the proposed effects -- nerfed from what was proposed), however the only people crazy enough to create them and carry them around would be people with a death wish or completely fanatical about what they're going to do with them (i.e. willing to die for their cause).  That puts these ideas into Evil Villain and Crazy Fanatical Faction territory i.e. the GM can pull them out and use them as part of The Story whenever they want, but the player won't have them in their own weapon.  ("Sorry, they only had 3 of those bullets....")

Assuming your character doesn't have a Will to Die, your character wouldn't be in their bullet lab with the materials needed to make them, and no fixer would source or sell them for fear of someone dropping a few of them and blowing themselves to smithereens.  It's a No Go™ even if It Could Be Possible™.  It's a fun "what if" moment, an intellectual curiosity, and that's all.  And it needs to stop there.

So anyway, folk, sorry for the inconvenience.  The Shadowrun system allows you to make characters with build/repair skills, and between that plus Inspired quality plus the Juryrigger quality plus Artisan skill, my son's creativity, he's constantly coming up with these proposals for new gear/items for the game....the game is not made to say "This is the list of Stuff You Can Have™ and that's all that's possible."  And that's become my 7-day-a-week headache ;)  He's not trying to be a pain -- he's actually thinking of these ideas and thinks they might work, even if not for a character.

p.s. keep the Chuck Norris jokes coming :)

Ajax

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« Reply #35 on: <03-19-12/1934:36> »
My apologies, had I known the original poster was a young'un I would have bit my tongue... er, keyboard*.

* Note to Self: Don't try that again, aluminum is bad for your teeth.

But to add one minor quibble, the primer compound in small arms ammunition deflagrates, a fancy way to say "burns really rapidly," it does not detonate... which is a less fancy way to say explode**. Gases from the burning powder pressurize and expand the ammunition's casing, sealing it against the chamber wall. These propellant gases push on the bullet base, and as Newton all taught us, pushes the bullet in the opposite direction. Most of the time, the bang you hear from a firearm is the tiny sonic boom made by the bullet as it goes downrange.

** And yes, there is a difference between "explode" and "detonate," but only other overly technical gun nerds like me are going to care enough to quibble.
Evil looms. Cowboy up. Kill it. Get paid.

CitizenJoe

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« Reply #36 on: <03-19-12/1941:56> »
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XM25_CDTE

That's essentially what he's trying to do.  Except he's trying to stick it in a pistol... which ain't gonna happen. 

Also, explain to him that armor has soft parts and is designed to stop stuff from getting in not out.  While armor might contain the blast slightly, it would actually get redirected out the weak spots in the armor.  In game, this means that it would damage the protection value of armor, a pre-existing rule governs that.

Ajax

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« Reply #37 on: <03-19-12/2013:05> »
Well, there are pistol form-factor minigrenade launchers, like the Armtech MGL-Mini6 if you feel like digging through some old sourcebooks. Not subtle in the least... but, if he really has a craving for salsa.

My freinds and I all came to a gentleman's agreement never to use these things after one of us (who shall live in infamy) fired one inside a cargo elevator we were all inside. :o
Evil looms. Cowboy up. Kill it. Get paid.

crisses

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« Reply #38 on: <03-19-12/2109:52> »
Well, there are pistol form-factor minigrenade launchers, like the Armtech MGL-Mini6 if you feel like digging through some old sourcebooks. Not subtle in the least... but, if he really has a craving for salsa.

My freinds and I all came to a gentleman's agreement never to use these things after one of us (who shall live in infamy) fired one inside a cargo elevator we were all inside. :o

Yeah, he likes the idea of salsa a lot.... so I threw a bit of nasty at the party once -- baddy goon 1 ran by their parked van, pistol-whipped the passenger-side window, followed by baddy goon 2 who ran by and tossed in a flash-bang grenade through the hole (and they kept running).  One of the "wired" (actually physadept) NPCs in the van won surprise/init & dove over the front seat to toss it back outside so it just blew glass into the van...  Just a tad of "warning" to the PCs that baddies can use nasty tactics right back.  Later in the same combat another goon shot out a tire (which led to the PCs using an Air Spirit to re-inflate the tire & maintain air pressure, and a good laugh about the "Noxious breath" power).  Baddies don't have to be dumb. 

Maria Mercurial had to buy the Underwold 93 troll bouncer a new van, by the time the adventure was through....


So it's no wonder my son's looking for some extra Edge....I keep warning him, though, that if he dreams up things like Triple-X Ex Rounds and exploding throwing knives that the enemy is more likely to have & use them against the party....

Look at it this way:  you pull off nastier and nastier stuff, the baddies get wind of it and their higher-ups will hire bigger goons with better gear to take you out.  If you keep a low profile and the baddies don't know just how bad you are, they will underestimate you and try to cut corners on their budget by hiring the cheaper goonies.  If you're in an arms race with the Mob, the Yakuza, AAA corps, the government, the Policlubs, etc. you're going to lose.  You are much better off sticking to what shadowrunners are built for: slipping in under the radar, exploiting weaknesses & tactical advantages of small teams working in the realm of "unnoticables".

Critias

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« Reply #39 on: <03-19-12/2128:09> »
The thing to keep in mind is that there are whole megacorporations throwing hojillions of nuyen into R&D, who would splooge themselves at the idea of stuff like "triple-X explosive rounds" and that sort of thing.  If they can figure out a safe, reliable, way to pack that sort of destructive power into a bullet, they will, it probably won't be some Shadowrunner who moonlights by putting a 3 or 4 into Logic and Armorer, or something. 

There's no reason not to assume that the current ammunition choices are, more or less, the top-end of what's realistically possible with the tech level in the setting.

BRKNdevil

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« Reply #40 on: <03-19-12/2258:42> »
strange enough there are rounds like what he is describing, but they're as big as my forearm and are meant to clear out rooms,
check out future weapons for some seriously badass shit

CanRay

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« Reply #41 on: <03-19-12/2356:52> »
There's no reason not to assume that the current ammunition choices are, more or less, the top-end of what's realistically possible with the tech level in the setting.
Especially now that we can work at the Nano-Molecular Level.
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Medicineman

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« Reply #42 on: <03-20-12/0256:25> »
Quote
My apologies, had I known the original poster was a young'un I would have bit my tongue... er,
same here   ;)


HougH!
Medicineman
 
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Xzylvador

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« Reply #43 on: <03-20-12/0352:39> »
Quote
My apologies, had I known the original poster was a young'un I would have bit my tongue... er,
same here   ;)


Yeah... damnit, kind of embarrassing.


Anyways, more Chuck Norris jokes!


Ajax

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« Reply #44 on: <03-20-12/0827:29> »
Yeah, he likes the idea of salsa a lot.... so I threw a bit of nasty at the party once -- baddy goon 1 ran by their parked van, pistol-whipped the passenger-side window, followed by baddy goon 2 who ran by and tossed in a flash-bang grenade through the hole (and they kept running).

Behold, the Shadowrun (Live Action Roleplaying Edition) of the classic Leeroy Jenkins! scene. (PG-13 Language)
Evil looms. Cowboy up. Kill it. Get paid.