Shadowrun
Shadowrun Play => Rules and such => Topic started by: Senko on <11-07-17/1422:28>
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I was thinking about the traditional wizards staff and it got me wondering could one object serve for multiple foci? For instance a staff or other melee weapon enchanted as a weapon foci and a power foci so it enhanced both your magical and mundane attacks?
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No; the following should suffice.
"Each focus has a specific power (described under Focus Types) and must be active for you to use it." - 318 CRB
Oops, was wrong :)
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That said, you can enchant different parts of your foci and piece them together afterwards. The staff could be shod with steel caps, or the custom grip could be special...
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That depends on the GM as the Foci must be in your possession (worn, carried, hand-held, in a pocket or pouch, etc) to be used. I would also rule that no, you couldn't have a Power Foci grip on a Weapon Focus Staff with Sustaining Focus Caps.
If a GM wants to allow such things, that's on them, but RAW, I don't think you can "weld" foci together to bypass the 1 focus 1 power rule...
Oops, was wrong. :)
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I was thinking about the traditional wizards staff and it got me wondering could one object serve for multiple foci? For instance a staff or other melee weapon enchanted as a weapon foci and a power foci so it enhanced both your magical and mundane attacks?
Yes. SR4 had rules for what were called "Stacked Foci," which IIRC there was mention in SR5 material but no rules given. They were otherwise pretty simple, rules wise.
Choose and calculate the karma and nuyen costs for each part of the focus you want, say a Force 3 Power and Force 3 Weapon focus staff. All costs are the sum of the parts:
The karma cost to bond this focus is 27 (Force 3 Power is 18; Force 3 Weapon is 9).
The monetary cost to buy this focus is ¥75,000 (Force 3 Power is ¥54,000; Force 3 Weapon is ¥21,000).
The availability to acquire the focus is 24R.
The Force of this focus when activated is 6, and counts as a singular focus when activated and all other tests (like addiction). You may not activate individual parts; it's all or nothing.
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Guess SR5 has rules for stacked Foci in Street Grimoire.
Here's a thread talking about it: http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=5601.0
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Guess SR5 has rules for stacked Foci in Street Grimoire.
Here's a thread talking about it: http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=5601.0
That's a thread from 2011 and talks about SR4
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Guess SR5 has rules for stacked Foci in Street Grimoire.
Here's a thread talking about it: http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=5601.0
That's a thread from 2011 and talks about SR4
Thats what i get for posting at work while reading multiple old threads. Reread the tabs I had open and realized Street Grimiore references them but never says how they work in 5e.
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Thanks. So basically yes it's theoretically possible and the old rules are simple but in any given game you'd need to check with the GM as they weren't translated to 5th Ed.
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SG refers to stacked foci twice (p. 133 an 146), so either it's a copy/paste remnant from a 4th edition rule/table or it was supposed to be in SG and was cut to safe space and nobody realized it.
But that might be something to convince your GM that its supposed to exist.
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Stacked foci have been 'standard' since 1E; for all intents and purposes, you have to design the focus the way you want it, build it as a unit, pay for the entire thing, and bond it all at once. This makes it both difficult and expensive to build and bond - and its activation is an all-or-nothing thing, when it comes to focus addiction (i.e. you can't activate 'just the Power focus part, not the Weapon focus part') - but nothing says you can't have your kickass wizard's staff.
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Foci addiction sucks ass. But its better now then it was back in the day.
This works well for items that you CAN take almost everywhere. But get really hazy when you get more exotic in your choices.
So sure you can have your solid oak staff complete with a gem on top just like Gandalf did.... but don't expect some places to let you just wander in with it.
However, a modernized 'wizard's staff' like an collapsible stun staff that folds up and fits in a pocket (and thus 'out of mind' of most security.. until you get to the good stuff) fly at it!
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That's why focus tatoos are so very, very useful. Easy to expand, carry and hard to remove (at least as long as you can fight back - after that you are in for a very painful form of robbery)
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I'm personally torn on the tattoo foci for players.
It was kind of what set the Triads apart from the other asian gang groups. And acted as both a status symbol, warning and unremovable power boost..
Now... they are just.. common
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Ah, you're thinking small, Reaver. What happens when some Triads get upset with both talismongers and Awakened who are using 'their' techniques without permission? Price and availability are only the first steps in controlling the rarity of certain things. Perhaps the only non-Triad willing to do the work in your sprawl (or the only one that will talk to you) has the artistic skills of a kindergartner. Perhaps the ones who had more artistic skill were 'persuaded' to leave after more than one suffered 'accidents'. Would you care for a permanent focus that was supposed to be a coiled serpent and instead looks like a neon green poop emoji?
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Ah, you're thinking small, Reaver. What happens when some Triads get upset with both talismongers and Awakened who are using 'their' techniques without permission? Price and availability are only the first steps in controlling the rarity of certain things. Perhaps the only non-Triad willing to do the work in your sprawl (or the only one that will talk to you) has the artistic skills of a kindergartner. Perhaps the ones who had more artistic skill were 'persuaded' to leave after more than one suffered 'accidents'. Would you care for a permanent focus that was supposed to be a coiled serpent and instead looks like a neon green poop emoji?
There's also the social repurcussions if someone see's you with tattoo's they might assume your Yakuza (I vaguely recall bathing etiquette in Japan used to involve covering or hiding them even fairly recently) and then you've got a fairly powerful Yakuza group asking questions about why "your organizatio is trying to muscle in on our turf." Not to mention some high society areas might not allow tattooed people in (without a quiet vouching for by the local triad heads their not here to cause trouble).
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Ah, you're thinking small, Reaver. What happens when some Triads get upset with both talismongers and Awakened who are using 'their' techniques without permission? Price and availability are only the first steps in controlling the rarity of certain things. Perhaps the only non-Triad willing to do the work in your sprawl (or the only one that will talk to you) has the artistic skills of a kindergartner. Perhaps the ones who had more artistic skill were 'persuaded' to leave after more than one suffered 'accidents'. Would you care for a permanent focus that was supposed to be a coiled serpent and instead looks like a neon green poop emoji?
Yes and no...
I see what you are saying, but at the same time, even the triads, while known for their violent reprisals, are not stupid enough to go against the weight of the 10 megas, and all the AA corps out there; Which is what you are suggesting.
Once something like this hits the marketplace, that's it, its out there. targeting the people who get them even if it is a small population (which these tattoos cater to,) is going to bring all levels of pain on them as everyone knuckles down on them. And everyone would: The police because it looks good for them when the new rounds of contract talks come up. The Corps because they (the Triads) are fucking not only with their profit lines, they are fucking with their reputation! The other criminal organizations would pounce on them for no other reason then to remove a player from 'their' markets.
No, its my own issue with the game. And that's fine, I certainly don't hold it against my players that get one, as they are very good for their costs and the effectiveness.
As for hiding tattoos in Yakuza culture, that comes from a different philosophy, and unless you're Japanese, may not entirely understand. (Not Japanese, and while I have done extensive reading and travelling, I don't understand it either). That same philosophy is also seeing Yakuza members getting finger replacement surgeries to hid past shames as well (usually by graphing toes to the finger stumps!)... From what I understand, it all about the Yaks realizing that their customs makes them targets visibly on the world stage, which makes their illegal operations that much harder to hide from international police efforts. After all, if all you have to do is follow the Japanese man with a body tattoo and a missing finger for a few months to years to find a criminal organization, you do it! (The Police in Canada have been known to invest years and hundreds of officers for hundreds of thousands of man hours to tackle a SMALL organization... See project H.A.R.M in the 1990's.)
But tattoos are also a cultural thing for some people and cultures. (as is a host of other things like scarification!) and then there are people like me, who tattoos are just body art (I have a few). In fact, go down to your local construction site, you'll see LOTS of tattoos, most iron heads I know are only 15% "flesh colored"... the other 85% is all ink! And in SR, tattoos are mostly just considered body art, and no one bats an eye at. (thanks to the "Punk" tagline in SR's origins..)
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Interesting considering the extent of Japanification in Shadowrun this would change quite a bit in how I tend to treat tattoos and the like in that world. I still had the impression it was more Yakuza/Triad only with a quiet censoring of those who had them.
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If you look at the art from SR it shows a pretty healthy amount of tattoos. Also just think about all the tattoo options in the bioware gear section. I will say in most places its a social status / culture thing. In the barrens and even wage slave territory tattoos are pretty common. The higher up the social ladder you go the less common tattoos become in most places, their are exceptions with cultures that support tattoos, Most of the NAN and Tir Tairngire support tattoos culturally and wont stigmatize it unless its really out of control or tasteless from what I can tell.
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Having tattoos is one thing. Having certain types of tattoos, especially if they use any secrets gleaned from the syndicates, is an entirely different thing.
And no, Reaver, they wouldn't be going against all the megas. But enough people made example of in random 'gang violence' after they had polite Japanese men come to their door asking them to desist and they ignored the generous warning... Or if there are several service providers who suddenly get in all kinds of trouble with local law enforcement, because someone found out that they were using their place to move drugs for the local gangs? Or customers found themselves having 'accidents' that removed the offending tattoos? Or even just a couple toughs with someone that looks like a stereotypical mage showing up, getting a hair sample, and saying that they should stop, or they'd 'be in touch'? There's plenty of ways for the Yaks and Triads to get their point across without all out war against the megas.
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The megas would notice if someone started intimidating their customers away from doing business. They aren't stupid after all. And I don't care how smooth they think they are, Lofwyr is smoother.
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The megas would also do a cost-benefit analysis to decide whether the potential profit of a minor form of focus that only an extreme minority of the population would be interested in is worth the cost of other lines of business. Especially if someone cut a deal to ensure that, say, some local restrictions were eased in favor of the new product line quietly going away and being more 'exclusive'.
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Alternatively the megas would look at it as "if we let one small group push us out of a market we are setting a bad precedent." Besides, a war against the Yakuza would be very short term, the profits from a totally new line of sales would be forever.