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Suggestion: Reputation Accountability

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FastJack

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« Reply #75 on: <08-16-12/0902:33> »
Megh thought of a neat way around this problem I`m going to smite myself everytime I log on 8)

Do we get a prize when our smite total is better than Just A Dudes?
You get a prize when your smite total is higher than mine.

JustADude

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« Reply #76 on: <08-17-12/0158:49> »
Megh thought of a neat way around this problem I`m going to smite myself everytime I log on 8)

Do we get a prize when our smite total is better than Just A Dudes?
You get a prize when your smite total is higher than mine.

Pay up. :P
“What is right is not always popular and what is popular is not always right.”
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Black

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« Reply #77 on: <08-17-12/0251:19> »
I've actually been applauding Dude every now and then, to try and bring balance back to the world... so far, not so effective... oh well. :D
Perception molds reality
Change perception and reality will follow
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JustADude

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« Reply #78 on: <08-17-12/0553:57> »
I've actually been applauding Dude every now and then, to try and bring balance back to the world... so far, not so effective... oh well. :D

The problem is that a good, helpful post that is informative, accurate, and and insightful gets maybe 1-2 +1s, compared to a wisecrack getting a dozen or more from people who laugh it up *glares bitterly at CanRay*. Conversely, if you say something confrontational, or the least pit unpolitic, the person you're debating with... and everyone else who doesn't like your "attitude"... will hammer you with -1s every time they see your name, because they don't like you and people are good at being petty.

Also, the existing balance sways the opinion of new posts. People who might Smite CanRay give him a pass because of his outsanding balance, while people who would otherwise leave me alone decide to add to the Smite Parade simply because I'm already a "bad person".

Now, to all the people that are thinking "Wow, this guy sounds like an ass. I'm gonna smite him," let me just say thank you for proving my point.
« Last Edit: <08-17-12/0558:59> by JustADude »
“What is right is not always popular and what is popular is not always right.”
― Albert Einstein

"Being average just means that half of everyone you meet is better than you."
― Me

Black

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« Reply #79 on: <08-17-12/0609:01> »
I've actually been applauding Dude every now and then, to try and bring balance back to the world... so far, not so effective... oh well. :D

The problem is that a good, helpful post that is informative, accurate, and and insightful gets maybe 1-2 +1s, compared to a wisecrack getting a dozen or more from people who laugh it up *glares bitterly at CanRay*. Conversely, if you say something confrontational, or the least pit unpolitic, the person you're debating with... and everyone else who doesn't like your "attitude"... will hammer you with -1s every time they see your name, because they don't like you and people are good at being petty.

Also, the existing balance sways the opinion of new posts. People who might Smite CanRay give him a pass because of his outsanding balance, while people who would otherwise leave me alone decide to add to the Smite Parade simply because I'm already a "bad person".

Now, to all the people that are thinking "Wow, this guy sounds like an ass. I'm gonna smite him," let me just say thank you for proving my point.

Nah... gave you a plus +1...
Perception molds reality
Change perception and reality will follow
SR1+SR2+SR3++SR4+hb+++B?UB+IE+W+sa+m-gmM--P

Mirikon

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« Reply #80 on: <08-17-12/0833:45> »
I still have yet to hear an answer to the question, "Why do you care what anonymous people on an internet forum think about you?" Seriously, just be you, and as long as you abide by the TOU and the people you actually care about their opinion don't say you're a total asshole, then everything else is immaterial.
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Demerzel

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« Reply #81 on: <08-17-12/0955:17> »
I still have yet to hear an answer to the question, "Why do you care what anonymous people on an internet forum think about you?" Seriously, just be you, and as long as you abide by the TOU and the people you actually care about their opinion don't say you're a total asshole, then everything else is immaterial.

People shouldn't have to rationalize why they care about things to other people. My friends who chose to not have children don't ask me to explain why I care about my son. Likewise, people who enjoy traveling and experiencing other cultures aren't expected to rationalize their desire to those who prefer to vacation in ways that don't stress their cultural experience.

It is wildly unfair to say, "I don't care, therefore you should not care." Obviously people do, and as humans we should only be empathetic to that.

I have heard people criticize the internet for giving people a layer of anonymity and that makes them unaccountable and therefore more likely to be rude and trolls. A reputation system should attempt to ameliorate that, but all this one does is add a layer of anonymity that gives free reign to target people with no accountability, not even to these false personas we all adopt.

FastJack

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« Reply #82 on: <08-17-12/1025:02> »
Megh thought of a neat way around this problem I`m going to smite myself everytime I log on 8)

Do we get a prize when our smite total is better than Just A Dudes?
You get a prize when your smite total is higher than mine.

Pay up. :P
Y'know, I forgot yours was so high...

Xzylvador

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« Reply #83 on: <08-18-12/0851:37> »
I still have yet to hear an answer to the question, "Why do you care what anonymous people on an internet forum think about you?" Seriously, just be you, and as long as you abide by the TOU and the people you actually care about their opinion don't say you're a total asshole, then everything else is immaterial.

People care because they care about being rewarded for their efforts, or at the very least not be punished for them.

I -and many like me- often spend hours (a day [yeah, it's pathetic, I know]) looking up rules or information for people with questions, sharing cool shadowrun-related art/technological/sci-fi finds, checking out other people's characters and backgrounds to help them out, building and writing pages of material for PbPs or fanfic, etc... And we do all this out of love for this game and to help others who share this passion for such a great game.

But then after a day of contributing, I see that for no apparent reason (my only posts having been "Man, that was funny, +1!" and some PM's to players in my PbP game) my reputation dropped another 3 points... And yes, I care.

Congratulations on the fact that you, apparently, have enough self-esteem, confidence or just don't care enough to let this affect you.
But some people do care. Enough to just say "You know, F* this. If that's all the reward I get for all the hours and effort I spent, it's just not worth it any more." And this way, good and decent people are bullied away by a few assholes.
And personally, sometimes I'm really saddened and disappointed that the people behind the forum don't seem to care enough about the devoted fans trying to contribute to their game to prevent or stop this kind of abuse. Luckily/sadly, that's only on the rare moments when my low confidence and self-esteem aren't protected by thick walls of apathy.
« Last Edit: <08-18-12/1122:43> by Xzylvador »

FastJack

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« Reply #84 on: <08-18-12/1345:53> »
I still have yet to hear an answer to the question, "Why do you care what anonymous people on an internet forum think about you?" Seriously, just be you, and as long as you abide by the TOU and the people you actually care about their opinion don't say you're a total asshole, then everything else is immaterial.

People care because they care about being rewarded for their efforts, or at the very least not be punished for them.

I -and many like me- often spend hours (a day [yeah, it's pathetic, I know]) looking up rules or information for people with questions, sharing cool shadowrun-related art/technological/sci-fi finds, checking out other people's characters and backgrounds to help them out, building and writing pages of material for PbPs or fanfic, etc... And we do all this out of love for this game and to help others who share this passion for such a great game.

But then after a day of contributing, I see that for no apparent reason (my only posts having been "Man, that was funny, +1!" and some PM's to players in my PbP game) my reputation dropped another 3 points... And yes, I care.

Congratulations on the fact that you, apparently, have enough self-esteem, confidence or just don't care enough to let this affect you.
But some people do care. Enough to just say "You know, F* this. If that's all the reward I get for all the hours and effort I spent, it's just not worth it any more." And this way, good and decent people are bullied away by a few assholes.
And personally, sometimes I'm really saddened and disappointed that the people behind the forum don't seem to care enough about the devoted fans trying to contribute to their game to prevent or stop this kind of abuse. Luckily/sadly, that's only on the rare moments when my low confidence and self-esteem aren't protected by thick walls of apathy.

I appreciate everything everyone here adds to the game, and I get the frustration of the negative rep when all you want to do is promote the game and add to it and see what good comes to it.

But here's a couple things to consider:

1) We could do away with the Rep system altogether. Honestly, after the months of hearing posters complain about this, I'm falling more and more into this camp. What should be something that shows how a person is viewed by the community is looking more broken every time and the fact that more people complain about getting smited is showing that everybody loves a trophy but can't handle criticism.

2) We could look into putting code in place to record the smites/applauds in a database, or something similar. The main problem with this is that it requires a lot of coding and maintaining, something that's really not in the cards without full-time non-volunteer admins and moderators.

3) We could continue as-is. No offense, but this means people will be required to grow a thicker skin. Yes, you contribute to the game and there are a lot of people that appreciate that. But, for X number of people that appreciate it, there will be Y number that hate your idea and think it's just wrong. Or don't like you and think you should just leave. So, no matter what, you're not going to please everyone everytime.

I don't mean to single you out Xzylvador, but your post struck a note with me in that you're feeling that your contributions aren't worth it due to negative feedback. Catalyst has a number of freelancers and full-time workers that are getting paid for their contributions and, more often than not, have to put up with a LOT more negative feedback than a smite on a forums board. People in all walks of life are dealing with negatives in their work just because co-workers, bosses, employees or even customers just don't like them, and it has nothing to do with the quality of their work.

I'm sorry if it sounds like I'm a bit grumpy about this, but the fact is, I am. So, I'm going to start an anonymous poll on the subject. We'll let it run a while (probably about a month, though I figure we'll get 95% of the votes in the first week), and let you guys show you opinion on the matter. Then we'll take the results and make a decision on where to go with this.

FastJack

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« Reply #85 on: <08-18-12/1351:15> »
Here's the poll, locking this thread. If you have further comments on the subject, go over there.