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Why cant missions be more realistic

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raggedhalo

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« Reply #15 on: <06-19-12/1025:35> »
New Seattle has exactly that table with response times. You probably want to multiply by at least ten to make them remotely "realistic" though.

I really like the Faction mechanic, but it does exist in Season 4 still.
Joe Rooney
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Ronin

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« Reply #16 on: <06-19-12/1058:16> »
i've been away from this site for far too long.  My advice would be that if you dont like the far-fetched missions and stories, come up with your own. Im GMing Anarchy: Subsidised which is not realistic at all. Cloning a baby, making a fake porn video and playing it on the Japanese version of Times Square? Silly? well yes. Interesting? well yes. Fun? Hell yes!  You can always change some things too. The group who are running are mostly newbies to RP so i thought i'd simplify it, no more races or magic. the end result is something a bit more like Deus Ex or Ghost in the Shell and it works perfectly. Its also easier on the GM ;)

KarmaInferno

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« Reply #17 on: <06-19-12/1143:58> »
Perhaps, folks that have played them could help categorize the "feel" of the various SRM games?

I know there are definitely more serious ones, and sillier ones, and having "theme" keywords perhaps tagged in the description might help folks decide what Missions to order for their events.

Tags like "lighthearted", "serious", "investigative", "combat-oriented", etc.



-k

CanRay

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« Reply #18 on: <06-19-12/1203:34> »
Mine has been tagged as "Dark" and "Sucky Ending".   :-\
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Black

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« Reply #19 on: <06-19-12/1532:27> »
Mine has been tagged as "Dark" and "Sucky Ending".   :-\

You Sir are far too harsh on yourself! ;)

So when is your next piece out?  What's you working on now?

And when do we get more Missions? (Need... more... Missions!)

Oh, and why can't Missions be more Pink Mohawk? 

When was the last time we blew something really big up? 

Or saved the world from terrorists trying to blow something up (and thus ruin our explosions! grrr... terrorirsts suck!)
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lurkeroutthere

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« Reply #20 on: <06-19-12/2036:32> »
New Seattle has exactly that table with response times. You probably want to multiply by at least ten to make them remotely "realistic" though.

The tables are not supposed to be realistic, the original blurb from the lone star book was quite explicit on this. The response times reflect gameplay mechanics.
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raggedhalo

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« Reply #21 on: <06-20-12/0521:42> »
The tables are not supposed to be realistic, the original blurb from the lone star book was quite explicit on this. The response times reflect gameplay mechanics.

Oh, I know.  But the OP was after "realism" so I figured it was worth flagging up.
Joe Rooney
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CanRay

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« Reply #22 on: <06-20-12/1154:09> »
Mine has been tagged as "Dark" and "Sucky Ending".   :-\
You Sir are far too harsh on yourself! ;)
No, that's pretty much every review I've seen of it so far, including my group last night.
So when is your next piece out?  What's you working on now?
My next piece is out when it's announced.  If I was working on something, which I can't confirm nor deny that I am due to NDA, I couldn't comment on it.
And when do we get more Missions? (Need... more... Missions!)
Ask Bull.
Oh, and why can't Missions be more Pink Mohawk? 
Ask Bull and Jason.
When was the last time we blew something really big up? 
I don't know about you, but my group missed out on taking out a good chunk of Seattle with a bus about a year ago...
Or saved the world from terrorists trying to blow something up (and thus ruin our explosions! grrr... terrorirsts suck!)
Some people just want to watch the world Burn.

...

Yes, I've been waiting a long time to use that pun.  ;D
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Critias

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« Reply #23 on: <06-20-12/1420:46> »
I think the answer to many of these problems -- whether it's "why can't Missions be more realistic?" or "why can't Missions be more pink mohawk" -- is basically "it already is, as much as we can make it."  Consistently so?  No, maybe not.  But there are a lot of different Missions out there, written by a lot of different people, with a lot of different moods to 'em.

Bull

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« Reply #24 on: <06-21-12/0023:06> »
Missions are what Missions are.  I take a zen approach to things, and for teh most part I give my writers a lot of leeway on the style they want to approach a Mission from.

To paraphrase (and misquote) the old Shadowrun Grimoire (Which is, in turn, misquoting a much older phrase):  "As any 10 Shadowrun players what Shadowrun is, and you'll get back 13 different answers." 

There is no one singular style of Shadowrun.  Some games are James Bond.  Some are Jason Bourne.  Some are Die Hard.  Some are Sneakers.  Some are A-Team.  Some are GI Joe.  Some are Expendables.  And some are the Great Muppet Caper.

With Missions, I aim for something in the middle most of teh time.  Some games veer one direction or the other, but I try and stay in the middle.  At Conventions, you never know what the players are going to want, so middle of teh road is "safest".  in a home game, the GM can usually tailor the event to his players and their play-style (and he should!)

Bull

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« Reply #25 on: <06-21-12/0027:13> »
Also, I should point out that Shadowrun is inherently completely unbelievable.  Even discounting Immortal Elves, Dragons, and Blood Mage-run Megacorps...  Shadowrun itself shouldn't work.  The technology, as presented (especially since SR3) should effectively neutralize Shadowrunners as a whole.  You're average Shadowrun team should have a lifespan of two to three jobs before they're dead or in jail.  Security in Shadowrun is so pervasive, and the rules for tracking and finding people electronically or magically are so easy that you have to just accept that reality is...  broken.  Otherwise,  the game itself becomes unplayable.

You ever want to come to gen Con or Origins and play a Realistic Shadowrun game?  I'll arrange for that.  But I can almost guarantee, you won't like it and it won't be any fun.

(Note:  Not trying to pick on you here, just saying...  The more realistic you make Shadowrun, the more unplayable it becomes)

Bull

Leigion

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« Reply #26 on: <06-21-12/0134:36> »
I am not talking about mechanics per say when I use the word realistic. Some optional rules in SR4 can be used making the game more gritty or deadly. Source books provide other optional rules to add more realism ,take Wired with harder encryption rules for one example.

Yes cloning a baby and making a porno to throw up a public screen isn't that far off the rails. The game has things like the matrix, cloning and ansortmen of sci-fi tech in the setting not to mention magic. Its part of the setting and taking it away changes the setting. You could be using the rule base shadowrun but after nuking the setting points your playing something different.   

I am using the word realism to describe certain logical responses if you will. Maybe I should just use the word vicarious for realism. Which makes me wonder what ever happened to Prime Missions I see 2 and then the line stopped? If so, any plans on continuing the project? I would assume it would be for harder play, cops and criminal elements hunting the players not just bigger bad guys. I'll list a couple of examples in a later post, i don't want to make one post super long with lots of paragraphs. Questions tend to get skipped that way.

Leigion

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« Reply #27 on: <06-21-12/0243:24> »
I understand what you are saying about conventions and i hear you loud and clear. They are a place for a wide player base and new fans to come and enjoy hours of fun. Plus you have a lot of themes to ensure you cover all the bases. I completely understand hey its a business and in the process you have to keep a majority of the fans happy and content. Don't get me wrong I think you guys did a great job on simplifying rules, bringing more people in to play your games and over all did a good job. What ever my opinions are you guys did great in 2011 so you guys at catalyst are obviously doing something right.

That being said, I don't think your game is broken or am I saying scratch what your missions writers are doing for convention play and focus more on this one theme. Here is what I am saying. You have more then just general players in your fan base. Like anything people and groups will gravitate to one extreme or another and not just ride down the middle road. Some players lean more towards gritty, others lean pink mohawk. Why cant their be more choice in a mission line to get the direct flavor of what individual groups want?

Think modules back in TSR days. Other then settings they had different levels of play Piazo comes to mind if looking at something current. Would it be possible and for an example of doing say 2 more mission lines completely in sub theme away from mainstream to run with the two extremes? For example calling one Noir Grit and the other Pink Mist? Again i never claimed to be a marketer with catchy slogans lol. But my point still stands, considering they can be in PDF form you don't really have to pay book binding publishers and all.

Mystic

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« Reply #28 on: <06-21-12/0321:22> »

That being said, I don't think your game is broken or am I saying scratch what your missions writers are doing for convention play and focus more on this one theme. Here is what I am saying. You have more then just general players in your fan base. Like anything people and groups will gravitate to one extreme or another and not just ride down the middle road. Some players lean more towards gritty, others lean pink mohawk. Why cant their be more choice in a mission line to get the direct flavor of what individual groups want?

To be bluntly honest, because you can't please everyone and you just have to do the best you can. When I write a piece, mission, story, etc I've found that the best way to do it is not to try and "please" anyone. I come up with a story and work to do the best I can and then let the chips fall where they may.

With the mission I wrote, Bull flat out told me that there were people who were likely going to be pissed off at one point because, well it's a railroad job. But you know what, instead of cringing, I embraced it and ran with it for all it was worth and Bull supported it. We knew there are going to be detractors and differences of opinion. But when I got to run it at Origins for the first time, I got some VERY positive (and some negative, but hey) feeback. And sometimes I had to change the living *BLEEEEEP* out of it on the fly to fit the group dynamic. It happens, and that's part of the fun.

But as Critas said, the individual GM's and or players are free to do what they want with the Mission, nothing anywhere says that the story is written in stone and HAS to be done a specific way. Hell, every game I run, no matter what it is, the players always seem to come up with some new way to give me a headache. Writers and game producers can't be expected to be all things to all people and I am of the opinion that sometimes individuals have to step up and take the time to work things out and customize things for their own needs for their own groups. We as writers can only do so much.

There's also the issue of a little thing called a budget. I'm sure that Bull, Catalyst, et al would LOVE to pump out Missions of all flavors with multiple stories and volumes (calm down Bull, don't have a heart attack on me), but the fact is we can't. So we simply have to pick and chose our battles.


And when do we get more Missions? (Need... more... Missions!)


Hmmmm, I do think that SRM 04-09 Assassin Nation should be coming out fairly soon.  8)

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raggedhalo

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« Reply #29 on: <06-21-12/0430:01> »
Maybe I should just use the word vicarious for realism.

What you're talking about is actually verisimilitudeVicarious means something else entirely.
Joe Rooney
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