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Non-magical attacks against spirits

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Kot

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« Reply #75 on: (07:52:42/12-02-10) »
I just finished testing that one. You're right. A rating 3 six-person ganger group got mauled by a force 3 beast spirit in eight rounds. With only one ganger surviving the attack, and the spirit taking a whooping 1 damage from a lucky shotgun shell from a Remington Roomsweeper. So, scrapping that one. Though my players probably will use S'n'S in their first run, and will have the leftovers for later, in case of spirits...
And i think i'll do this on a hunch, whenever spirits come into play. So, two corp security guards need at least 5-10 rounds to get rid of a spirit. That's enough time bought. :)
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Nomad Zophiel

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« Reply #76 on: (08:09:29/12-02-10) »
The way I read the FAQ its even worse, successes don't count either. Its unmodified base DV of the weapon VS spirits hardened armor. So according to that FAQ ruling you can't harm a Force 4 spirit with a heavy machinegun. Ever.

For purposes of whether or not a shot gets through hardened armor, its modified DV (which I take to include both net hits and modifiers for Called Shots, bursts etc) vs modified armor rating (modified by AP). SR4a 295. Exactly what constitutes modified DV is my own interpretation. The rest is explicit. So as I see it, any single attack that does damage>armor will make it through ITNW.

Edit: Except that narrow bursts explicitly do not apply to armor comparisons. SR4A 153.
So net hits add to effective DV. Called shots add to effective DV. AP reduces armor accordingly. Bursts add to damage but won't help you get through the spirit's hardened armor. As a mundane your options are basically SNS or APDS in an assault rifle.

Moral of the story: Spend a few thousand nuyen on a clip of naga venom.
« Last Edit: (08:28:10/12-02-10) by Nomad Zophiel »

Doc Chaos

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« Reply #77 on: (08:42:21/12-02-10) »
Its modified DV by book RAW, yes, but not by FAQ RAW, which contradicts the book RAW in saying that its unmodified DV. Which is one of the many reasons I do not even bother to look at the FAQ anymore, whoever wrote it had no idea of the game, the rules, or basic common sense.
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Kot

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« Reply #78 on: (10:29:11/12-02-10) »
Moral of the story: Spend a few thousand nuyen on a clip of naga venom.
What, no enchanted anti-(spirit type) bullets yet?
Mariusz "Kot" Butrykowski
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Doc Chaos

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« Reply #79 on: (10:41:59/12-02-10) »
Not possible by RAW (neither book or FAQ ;))
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The_Gun_Nut

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« Reply #80 on: (11:08:58/12-02-10) »
Technically, it can be done, but it is karma intensive.

Anchoring meta-magic loads a "spirit killer" spell onto a bullet, with a trigger of "contact with spirit."

Shoot bullet.

Spirit goes poof.

Mage then spends the next two or three sessions building up the karma he just spent on anchoring that spell.

Like I said, technically possible, but really impractical.
There is no overkill.

Only "Open fire" and "I need to reload."

Doc Chaos

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« Reply #81 on: (11:56:54/12-02-10) »
True, forgot about that, sorry.
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Nomad Zophiel

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« Reply #82 on: (17:50:21/12-02-10) »
Well, aside from paracritter venom I guess you could have Hire-A-Spirit. Pay you local Street Shaman well enough and he'll summon a spirit and say "this guy gets all your services". If there's already a spirit on your tail you have to survive that long, though.

Kot

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« Reply #83 on: (05:14:22/12-03-10) »
Yeah, that's that. :)
Or you could devise a spell to re-create the 'Elemental Strike' Adept power, to cast on others.
Mariusz "Kot" Butrykowski
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Doc Chaos

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« Reply #84 on: (05:28:09/12-03-10) »
Interesting idea, but probably won't do much good, since not many non-melee-adepts have the dicepool to even hit a spirit in melee.
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Kot

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« Reply #85 on: (05:35:09/12-03-10) »
But Elemental Strike is not a 'normal weapon', and counts as a magic effect, as far as i remember.
Mariusz "Kot" Butrykowski
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Doc Chaos

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« Reply #86 on: (05:52:14/12-03-10) »
Yes, but that only affects if the spirit has armor. It doesn't affect the tons of dice spirits can roll to dodge skywards to get out of melee reach.
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Mäx

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« Reply #87 on: (08:17:24/12-03-10) »
But Elemental Strike is not a 'normal weapon', and counts as a magic effect, as far as i remember.
Yes, but you still have to actually hit the spirit in melee(that the spirit doesn't really have a reason to even be)

Oh, by the way that spell is called elemental aura and can be found in page 173 of street magic. ;)
« Last Edit: (08:20:13/12-03-10) by Mäx »
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