Shadowrun

Shadowrun General => The Secret History => Topic started by: Cranstonvm on <05-08-12/0037:03>

Title: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: Cranstonvm on <05-08-12/0037:03>
I was wondering.
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: Longshot23 on <05-08-12/0533:59>
As far as I know - feel free to correct me, anyone, since I'm not in any info loops - Earthdawn was created after Shadowrun, and in the creation process someone back then thought it would be cool to connect the two.  Now, of course, the two RPGs have pretty much gone their separate ways.
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: Malex on <05-08-12/1003:07>
Agreed. Earthdawn's print dates suggest that it came out during Shadowrun 2nd Edition.
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: Stry on <05-08-12/1018:50>
My understanding it was a spin off toying with the idea of the fourth world, immortal elfs and dragons.
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: Mirikon on <05-08-12/1108:14>
That's what I understood, as well. You already had Shadowrun, in the 6th World, so someone decided it'd be a good idea to do a game about the 4th World. While Earthdawn is dead now, AFAIK, the links made between that world and Shadowrun have given a great deal of depth to the universe, and definitely helps shape Shadowrun as a whole.

Personally, I am waiting for a cult dedicated to Verjigorm to show up somewhere in the world, and see what the reactions of the local dragon population are.
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: Critias on <05-08-12/1140:58>
While Earthdawn is dead now, AFAIK...
Luckily, nope!

It's no longer owned by the same company as SR, mind you, so we're not going out of our way to introduce new ties left and right...but for those interested in ED as a game unto itself, and not just for the tangled web it wove with SR, it's certainly still alive (and a lot of fun in its own right).

First edition books will be the ones you want for the most Fourth/Sixth world crossover stuff (but even then it's in fluff, not crunch) -- but I think they're up to their Third edition, now, in terms of general gameplay. 
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: Wakshaani on <05-08-12/1344:13>
As for planned in the beginning?

No.

Remember, Shadowrun was published in '89. The idea of a game branching out into different timeframes from LAUNCH was a foreign concept. Who knew if Shadowrun would even be usccessful?

As it took off and did well, THEN you had some people spinning things off with connections to the long longago and, eventually, when enough intrest was built up, starting the Earthdawn branch, but, it's safe to say that it wasn't planned from launch.

(Mind you, while I've *played* since '89, I wasn't part of the design crew, so, not Word  of God here or anything.)
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: Cranstonvm on <05-08-12/1522:28>
As for planned in the beginning?

No.

Remember, Shadowrun was published in '89. The idea of a game branching out into different timeframes from LAUNCH was a foreign concept. Who knew if Shadowrun would even be usccessful?

As it took off and did well, THEN you had some people spinning things off with connections to the long longago and, eventually, when enough intrest was built up, starting the Earthdawn branch, but, it's safe to say that it wasn't planned from launch.

(Mind you, while I've *played* since '89, I wasn't part of the design crew, so, not Word  of God here or anything.)

Thank you. Personally I like that the games had connections it made it very interesting to play SR knowing that their was ancient ties and much more metaplot then just the from one time period.
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: hobgoblin on <05-09-12/0029:27>
Remember, Shadowrun was published in '89. The idea of a game branching out into different timeframes from LAUNCH was a foreign concept. Who knew if Shadowrun would even be usccessful?
I am guessing that SR came about as someone noticed how popular the whole Cyberpunk thing was, and wanted something in that style. But they needed something to stand out and they landed of a what if about the Mayan calendar. And presto here he have the 6th world. Then later someone starts wondering about the previous cycles and we get Earthdawn (mind you, was the whole Ethan speech written before or after Earthdawn?).
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <05-20-12/1611:34>
Pretty sure before.  Written for the 1E adventure 'Elven Fire', if memory serves me correctly.
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: The_Gun_Nut on <05-23-12/2253:17>
The devs knew early in the process that there would be a big backstory to Shadowrun.  After it became successful, they decided to flesh out said backstory into a full fledged game.

As Critias said, Earthdawn is alive and well in its 3rd edition.  It has even spun off (or is about to, have to check the release dates) for both Pathfinder and Savage Worlds.

Check out this link (http://redbrickllc.com/shop/index.php?main_page=page&id=5) for more info.
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: Mara on <05-30-12/0334:16>
As Critias said, Earthdawn is alive and well in its 3rd edition.  It has even spun off (or is about to, have to check the release dates) for both Pathfinder and Savage Worlds.

Check out this link (http://redbrickllc.com/shop/index.php?main_page=page&id=5) for more info.

*perks up* What was that? Pathfinder edition? COOL! *will inflict new Horrors on game group!*
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: SpiderWord on <05-30-12/1257:09>
If I remember correctly ED is published currently by Mongoose.
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: Mara on <05-30-12/2037:03>
If I remember correctly ED is published currently by Mongoose.

Neg..it is published by Red Brick
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: The_Gun_Nut on <05-31-12/2031:37>
Aff.  You are correct.
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: Lacynth40 on <06-10-12/0946:37>
Aff? Wow, we are REALLY going back to the old FASA datafiles, huh? Or did FASA use "aff" in Shadowrun as well as Battletech/Mechwarrior?
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: ArkangelWinter on <06-10-12/1552:47>
Aff? Wow, we are REALLY going back to the old FASA datafiles, huh? Or did FASA use "aff" in Shadowrun as well as Battletech/Mechwarrior?

Neg. But, speaking of games I miss  :'(
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: Mara on <06-11-12/0054:43>
Aff? Wow, we are REALLY going back to the old FASA datafiles, huh? Or did FASA use "aff" in Shadowrun as well as Battletech/Mechwarrior?

I have played Battletech and Shadowrun so long....clan speak and runner slang are part of my normal way of talking
in non-formal settings.
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: The_Gun_Nut on <06-11-12/1136:19>
Mechwarrior and Battletech are alive and well, also.  BOLS is even covering BT every so often.
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: ArkangelWinter on <06-11-12/1325:52>
Mechwarrior and Battletech are alive and well, also.  BOLS is even covering BT every so often.

Please dont tell me you mean that Dark Age crap. I think copious amounts of meth were involved in its creation.
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: The_Gun_Nut on <06-11-12/1437:03>
No, not Dark Age.  The entire timeline from Star League on up.  The book Total Warfare and the starter box are covered on Bell of Lost Souls.  The game is alive and well.
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: Mara on <06-12-12/0101:35>
Mechwarrior and Battletech are alive and well, also.  BOLS is even covering BT every so often.

Please dont tell me you mean that Dark Age crap. I think copious amounts of meth were involved in its creation.

Go here: http://bg.battletech.com/
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: _Pax_ on <06-12-12/1507:51>
As it took off and did well, THEN you had some people spinning things off with connections to the long longago and, eventually, when enough intrest was built up, starting the Earthdawn branch, but, it's safe to say that it wasn't planned from launch.
  Not at all true (assuming you mean "not at ED's launch").

  In the original, first-printing ED corebook?  Back in the day, I knew (and regularly gamed with) over half the names listed as playtesters in that book.  And with a few of the chief writers, too.

  And the university club I was part of, was involved in the later playtest.  So I got the opportunity to read through a lot of early-draft material.  The links were there, and they were pretty explicit.  The writers responsible for making ED, had a link in mind from Day 0 (of ED, not SR).

Quote
(Mind you, while I've *played* since '89, I wasn't part of the design crew, so, not Word  of God here or anything.)
  I also wasn't part of the team itself - but had regular access to, and conversations with, more than one of them.  :)
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: RelentlessImp on <06-12-12/1517:46>
I also wasn't part of the team itself - but had regular access to, and conversations with, more than one of them.  :)

Is it story time? :D I'd love to hear about the early days of ED when they were linking it to SR.
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: Glorthoron on <07-03-12/0021:17>
As for planned in the beginning?

No.

Remember, Shadowrun was published in '89. The idea of a game branching out into different timeframes from LAUNCH was a foreign concept. Who knew if Shadowrun would even be usccessful?

As it took off and did well, THEN you had some people spinning things off with connections to the long longago and, eventually, when enough intrest was built up, starting the Earthdawn branch, but, it's safe to say that it wasn't planned from launch.

(Mind you, while I've *played* since '89, I wasn't part of the design crew, so, not Word  of God here or anything.)

Wow, and I thought I was old.  :P
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: Glorthoron on <07-03-12/0022:05>
Have the mechanics changed at all, or is it still the same?
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: Glorthoron on <07-03-12/0023:57>
I also wasn't part of the team itself - but had regular access to, and conversations with, more than one of them.  :)

Is it story time? :D I'd love to hear about the early days of ED when they were linking it to SR.

Well, back when I was a young whipper snapper, this great game called Earthdawn came out.  We weren't quite sure what to make of it, but it had one of the (if not the) most interesting game mechanics I had ever seen. 

Just thinking about it makes me feel young again.
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: Mara on <07-03-12/0212:42>
Well, back when I was a young whipper snapper, this great game called Earthdawn came out.  We weren't quite sure what to make of it, but it had one of the (in not the) most interesting game mechanics I had ever seen. 

Just thinking about it makes me feel young again.

Yes, the whole "Steps" where something a certain value used a certain combination of dice was, and is, still an interesting
mechanic, and I do not think I have seen something similar attempted in any other system...And then there was the Nethermancer
Karma ritual that involved summoning up an entity and having tea with it....
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: The_Gun_Nut on <07-03-12/1841:59>
Savage Worlds uses progressively larger dice for the characters.  That's one.
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: Glorthoron on <07-03-12/2156:16>
Savage Worlds uses progressively larger dice for the characters.  That's one.

How long has Savage Worlds been around?
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: JustADude on <07-03-12/2349:31>
Savage Worlds uses progressively larger dice for the characters.  That's one.

Larger dice you say? ;D

(http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3261/2772161909_06cf2865d2.jpg)
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: Patrick Goodman on <07-04-12/1102:06>
re: Spidey dice pic -- I want one of those! Don't know where I'd store it or how I'd transport it, but I want one.

re: Savage Worlds -- It's been around for seven or eight years, I think, maybe a little longer. It's RPG predecessor, Deadlands, used a similar system. Each of your attributes was set at a particular die type (you could have a Strength of d6 and a Guts of d12, for instance). Situational modifiers could change the die type for that attribute.

TSR/WOTC had the late, much-lamented Alternity system, which had some similar dice-shifting mechanics. Very interesting system, but D&D3 and the D20 license caused it to be a casualty of war; to the best of my knowledge, there are no plans to revive it. More's the pity.
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: _Pax_ on <07-09-12/1317:04>
Have the mechanics changed at all, or is it still the same?
The mechanics have changed.  Drastically.  SR4 is, aside from the setting and backstory, just about completely unrecognisable compared to SR1.

Let's take just one thing ... combat with firearms.

First off, your damage tracks weren't attribute-dependant; you had 10 boxes for Physical, and 10 boxes for Stun.  Period.

Secondly, damage wasn't measured in a set numbr of boxes; they were measured in Wound Levels.  Light was 1 box, Medium was 3, Serious was 6, and Deadly was 10.

Thirdly, staging ... that is, modifying damage up (attacker) or down (victi- er, defender).  For every X successes in favor of one side or the other, the damage shifted by one category:
(none)<-->(L)<-->(M)<-->(S)<-->(D)<-->(D+1)<-->(D+2)<-->(etc)...

Fourthly, and this was dropped for 2E: ]b\not all weapons staged the same.[/b]  Weapon damage was listed as (power)(damage)(staging) ... for example, "6M2" for the Ares Predator IIRC.  The power of the weapon, possibly reduced by armor, would be the defender's Target Number (TN).  The Damage level was where it all started.  And the Staging number was how many Hits you needed, to shift things one step in your favor.

And fifthly: Target Numbers.  In SR4, the TN is always 5, and it's the die pool that gets modified by things like Smartlinks.  In SR1, 2, and 3 the die pool was largely static, and the TN got modified.  Starting TN for shooting people was a 4.  Smartguns lowered that by 2.  Hitting a TN of 7 or higher, meant you had to roll a 6, then roll that same die again (and add the new number to the total) ... the original "rule of six".

So, sometimes that 4L3 gun, might be better than a 5M2.  You're going to get lots of successes, and if your foe isn't wearing much armor, he's NOT.
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: Mirikon on <07-09-12/1324:18>
In other words, 4e is a HELLUVA lot simpler, which makes it easier to play.
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: Gideon on <07-10-12/2136:47>
First I love SR4

But a small guilty pleasure of mine in SR1-2 was making the little node maps for my Decker.  I would pull out the graph paper, my ziploc baggie with the color coded sharpies and my d6s to roll up a few data havens and what have you.  I think my Azzie Archology map  was 6 pages (for reference purposes only I would never MAKE a player navigate that...really)

But the simplicity of the mechanics in SR4 are easier to pick up and make for more of a team play in AR.  CP suffered from the make the team wait syndrome early on too.
Title: Re: Was Earthdawn planned from the beginning of Shadowrun?
Post by: hobgoblin on <07-11-12/1836:18>
Heh, had forgotten about that generator.