[Black]

We forgot that an armor value greater than damage value causes stun. But that mistake really sped up combat lol 

Really? You had them fighting people who had bigger Stun Tracks then Physical Tracks? Or are you meaning that
all damage went to one track?(Though, it should have all been going to the stun track, anyway..what sort of psychopaths
start with lethal ammo and trying to give the Corp incentive to hunt them down...)

I often only use one damage track for no-name grunts like security guards and go-gangers.  Its easier.

That said, I have recently started using Herolab to run combats and that allows me to easily use both damage tracks etc.

[Zilfer]

We forgot that an armor value greater than damage value causes stun. But that mistake really sped up combat lol 

Really? You had them fighting people who had bigger Stun Tracks then Physical Tracks? Or are you meaning that
all damage went to one track?(Though, it should have all been going to the stun track, anyway..what sort of psychopaths
start with lethal ammo and trying to give the Corp incentive to hunt them down...)

Also you might want to note that badguys in this game are supposed to have only 1 track of health. So 8 boxes stun or physical. I started out doing both tracks for enemies but that just slows down the game keeping track of both. I remember reading it in the rules somewhere I'm sure someone could qoute it who has the books handy.

It gives the players another edge, and the bad guys less of one which in the end the players are the star of the show so why not give it to them eh?

[Stonefur]

Speaking to the issue of having wired reflexes and the such take over combat, thats what it is supposed to do.  The trick is to also highlight the other situations when those reflexes are useless.  They can't do anything other than that, so when that character cant pull out his gun and shoot, he will be as useless as the techno mancer feels.  Also, there is always the great equalizer.  There is always some on better.  One trick i have used in numerous rpg's across all systems, is when you have a pc group that is just unstoappable, use their characters as a basis for their main enemies.  That way, you can boost up the villian to be just a hair over the pc's.  Often its the enemy most like ourselves we have trouble defeating.  There have to be radiant consequences for every choice the players make.  If they offed a mob mook, someone is goign to want to know who.  Murder is still a crime, and the authorities still are supposed to care, unless they have been bought off which makes for alot more fun when the mob and crooked cops get together and decide they can't have any more of  mr wired reflexes killing their employees.  Play dirty pool, its the name of the game!!!

[foolofsound]

My, we have a lot of thread necromancy on these forums.

[Critias]

My, we have a lot of thread necromancy on these forums.

It was like a week.  That ain't exactly the end of the world.

[foolofsound]

It was like a week.  That ain't exactly the end of the world.

Never said it was, just making an observation.

[Eugene]

I personally think the game runs best when everyone plays within one IP of everyone else, because the OP is right that it can be unfun when you go once but everybody else at the table goes three times.  Really it's worse because most every IP the sams have two shots!  If the technomancer has a weaponized drone that he can control, he'll get two or three IPs to play in, so that should help solve that issue.

I'll admit to rarely seeing the invincibility problem except with spirits (particularly of the possession tradition variety).  Even the guy who rolls 20 dice for damage resistance can get taken down by concentrated fire bursts in a round or three because of the -1 per additional attack rule.

[Zilfer]

I personally think the game runs best when everyone plays within one IP of everyone else, because the OP is right that it can be unfun when you go once but everybody else at the table goes three times.  Really it's worse because most every IP the sams have two shots!  If the technomancer has a weaponized drone that he can control, he'll get two or three IPs to play in, so that should help solve that issue.

I'll admit to rarely seeing the invincibility problem except with spirits (particularly of the possession tradition variety).  Even the guy who rolls 20 dice for damage resistance can get taken down by concentrated fire bursts in a round or three because of the -1 per additional attack rule.

Just remember when the person has their next action that -1 penalty resets so unless you have tons of people firing at said person they'll have that dice pool back in no time.

Also tell that to my ex-military troll with ~ 20 armor and 15 body and 15 Stun track connected to his 21 physical track with pain editor(i think that's what it is).

[beowulf_of_wa]

am so very much stealing the "defend against the horde" idea for getting my players used to combat in SR.

[All4BigGuns]

I personally think the game runs best when everyone plays within one IP of everyone else, because the OP is right that it can be unfun when you go once but everybody else at the table goes three times.  Really it's worse because most every IP the sams have two shots!  If the technomancer has a weaponized drone that he can control, he'll get two or three IPs to play in, so that should help solve that issue.

I'll admit to rarely seeing the invincibility problem except with spirits (particularly of the possession tradition variety).  Even the guy who rolls 20 dice for damage resistance can get taken down by concentrated fire bursts in a round or three because of the -1 per additional attack rule.

Just remember when the person has their next action that -1 penalty resets so unless you have tons of people firing at said person they'll have that dice pool back in no time.

Also tell that to my ex-military troll with ~ 20 armor and 15 body and 15 Stun track connected to his 21 physical track with pain editor(i think that's what it is).

Not to mention that the penalty is to the test to avoid being hit, not to the damage resistance. House ruling otherwise is just asking for a TPK.

[Zilfer]

Not that it matters but i'm home now looking at chummer and figured i'd mention his measly 5 reaction on top of the other dice, as well as the -1DV. (can't remember if that's from cyberware or being a troll... o.O' man i need to play shadowrun again)

Edit: I just noticed and to top it all off he has 5 edge.... o.O' man I want to play him again Thanks for the topic guys! maybe I can convince my group to play this weekend!