[Sabato Kuroi]

I think people keep confusing low Essence with being a cyberzombie.  If a player doesn't play his character as an apathetic robot going through the mere motions of being human, it might not be because he "just doesn't get it", but because he doesn't have the ability to read the GM's mind.  A shadowrunner with a high level of augmentations is desperately seizing any edge available to keep ahead of the power curve, in one of the Sixth World's most dangerous professions.  I have a hard time seeing any street samurai losing his survival instincts or drive for self-improvement, when his augmentations were taken to enhance those very things.

Augmentations offer plenty of roleplaying hooks, but if anything, Essence is overemphasized by too many people, and all of the other roleplaying opportunities get drowned out by the tired old "cyberware eats your soul" trope - when Essence is mainly a metagame limit to how much stuff you can cram into your body.  Because again, the affects of low Essence are comparatively subtle.

I prefer to look at the other ways augmentations can affect a character.  I played a street samurai who had mnemonic enhancers, and hated them, because when you do violence for a living, being able to recall it in perfect detail is a bad thing.  Another character, not one of mine, had skillwires, and felt curiously distant when using them; it was like the software was doing it, not her - which could be both good and bad, depending.  I think of synaptic boosters, and I remember all of the times I am stuck in a grocery line behind someone plodding like they're in slow motion, and you want to scream "Hurry up!"  Having synaptic boosters, when most people don't, could feel like that, all the time.  Augmentations can be cool, too.  They can turn you from the nerd who got stuffed into lockers into someone who is buff and tough.  They can give you sensations that humans couldn't experience before.  They can make you literally superhuman.

Sure, the guy with cyberlimbs, a pain regulator, and skillwires might feel inhuman, disconnected from his own actions, a bit numb.  But what about the guy with tricked-out cybereyes, muscle augmentation and toner, tailored pheromones, cerebral boosters, and a sleep regulator?  Especially if before, he was a puny specimen with insomnia and poor eyesight?  He probably feels great.

You know your whole post is poorly aimed at mine if you read the last line:

" the way to roleplay this loss of Essence should be the player's choice (mainly) but the GM should be able to provide some interesting opportunities for more rp, depending on  the type of augmentations and the cosmetic changes of the character."

So no need for mind reading etc.

If you feel that essence is just a number feel free to play it like this.But Essence is there to highlight the bargain.It gives you the opportunity to flesh out your character.Cyberpunk is about transhumanism and the cultural changes it implies.So, if transhumanism for you is just another stat, I have absolutely no problem with this, but in my mind "you just don't get" the setting.To each their own I guess.

If I played the   puny specimen you mentioned I would probably be so excited from this brand new self that I would  risk  of becoming a chrome worshiper.Someone who considers  cybered individuals to be superior

The ex-nerd turned strongman, well I would try to mimic the mindset of all those insecure guys who turned to steroids etc multiplied x10 because well, steroids don't actually turn you into  a superhuman being, cyberware does.


Gaining all those things without actually trying, well you gotta start wondering if you lost something in the process.

[Herr Brackhaus]

This, to me, is the quality of Essence - the more you deviate from the baseline in appearance the more the general populace is unconsciously disquieted.

While I think the rest of your post is sound, I couldn't disagree more with this last statement.

Essence doesn't have to about appearance. You can get 5.99 points of bioware and look exactly like you did before. Essence affecting social limits is to my mind about that uneasy feeling you get in the pit of your stomach because the guy you're talking to just seems... off.

Again, as I see it a GM is encouraged to apply situational modifiers; the wared-out, cyberlimb enhanced, armed-to-the-teeth street samurai will likely go over with the Hollywood glitterati at the Holistic Humanity party like a pile of cow dung on the dinnertable, so it's a fair bet his dice pools might take a hit. But amongst street toughs who not only respect modifications but are also card carrying members of the Transhumanist Movement, his dice pool might very well actually improve. Note however that these are situational modifiers, and not what the game describes as the unknown factor that puts people on edge around low-Essence characters.

Regardless of situational modifiers, the fact remains that people DO feel uneasy around people with lots of ware, and this is represented by your Social Limit taking a hit whether the 'ware is visible or not. No matter how "in" or "out" you are with a particular crowd, you'll find it difficult to completely overcome the fact that you are, irrevocably, less you than you were before the surgeries. Of course, making an effort to fit in (i.e. wearing the right clothes, bumping some novacoke, etc) can make all of that easier.

Ultimately, I feel like this argument boils down to how each individual views the setting. I personally find transhumanism a concept that is easy to identify with, so naturally I'm less inclined to think of 'ware as something that stands out and makes you less human in ways other than that described by the core rulebook in terms of mechanics. But, I also agree with several posters in this thread that there is a lot of roleplaying opportunities tied to having (significant amounts of) 'ware; whatever that becomes, though, ultimately ends up being the players choice influenced by the world around him, which ultimately is the GMs domain.

[Darzil]

Essence affects social limit exactly as much as Willpower, which for most is probably even harder for others to observe !

[Sterling]

I realised after I wrote the post that I hadn't made my final point anywhere near as clear as I could have.  That's the problem with typing a stream of consciousness.

Appearance was the wrong word completely.  I meant the more you deviate from the baseline in augmentation, the more the general populace is disquieted.

Of course, by the time I could change the post you had replied, so I wouldn't feel right simply editing the original text.

[Glyph]

Essence affects social limit exactly as much as Willpower, which for most is probably even harder for others to observe !

Exactly.  It's there, but there really isn't a lot to grab onto, roleplaying-wise.  You need to think about the positives and negatives of the individual augmentations, thinking "How would this change my character's outlook?"  This will vary from character to character.  One character might be able to get all kinds of things accomplished, because thanks to his sleep regulator, he only needs three hours of sleep a night.  A different character might be floundering around, because all of a sudden, he has five extra hours in his day, and no idea what to do with them.  I am playing one character, an ex-enforcer type, who has cerebral boosters: 2 and mnemonic enhancers: 2.  For some characters, I might play up how they feel their mental abilties have expanded.  For this particular character, I treat him more as a limited mind that has been overclocked.  But augmentations should not be uniformly negative in their effects, on either the character, or on those he interacts with.

[Kincaid]

Essence affects social limit exactly as much as Willpower, which for most is probably even harder for others to observe !

Exactly.  It's there, but there really isn't a lot to grab onto, roleplaying-wise.  You need to think about the positives and negatives of the individual augmentations, thinking "How would this change my character's outlook?"  This will vary from character to character.  One character might be able to get all kinds of things accomplished, because thanks to his sleep regulator, he only needs three hours of sleep a night.  A different character might be floundering around, because all of a sudden, he has five extra hours in his day, and no idea what to do with them.  I am playing one character, an ex-enforcer type, who has cerebral boosters: 2 and mnemonic enhancers: 2.  For some characters, I might play up how they feel their mental abilties have expanded.  For this particular character, I treat him more as a limited mind that has been overclocked.  But augmentations should not be uniformly negative in their effects, on either the character, or on those he interacts with.

Agreed.  I'm sketching out a short fiction piece that, among other things, looks at how having tailored pheromones impacts your day-to-day interactions with people, not just how well you negotiate with Johnsons.  Are you really that good at sweet talking your girlfriend or is it the 'ware?  Does she love you as much as you think she does, or is it the 'ware and the memory of how she feels in your presence?  Is it fair that you always seem to win arguments in person but split 50/50 for arguments over your comm?  Stuff like that adds dimension and flavor to augmentations beyond +X dice.