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Spirits and optional powers

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bmoham

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« on: <08-06-18/1311:51> »
This is as much a world building question as a rules one. Say you summon Clearsight the force 4 spirit of man with the optional power analyze device (from your spell list). Then, a week later you need a force 4 spirit of man with armor (also from your spell list). Can it be clearsight again, or does it need to be a different spirt (Bob?)
Basically can a specific spirit swap optional powers between summons, or is there some spirit out there with each optional power/combination of powers , and summoning finds that spirit?

Iron Serpent Prince

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« Reply #1 on: <08-06-18/1317:12> »
I'm pretty sure this will be a "by the table" answer.

It is simple enough to justify the same spirit swapping optional powers.
Spirits have all the optional powers, and all the summoner is doing is choosing which one(s) they (the summoner) have access to.

At the same time, it is just as easy to justify each spirit has different powers as if the spirits were built with character creation rules.

Which is in play will depend on the GM.  If you are the GM, then it is your call.

Michael Chandra

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« Reply #2 on: <08-06-18/1349:49> »
This is as much a world building question as a rules one. Say you summon Clearsight the force 4 spirit of man with the optional power analyze device (from your spell list). Then, a week later you need a force 4 spirit of man with armor (also from your spell list). Can it be clearsight again, or does it need to be a different spirt (Bob?)
Basically can a specific spirit swap optional powers between summons, or is there some spirit out there with each optional power/combination of powers , and summoning finds that spirit?
Unless you bound the spirit, you have no guarantee you summon the same one. The GM could rule it's the same spirit and its powers fluctuate. Our that it's a different one who did hear all the gossip about you.
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Sphinx

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« Reply #3 on: <08-06-18/1356:25> »
The way I look at it, when a magician summons a particular type of spirit, she gathers all of the magical energy that resonates with that spirit type from the surrounding environment, and gives it form and expression. The spirit reflects the tradition and beliefs of the summoner, and in some respects her personality and expectations as well. In one sense, the summoner creates the spirit on the spot. But in another sense, the spirit was always there, sleeping, waiting to be called.

If the same magician summons the same type of spirit in the same place, she'll get the same result. The spirit will respond to the same name, will look and act the same way, and will appear to remember the summoner and whatever happened the last time it was called. But if she summons a different type of spirit in that place, or the same type of spirit somewhere else, the result will be different. If another magician summons the same type of spirit in that place, the result will be different.

Every spirit is a unique mix of the qualities of the summoner, the place, and the spirit type.

At our gaming table, once you summon Clearsight (a Force 4 Spirit of Man) in your apartment, then Clearsight will answer every time you summon a Spirit of Man in your apartment. Once you decide it has the Analyze Device optional power, it always has that power. If you feed it more juice next time (Force 6), it can have a second optional power. But if you summon a Spirit of Man somewhere else, it won't be Clearsight (unless you Summoned and Bound the spirit at your apartment and brought it with you). You're free to define a new set of optional powers.

None of this is official/canon; it's just the way we play it.

Jayde Moon

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« Reply #4 on: <08-06-18/1858:20> »
You want the Canon answer?

It's "Yes?"

By canon, none of the magical scholars are actually sure how it works.  The prevalent school of thought is that you are summoning fully realized spirits that come with their own identity, but there's also a theory that spirits are molded by the will of the summoner (and even a theory that spirits don't actually exist before they are summoned but are formed at the moment of being called, though most magic scholars reject that).

It explains why spirits always seem to appear how the summoner would have imagined or in line with deeply held beliefs, usually 'customized' to the summoner.  It's why a Christian Theurge might summon 'angels' but the look and feel of the 'angels' summoned by two different CTs might be subtly different.

You may summon Bob and then later summon Bob in a different form, believing it's the same consciousness empowered through your will with different abilities.  Is he the same Bob?  Is he actually a different Bob?  Are his memories his own?  Does it matter?

Just like the question of riggers using agility to fire guns while jumped in, theorists and scholars bicker about it endlessly.
That's just like... your opinion, man.

HP15BS

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« Reply #5 on: <08-07-18/1641:51> »
Just like the question of riggers using agility to fire guns while jumped in, theorists and scholars bicker about it endlessly.

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