NEWS

6E Increase Astral Initiative?

  • 10 Replies
  • 1249 Views

Hobbes

  • *
  • Catalyst Demo Team
  • Prime Runner
  • ***
  • Posts: 3021
« on: <10-30-21/2116:28> »
Astral Projection gets you +2d6.  Is there anything else in 6E that can increase Astral Initiative dice? 

Xenon

  • *
  • Prime Runner
  • *****
  • Posts: 6395
« Reply #1 on: <10-31-21/0311:33> »
Huh... Good question actually. Don't think I've seen any. Then again, +2D6 = 4 minor actions = possibility to use 2 major actions. Most people seem to settle for this.

Then again, since the maximum is 5 minor actions it would make sense if there was some way to get that last +1D6

Most likely it should have been a Metamagic. Similar to Technomancer's Overclocking. Where a magician gain an extra initiative dice but only while using astral projection.

Hobbes

  • *
  • Catalyst Demo Team
  • Prime Runner
  • ***
  • Posts: 3021
« Reply #2 on: <10-31-21/0910:30> »
Astral Initiative is a total of +2d6, so 1 Major, 3 Minor actions.  Sorry if that wasn't clear. 

It totally could have been a Metamagic in previous editions.  No reason a sustained spell, Adept Power, or Foci couldn't do it though.  Just wondering if it was tucked away somewhere and I missed it.

Thanks! 

Xenon

  • *
  • Prime Runner
  • *****
  • Posts: 6395
« Reply #3 on: <10-31-21/1040:35> »
(SR6 p. 179)
• AR Initiative: Reaction + Intuition
• VR Initiative: (Cold Sim): Intuition + Data Processing + 1D6
• VR Initiative: (Hot Sim): Intuition + Data Processing + 2D6
(SR6 p. 161)
• Astral Initiative: (Projecting): Logic + Intuition + 2D6

Stainless Steel Devil Rat

  • *
  • Errata Coordinator
  • Prime Runner
  • *****
  • Posts: 4572
« Reply #4 on: <10-31-21/1144:32> »
It's still an open question as to whether a projecting mage's astral form can take a sustained spell.  Obviously not a physical spell, and health spells have to be P which rules out options like Increase Reflexes, even if one CAN have a sustained mana spell on a disembodied aura.

I'm of the opinion that since a disembodied aura can be targeted by mana spells (presumably, 6E doesn't clarify this either... have to go off of prior editions) ... it stands to reason that a sustained mana spell could be sustained post-targeting.  It should be possible under the Street Wyrd "Design your own spell" rules to create a mana spell designed to do what Increase Reflexes does, but for projecting No-Bodies.
RPG mechanics exist to give structure and consistency to the game world, true, but at the end of the day, you’re fighting dragons with algebra and random number generators.

Hobbes

  • *
  • Catalyst Demo Team
  • Prime Runner
  • ***
  • Posts: 3021
« Reply #5 on: <10-31-21/1721:45> »
(SR6 p. 179)
• AR Initiative: Reaction + Intuition
• VR Initiative: (Cold Sim): Intuition + Data Processing + 1D6
• VR Initiative: (Hot Sim): Intuition + Data Processing + 2D6
(SR6 p. 161)
• Astral Initiative: (Projecting): Logic + Intuition + 2D6

The Matrix initiative specifically says "note that the dice are in addition to the customary 1d6..."  I could not find anything like that for Astral Initiative so I'm under the impression that Astral Initiative is Logic + Intuition + 2d6, thus 1 Major, 3 Minor.  I'm totally willing to be wrong if there is something I missed.

Hobbes

  • *
  • Catalyst Demo Team
  • Prime Runner
  • ***
  • Posts: 3021
« Reply #6 on: <10-31-21/1752:17> »
It's still an open question as to whether a projecting mage's astral form can take a sustained spell.  Obviously not a physical spell, and health spells have to be P which rules out options like Increase Reflexes, even if one CAN have a sustained mana spell on a disembodied aura.

I'm of the opinion that since a disembodied aura can be targeted by mana spells (presumably, 6E doesn't clarify this either... have to go off of prior editions) ... it stands to reason that a sustained mana spell could be sustained post-targeting.  It should be possible under the Street Wyrd "Design your own spell" rules to create a mana spell designed to do what Increase Reflexes does, but for projecting No-Bodies.

Health spells can be Type M.  Resist Pain and Stabilize p. 137 CRB.

Speed of Thought
(Health)
Range Touch, Type M, Duration S, DV 5 + 1 per extra net hit kept.

This spell frees an Astrally projection form from the constraints of the flesh.  Your thoughts become actions without that pesky neural transmission lag slowing you down.  Add 1 to your Intuition, and 1d6 to your Astral Initiative for each hit on a Sorcery + Magic (5 - Essence) test, only keep as many hits as you want. 

Spell Type: Health DV 2
Ingredients: Affect Living Things, Attribute Boost, Planar Effect
Class: General

Could also fluff it as a Detection Spell "Foresight" or some such, different spell description, same mechanics under the hood.

Could also home brew a Metamagic, as it's basically Overclock with Astral Initiative instead of Matrix. 

Lots of ways it could be done.  Nothing RAW though.


Xenon

  • *
  • Prime Runner
  • *****
  • Posts: 6395
« Reply #7 on: <10-31-21/1906:16> »
The Matrix initiative specifically says ....
You get +2D6 for a total of 3D6 (1 Major and 4 Minor actions) when using hot sim VR (same as fully virtual constructs such as IC that also get a total of 3D6).

Even though the clarifying text is missing (as you pointed out) the intent still seem to be that you get +2D6 for a total of 3D6 (1 Major and 4 Minor actions) when using Astral Projection as well (same as wholly astral entities such as Spirits that also get a total of 3D6).


Could also home brew a Metamagic, as it's basically Overclock with Astral Initiative instead of Matrix. 
This is what i am leaning towards (if it would ever come up).

4 Minor actions for TMs using hot-sim or magicians using projection.
5 Minor actions for hot-sim TMs getting echo or projecting magicians getting metamagic.
Streamlined. I like.
« Last Edit: <10-31-21/1913:26> by Xenon »

Beta

  • *
  • Ace Runner
  • ****
  • Posts: 1909
  • SR1 player, SR5 GM@FtF & player@PbP
« Reply #8 on: <11-02-21/1121:38> »
Astral init being rolled with 3d6 would also be consistent with 5e, so one more reason to read it that way.

Hobbes

  • *
  • Catalyst Demo Team
  • Prime Runner
  • ***
  • Posts: 3021
« Reply #9 on: <11-02-21/1909:34> »
Totally agree that +3d6 is the intent, and fairly easy for long time Shadowrun players and GMs to draw that conclusion.  RAW is pretty clearly +2d6, and it would be difficult for new players and GMs to draw the correct (intended) conclusion.  Which is unfortunate.   

Xenon

  • *
  • Prime Runner
  • *****
  • Posts: 6395
« Reply #10 on: <11-04-21/1440:15> »
It seem as if most rules in SR6 are supposed to be read as intended rather than as strictly as written. That common sense seem to weight heavier than what is strictly written.