[Aryeonos]

It's not so much it's application I'd call into question so much as the ubiquity of the materials involved. I mean, you can buy space blankets at your local camp and pack/army surplus for cheap and just use them in sewing and not only are you keeping yourself insulated you're also mitigating your heat signature, I'm a little more than suspect at the forbidden or even restrictedness of thermal damping.

[Prodigy]

Yeah I do not apply that restriction in my games. I also change many gun restrictions too.

[Aryeonos]

I suppose you could look at it as however much extra unlicensed R armour you have are extra fines when if and when you do get arrested, and the F stuff just gets you a straight to jail ticket, or something like that. But I really think R and F gear should be more or less up to the GMs discretion based on the area, for the most part.

[Novocrane]

What do space blankets have to do with a material that either contains your heat without cooking you in regular temperatures, or disperses it without giving you away? (or some degree of both)

Imho, restricted items tend to fall under security-level clearance, while forbidden means military or corporate clearance.

[All4BigGuns]

Imho, restricted items tend to fall under security-level clearance, while forbidden means military or corporate clearance.

How do you explain the utter ridiculousness of Suprathyroid Gland being given a Forbidden tag?

[Aryeonos]

That same material traps thermal radiation, and is water tight, it will hide your thermal signature. The in game upgrade version is just a manufactured version of the same materials and other fabrics made in better configured layers that are more comfortable to wear, but it'll get less comfy the lower you try and reduce your heat signature, because that heat that would normally be used to detect you is now trapped around your body. Though, I'm fairly certain that in 2070 your clothes have multiple built in features to keep you cool and comfortable naturally so I doubt that it'd be terribly bad by todays standards.

[Novocrane]

What you just said supports this: thermal damping isn't space blankets. Not water tight, no overheating issues.

[Aryeonos]

No, it's mylar fabric, which is what space blankets are made out of. The point is, the material that thermal damping is made out of is extremely common and easy to access, not SOTA Milspec material.

[JoeNapalm]

No, it's mylar fabric, which is what space blankets are made out of. The point is, the material that thermal damping is made out of is extremely common and easy to access, not SOTA Milspec material.

Translation:

"I want Thermal Damping without restriction, so it's just mylar."

Thermal Damping is only useful if it is full-body. If you wrap yourself entirely in space blankets and body armor, in the summer in Seattle, two things will happen.

1. The mylar will heat up to 98.6 degrees, over time. Conservation of energy, and all that...the heat has to go somewhere.

2. You will die a horrible death from suffocation, heat stroke, and/or dehydration.

It is restricted because it is military tech with no legitimate civilian application, and useful for being nefarious.

-Jn-
Ifriti Sophist

[Aryeonos]

It's not just mylar, I'm pointing out that it's silly to be able to restrict something that you can make at home out of common materials probably quite easily given the tech level. I know, you can make guns and such at home too, out of common materials, but even those are usually just restricted for you to have. I think it should be R not F simply, and even then I don't think it should be part of your daytime attire even if it is unrestricted.

It would raise eyebrows if you wore a ski mask around a bank even if it's just winter, but compounding suspicious behavior usually warrants follow ups by police and security. Thermal damping should be the same.

[Reiper]

It's not just mylar, I'm pointing out that it's silly to be able to restrict something that you can make at home out of common materials probably quite easily given the tech level. I know, you can make guns and such at home too, out of common materials, but even those are usually just restricted for you to have. I think it should be R not F simply, and even then I don't think it should be part of your daytime attire even if it is unrestricted.

It would raise eyebrows if you wore a ski mask around a bank even if it's just winter, but compounding suspicious behavior usually warrants follow ups by police and security. Thermal damping should be the same.

Thats why I always use a common sense approach with Lonestar and security when GMing.

If the players aren't doing anything to attract suspicion then there is no real reason to look closely at what they have. Now if they are caught B&E then yeah I'd have them searched.

[Aryeonos]

Exactly. Though I should really do some research into the legal system, because as I understand it, unless you're a SINer, incarceration is a (T)PK.

[JoeNapalm]

Currently, IRL, aw enforcement would need a warrant to aim a thermal imaging device at you.

Why? Because it is essentially a search of your person.

In 2070 SR, with the ubiquity of cyber and the privatization of Law Enforcement, Lone Star would be crazy not to to use thermal.

Not only does dampening hide you, it conceals your 'ware and gear.

As for incarceration being a TPK...that's a very narrow view. Surely someone with some pull either owes you a favor, out would like you to owe them.  Ever seen Escape from New York ?

Escape, rescue, erasure of evidence, pulling strings, bribery, blackmail, cutting a deal with the cops, prosecutor, crime lord, etc. etc. etc...

Getting locked up is bad, but it isn't DEAD. Which is why most people surrender when caught.

-Jn-
City of Brass Expatriate

[Mirikon]

Well, they would need a warrant for thermal imaging, except in situations where there's no expectation of privacy. Airports, for instance.

But Joe is correct that Jail is not a TPK. It certainly means you've failed your mission, and have some nice shiny new criminal SINs, but you're not dead. Heck, with the right 'favors' you might even avoid having the criminal SIN (though you'll likely end up with Records on File with whoever helped you). The megas, syndicates, and national agencies all have a long history of making a runner inside an 'offer they can't refuse'.

[JoeNapalm]

Well, they would need a warrant for thermal imaging, except in situations where there's no expectation of privacy. Airports, for instance.

True. Good point. And as anyone who has been to the UK knows, there is no expectation of privacy for simply being in some public areas, not just airports.

Also, consent. Seems silly...who would grant consent?  But the old "You don't mind if I...?" ploy works more often than not.

It's an interesting question, as well, as to which security forces are "agents of the government"...Lone Star, with an official charter, probably. Corp Sec forces aren't bound by the same rules. Nor Beaverville Rent-a-Cops.

-Jn-
Everyone's Favorite Vile Fiend