[CanRay]

Except for the new weapons that look...  OK, honestly, who the hell did the art on this stuff?

[Critias]

Except for the new weapons that look...  OK, honestly, who the hell did the art on this stuff?

While I'm not crazy about some of 'em myself (not because I think they're bad, necessarily, but because they just don't look like things I'd want to fire)...real life, today, gives us crazy looking stuff like:

[spoiler]TDI Vector: http://www.google.com/search?q=tdi+vector&hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=Yhl&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&prmd=ivns&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=CLlVTuG2Csm1twfrjqGQAg&ved=0CC4QsAQ&biw=1022&bih=897

Magpul FMG-9: http://www.google.com/search?q=tdi+vector&hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=Yhl&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&prmd=ivns&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=CLlVTuG2Csm1twfrjqGQAg&ved=0CC4QsAQ&biw=1022&bih=897#hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=S2Q&rls=org.mozilla:en-US%3Aofficial&tbm=isch&sa=1&q=magpul+fmg9&pbx=1&oq=magpul+fmg9&aq=f&aqi=g2&aql=&gs_sm=e&gs_upl=22397l26331l0l26742l20l14l0l1l1l0l231l1888l0.8.3l13l0&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=cb336c8b1daafac4&biw=1022&bih=897

PP-2000: http://www.google.com/search?q=tdi+vector&hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=Yhl&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&prmd=ivns&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=CLlVTuG2Csm1twfrjqGQAg&ved=0CC4QsAQ&biw=1022&bih=897#hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=XN6&rls=org.mozilla:en-US%3Aofficial&tbm=isch&sa=1&q=PP+2000&oq=PP+2000&aq=f&aqi=g2&aql=&gs_sm=e&gs_upl=24641l26960l0l27167l17l9l0l2l2l0l180l564l2.4l7l0&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=cb336c8b1daafac4&biw=1022&bih=897


FN F2000:  http://www.google.com/search?q=tdi+vector&hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=Yhl&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&prmd=ivns&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=CLlVTuG2Csm1twfrjqGQAg&ved=0CC4QsAQ&biw=1022&bih=897#hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=zN6&rls=org.mozilla:en-US%3Aofficial&tbm=isch&sa=1&q=fn+2000&oq=fn+2000&aq=f&aqi=g1g-s9&aql=&gs_sm=e&gs_upl=26566l27197l2l27406l7l5l0l0l0l0l294l920l0.3.2l5l0&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=cb336c8b1daafac4&biw=1022&bih=897

Steyr AUG (though we've already had them in SR for a while): http://www.google.com/search?q=tdi+vector&hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=Yhl&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&prmd=ivns&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=CLlVTuG2Csm1twfrjqGQAg&ved=0CC4QsAQ&biw=1022&bih=897#hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=QO6&rls=org.mozilla:en-US%3Aofficial&tbm=isch&sa=1&q=steyr+aug&oq=steyr+aug&aq=f&aqi=g10&aql=&gs_sm=e&gs_upl=14816l15763l4l15838l9l6l0l0l0l0l209l789l0.4.1l5l0&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=cb336c8b1daafac4&biw=1022&bih=897

FN P90:  http://www.google.com/search?q=tdi+vector&hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=Yhl&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&prmd=ivns&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=CLlVTuG2Csm1twfrjqGQAg&ved=0CC4QsAQ&biw=1022&bih=897#hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=53Q&rls=org.mozilla:en-US%3Aofficial&tbm=isch&sa=1&q=FN+P90&oq=FN+P90&aq=f&aqi=g10&aql=&gs_sm=e&gs_upl=19218l20417l6l20671l6l5l0l0l0l0l215l518l0.2.1l5l0&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=cb336c8b1daafac4&biw=1022&bih=897[/spoiler]

(Spoiler tags used to hide the ugly, ugly, code that seems to be the only way to hotlink stuff)

So there's plenty of stuff out there that someone 60+ years ago would look at and go "LOL WHUT?" and never ever want to hold in their hand, shoulder, put close to their face, and pull the trigger on.  I think maybe the Gun Heaven team went a little too...uhh..."out there"...with some of the designs, myself -- like I said! -- but it's not like there's absolutely no precedent for some guns to just give you a total WTF moment when you look at 'em.

[CanRay]

Do they look like weapons?  Yes.  For a Space Opera.

And, aside from the FMG-9 (Which is supposed to not look like a firearm) and the P90 (Which reminds a newly famous author of a box of chocolates), those all look like legit firearms to me.  Weird, yes.  Futuristic, some of them (The Steyr AUG is older than I am, actually.), but definitely firearms.

I think one of the Revolvers I wouldn't even want to have tried in Gun Haven Heaven.

Probably the gun nut in me.  OK, the artist went too "Out of the park" on the designs.  I can understand.  Hell, I had to show one how the mechanism of an automatic weapon worked in order to get good art from him on one project I was involved with.  (I found a video of a Sten II firing and got it to work in slow motion.).  But, well, we're Canucks.  What the hell are we supposed to know about firearms other than they're bad in the hands of criminals and good in the hands of police? 

Oh, and a bolt-action rifle is dangerous unless it ONLY holds 5-rounds in it.   

[Chrona]

I think one of the Revolvers I wouldn't even want to have tried in Gun Haven Heaven.

I have an Ex-KE SOCO Face that exclusively uses revolvers, in game (pre-gun heaven) he ended up it all of them. Post gun heaven he turned his nose up at the new revolver.

[CanRay]

I think one of the Revolvers I wouldn't even want to have tried in Gun Haven Heaven.

I have an Ex-KE SOCO Face that exclusively uses revolvers, in game (pre-gun heaven) he ended up it all of them. Post gun heaven he turned his nose up at the new revolver.

The Colt Coralsnake or the Ruger Bloodhawk?

[Chrona]

Coralsnake or the Ruger Bloodhawk?

Ah I meant the Ruger Bloodhawk. I'd forgotten the Colt Coralsnake existed. I can firmly say he didn't like either.

[CanRay]

The Colt Coralsnake states it's larger than the Colt Asp, yet is a 5-shot that costs more, and in the same "Caliber" (Damage Code).  It'd work better as "Smaller than the Colt Asp" and been made a Hold-Out (Like a "Mountain Revolver").

The Ruger Bloodhawk, well, who designed that hammer, and for what kind of hand?  And it's supposed to be a "Bigger Troll Handcannon", yet is chambered for a smaller caliber (Damage code) than the Ruger Super Warhawk, at a lot larger cost.  Sticks certainly has it right in the Shadowtalk.

The only things I get from the "New" firearms is that marketing is running design more than the engineers are.  Which...  Actually doesn't surprise me.

EDIT:  Alright, alright, I think I've whined enough about the art and such.  We all get it, right?

[Chrona]

The Colt Coralsnake states it's larger than the Colt Asp, yet is a 5-shot that costs more, and in the same "Caliber" (Damage Code).  It'd work better as "Smaller than the Colt Asp" and been made a Hold-Out (Like a "Mountain Revolver").
The Ruger Bloodhawk, well, who designed that hammer, and for what kind of hand?  And it's supposed to be a "Bigger Troll Handcannon", yet is chambered for a smaller caliber (Damage code) than the Ruger Super Warhawk, at a lot larger cost.  Sticks certainly has it right in the Shadowtalk.
The only things I get from the "New" firearms is that marketing is running design more than the engineers are.  Which...  Actually doesn't surprise me.

Yup they've decided to make bad guns sell well.

Good and bad for crime. Criminals not in the know will use worse, traceable gear. Straight and narrow/uninformed shadow targets (it happens) will have a sub-standard defence.

Runners will stick to tried and tested guns, players will whine for new toys with better/unique stats. (I like the Taurus' less chance to glitch)

[CanRay]

Or you get GMs/Players like me who write their own stuff. 

[Chrona]

Or you get GMs/Players like me who write their own stuff. 

True, I make double barrelled burst fire Deputy's when i do.

[CanRay]

I make things like this.

[Chrona]

I make things like this.

My Soco would buy it

[CanRay]

Maybe your Soco can be part of the teams that tests it.  Or has the other Shadowruns around it. 

[Chrona]

Heh I wish.

[Shadowjack]

This is a cool book. I was REALLY hoping for a new flamethrower though. But the Ogre Hammer partially makes up for it. A large portion of the guns are pistols.