Shadowrun Play > Rules and such

[SR6] Firing Squad - comfusion related to small unit tactics

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MercilessMing:
Since only Team member 2 is going to engage in the SUT, only their initiative matters and they don't need to wait till team member 3.

Suppressive Fire is probably the least important SUT for team members to act together, and I would personally ignore the requirement on that one.  I don't even like suppressive fire being a SUT, I would have made it a regular action or edge action.  But anyway, the purpose of the lowest initiative rule is so that coordinated action happens simultaneously and you avoid having movement formations broken by the nature of rpg initiative timing. 

If going on the lowest initiative doesn't feel right to you, a house rule you could adopt is that extra successes above the required threshold act as a bonus to initiative for the SUT action.

marfish:

--- Quote from: MercilessMing on ---Since only Team member 2 is going to engage in the SUT, only their initiative matters and they don't need to wait till team member 3.

Suppressive Fire is probably the least important SUT for team members to act together, and I would personally ignore the requirement on that one.  I don't even like suppressive fire being a SUT, I would have made it a regular action or edge action.  But anyway, the purpose of the lowest initiative rule is so that coordinated action happens simultaneously and you avoid having movement formations broken by the nature of rpg initiative timing. 

If going on the lowest initiative doesn't feel right to you, a house rule you could adopt is that extra successes above the required threshold act as a bonus to initiative for the SUT action.

--- End quote ---

I am more concern about how the rule actually work (especially the "performed on the lowest initiative score of the participants" part), the writting feels off or miss something, and I can't find any other referent rule.

Well, more than a few components of the SUT rule is missing in my opinion.

Xenon:
I too think that Suppressive fire would have been a great candidate as an Edge Action (requiring a Major Attack Action plus a firearm with at least 10 bullets and set to full auto firing mode - affected target's AR and DR debuffed for one round).




--- Quote from: marfish on ---Only the leader has SUT, and only Team member 2 have an FA weapon in this scenario
--- End quote ---
In this scenario it looks like only Team member 2 will be applying suppressive fire (since "attackers must have full-auto-capable firearms and sufficient ammunition").

Squad leader will not perform the maneuver, instead he will just instruct Team member 2 on how to execute the maneuver (as "at least one team member must have the SUT knowledge skill as well as the Influence active skill (to perform a maneuver or instruct others how to perform it)")

Note that spend time and effort to prep a combat maneuver with someone else that does not have SUT does not seem to be efficient if you plan on doing it during on-going combat due to the high cost (as all participants basically lose an entire round just setting up the maneuver).


Having said that, this is how it seem as if it would be resolved:

Team member 1 act first. Using a non-FA weapon means that he does not seem to be eligible to help out providing suppressive fire.

Enemy one act next. Suppressive fire is not yet started so his AR is currently unaffected.

Then Squad Leader act next. He save his major action for later to instruct Team Member 2 on how to properly enact suppressive fire in a way that it will debuff their enemies (because the combat maneuver is "performed on the lowest initiative score of the participants"). If he got enough minor actions he can trade them for a regular attack.

Enemy two act next. Suppressive fire is not yet started so his AR is currently unaffected.

Then Team member 2 act. Squad Leader now spend his Major action to instruct Team Member 2 on how to properly enact the suppressive fire combat maneuver. Team member 2 spend his Major action to listen to the instructions. If Team member 2 have enough minor actions to trade in for a Major action he can already now fire 10 bullets while performing a FA attack. Two enemies were affected by the suppressive fire maneuver and would in that case get reduced DR when defending.

Then Enemy 3 act. If he happen to be one of the two targets affected by suppressive fire then his AR will be (slightly) reduced when attacking.

Followed by Team Member 3. If he happen to attack one of the two targets that are suppressed by Team member 2 then their DR will be reduced due to that.



Had instead Team member 2 switched firearms with Squad Leader (or if Squad Leader had a FA weapon of his own and Team member 2 that does not have SUT knowledge skill would just make a regular FA attack without participating in the suppressive fire maneuver) then the scenario would likely instead play out like this:

Team member 1 act first. Same as before.

Enemy one act next. Suppressive fire is not yet started so his AR is currently unaffected. Same as before.

Then Squad Leader act next. As he got SUT he only need to spend a Minor Action (instead of holding a Major action) to prep the suppressive fire combat maneuver. Then he (in the same combat turn) spend his Major Action to fire 10 bullets while performing a FA Attack. Two enemies were affected by the suppressive fire maneuver and get reduced DR when defending.

Enemy two act next. Assuming he was one of the two affected enemies his AR while attacking will be (slightly) reduced.

Then Team member 2 act. If he happen to attack any of the two targets that are suppressed then their DR will be reduced due to that.

Then Enemy 3 act.

Followed by Team Member 3.




If both Squad Leader and Team member 2 uses FA weapons and if both of them also have required skills then it would instead play out like this:

Team member 1 act first. Same as before.

Enemy one act next. Same as before.

Then Squad Leader act next. He save one of his minor actions (instead of a Major action) for later to enact the combat maneuver together with Team member 2 (because "If all team members participating in an SUT maneuver have the Small Unit Tactics knowledge skill, combat maneuvers are treated as minor actions"). He uses his Major action to perform a regular FA attack (without suppressive fire).

Enemy two act next. Suppressive fire is not yet started so his AR is currently unaffected.

Then Team member 2 act. Squad Leader now spend his saved Minor action to enact suppressive fire together with Team member 2 that also spend one of his Minor actions. As Team member 2 have required skills he assist Squad Leader with a Team Work test that perhaps result in a total of 3 hits, rather than 2. Team member 2 then fire 10 bullets while performing a FA attack. All enemies were affected by the suppressive fire maneuver get reduced DR when defending.

Then Enemy 3 act. All three targets will have (slightly) reduced AR when attacking.

Followed by Team Member 3. All three targets are affected by suppressive fire so all three of them will have reduced DR.

Xenon:
Also, it also seem as if following (full auto) attack roll(s) by participating attackers will not just hit targets within a 1-meter radius anymore, but instead "the number of total hits determines how many targets the attackers can hit with an attack roll".

marfish:
 ;D That slove me questions pretty will, thanks.

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