[Banshee]

So that said, you just have to be fair and judicious with your use of scaling opposition. I had some GMs that took that liberty with Phain (just adding 7-10 dice to all of their rolls towards the end of my career was common), and I had some that didn't care and just made the game as fun as possible. Ray Rigel, Tony Merryman, Steve Roth, John Siemon, and Michael Etheridge were always my local favorites.

I didn't realize you were local, we probably played together some at Fog of Dusk then. I didn't run there since that was the only time I got to play. Ray or Micheal usually ran the tables I played at

[Lormyr]

I didn't realize you were local, we probably played together some at Fog of Dusk then. I didn't run there since that was the only time I got to play. Ray or Micheal usually ran the tables I played at

That might well be! If we did, and I forgot you, I do apologize! I came in right at the end of FoD before the move to BTB, winter of 2014 I think it was?

[Banshee]

I didn't realize you were local, we probably played together some at Fog of Dusk then. I didn't run there since that was the only time I got to play. Ray or Micheal usually ran the tables I played at

That might well be! If we did, and I forgot you, I do apologize! I came in right at the end of FoD before the move to BTB, winter of 2014 I think it was?

maybe a bit later ... I quit going about the time Micheal moved and Ray quit running there, have not been to BtB or Orc's Forge either one for SR yet

[Lormyr]

maybe a bit later ... I quit going about the time Micheal moved and Ray quit running there, have not been to BtB or Orc's Forge either one for SR yet

Michael actually got me into it. I used to do a vampire larp with him a very long time ago, so he was an ooooold connection. Thinking about it makes me feel ancient, geez.

I didn't meet Ray until BtB. Ray was my favorite for consistency and fairness, Michael for making my social life hell "you got a license for that there spirit, boy!?", and Tony for not giving a single F and doing anything to make the table have a blast. His rendition of Friendship is Tragic was amazing.

[Xenon]

...and deckers are always getting 2 edge a turn.

Remember one of the live videos explaining that you get edge for hot-sim hacking.
Can't find that when flipping through the pages.... is it in there somewhere?

[Shinobi Killfist]

...and deckers are always getting 2 edge a turn.

Remember one of the live videos explaining that you get edge for hot-sim hacking.
Can't find that when flipping through the pages.... is it in there somewhere?

So a hot sim analytical mind decker is rocking 2 edge a turn every turn. At the max without even trying to set things up.

[Hobbes]

...and deckers are always getting 2 edge a turn.

Remember one of the live videos explaining that you get edge for hot-sim hacking.
Can't find that when flipping through the pages.... is it in there somewhere?

I don't see that referenced anywhere obvious.  If it's in there its hiding. 

[Stainless Steel Devil Rat]

I thought this was a thing too.  Not seeing it either.  Must have gotten bad info and assimilated it as gospel

Honestly not sad to have been wrong.  Free edge just for being in hotsim WAS too good to be true.  And it gives reason to have good ASDF array, because let's face it every hacker is going to have Analytical Mind, no matter what its cost may end up being.  (for 3 karma, it's mandatory for EVERY character imo)

[Shinobi Killfist]

They should probably keep it at 3 karma but limit it to the same circumstances that got you +2 dice in 5e. Free edge should be rare when the cap is two a turn.

[Lormyr]

They should probably keep it at 3 karma but limit it to the same circumstances that got you +2 dice in 5e. Free edge should be rare when the cap is two a turn.

That is the main thing that makes the focus on the edge system self-defeating for me. In just about any situation that you are taking action appropriate to said situation, with a character designed to harvest edge from those situations, capping out is of trivial difficulty.

[Hobbes]

My guess is Hackers vs even moderate sized Hosts will be hurting for Edge generation, and will be burning through Edge even faster than in 5th.  Analytical Mind will probably be the one thing they can count on.

Hackers life is hard life yo. 

[Shinobi Killfist]

They should probably keep it at 3 karma but limit it to the same circumstances that got you +2 dice in 5e. Free edge should be rare when the cap is two a turn.

That is the main thing that makes the focus on the edge system self-defeating for me. In just about any situation that you are taking action appropriate to said situation, with a character designed to harvest edge from those situations, capping out is of trivial difficulty.

Everything I’ve seen so far leads me to believe the edge system would be a great supplement to a system but not great as a focus of the system.

[Jareth Valar]

And it gives reason to have good ASDF array, because let's face it every hacker is going to have Analytical Mind, no matter what its cost may end up being.  (for 3 karma, it's mandatory for EVERY character imo)

This type of statement is exactly why I have issues with some of the statements defending/explaining things. "Everybody's going to take/do X because of <insert pure mechanical bonus>, if not you're not playing right" kind of statement. Like "everyone ALWAYS used monowhip and shockgloves anyway" kind of statement.

What happened to making an actual character? What about Decker's that aren't analytical geniuses? Or an adept that focuses on using a Jian ("Tai Chi sword to some) because that's what his late master used?

Not everything is about pure mechanical advantage, if it is stop trying to call this a ROLE-playing game and embrace the pure "ROLL-playing" aspect so many seem to be suggesting.

[Hobbes]

Good optimization works hand in hand with a character concept.  If Shadowrun min/maxing was purely about "The Best" character they'd be Mages and Mystic Adepts exclusively. 

Some choices are simply mechanically supporting being good at something that have nothing to do with the character concept.  Can you really RP the difference between Firearms 6 and Firearms 4? 

Other choices, like what kind of sword do I swing, are assumptions you build around. 

I've built Hobbes in 4 out of 5 editions (Skipped 4th, 6th is pending) and she's always been Human, Samurai, former CAS Marine Force Recon, hated Aztek.  The rest is whatever the most effective combat machine I can squeeze out of any particular edition given those parameters.  Will be again in 6th. 

[Banshee]

yeah, but there is a difference between optimizing so your character is good and not just passable at something and powergame-optimizing where you are trying to beat the game or show there is only "one" way to build/play a character

there a lot of "optimizers" who think they are doing the first but are actually doing the second ... and that is where the arguments start

now I am not calling anybody out because there are very few of you that I have actually sat down and played a game with because yes regardless of how you built the character how you play it really influences how you are perceived ... but the Type 2 players quickly end up with a target at my tables and I have no problem showing them that I can play that game better if need be and I will beat them at their own game