[Carmody]

As I pointed out in the shifter thread, I have some issues with the Awakened and Emerged amps. In order not to derail the other thread, I open this one.

In the Forces of Chaos section (character creation) it is mentionned that it costs 2 shadow amp points to be Awakened or Emerged. It does not state that it uses one of the shadow amps slots.

If you want access to either of these areas (but not both—characters cannot be both Awakened and Emerged), you have to select that option in this step and pay the cost. Check either the Awakened or Emerged box on your character sheet, and deduct 2 Shadow Amp points (see step 7)

However they appear in the shadow amps list p. 202, which suggest that it uses amps slots, which is an issue to me if we stick to 6 amps max.
I will not consider it consumes a slot in my game.

For Awakened character, no distinction is made between full mages, adepts and mystic adepts. I think it was done for the sake of simplicity but is too simple for me.
Here is what can think about

• Magician: access to astral perception and projection, spell amps and conjuring and misc magical amps
• Adept: access do adept amps and misc magical amps
• Mystic adept: access to astral perception, spell amps and conjuring adept amps and misc magical amps

However I do not think a flat 2 points is fair. Let's breakdown the benefits:

• Astral perception: new sense directly usable, worth 1 amp point
• Astral projection: new capability directly usable, worth 1 amp point
• Conjuring: new capability directly usable, worth 1 amp point
• access to spell / adept / misc magical amps: need to spend more shadow amps points to get a benefit, worth 1 point whatever the number

This would lead to 4 points for full magician, 1 for adepts and 3 for mystic adepts
It seems like a big increase, so maybe it is better to just reduce the cost to 1 for adepts

Any thoughts?

[Shadowjack]

If you're going to create a new model for pricing I would probably adhere to the current 2 amp point cost and offer a variety of perks for each of the three options. Keep in mind that 2 amp points is fairly valuable and at character creation they could be worth a total of 9 karma or more, assuming you improve listed amps or create custom amps. I'm not sure how you should balance mystic adepts.

[Hobbes]

Mystic Adept, has spells, can Summon Spirits, has powers. 
Mage, has spells, can Summon Spirits, has powers (Sustaining Foci / Quickened Spells).
Physical Adept, has spells (Adept Spell power), has powers.  No Spirits.

Assortment of differences of Astral Perception, Astral Projection, Magic Sense, or similar. 

Summoning is really the big mechanical difference between Physical Adepts and Mages (Mystic Adepts).  There isn't a difference in Shadow Amp cost for Increased Reflexes power or sustaining foci or quicken spell.  Story wise and Narrative differences for sure, but identical mechanically. 

And Summoning has it's own separate cost (Needs a Skill). 

Thematically, there are huge differences.  But Mechanically, Increased Reflexes Amp is Increased Reflexes Amp. 

Mage>Mystic Adept (Mage without Astral Projection) > Adept (Mystic Adept without Summoning). 

Also keep in mind Deepweed is a thing, either as gear or an Amp.  I suspect GM Mileage may vary on that.

[Carmody]

Well, I still consider that a increase reflexes spell has to be cast, as opposed to an adept mystic adept power. Which means that there is a chance of failure and that if the character is caugth cold feet, he will loose a narration to cast it. As I do not want to increase to cost of being awakened, I will keep a cost of 2 for mages and mystics adepts (astral projection vs adept powers).
For adepts, they lack astral projection, astral perception (they can have it but it will be an amp, with a cost, or with deepweed but you cannot control when you exit astral perception, which can also be an issue), spells and summoning. I think I will reduce their cost to 1.