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Why does PnP Gaming get a bad wrap?

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The_Gun_Nut

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« Reply #90 on: <09-22-10/1453:24> »
Oddly enough, I think Dragonlance would probably be served by 4E very well.  I am not a fan of 4E (I think that Pathfinder is superior), but it does have its place.
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Dead Monky

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« Reply #91 on: <09-22-10/1456:50> »
I like how 4E got rid of a lot of the superfluous and annoying crap and made some of the classes useful and interesting to play.  (Rangers were useless, fighters boring.)  Plus, D&D had been basically the same game for 30 years, they had to do something to it.

Devil

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« Reply #92 on: <09-22-10/1503:44> »
I miss some things about previous editions too and didn't like 4th for a year after playing my first games of it. I got in a good group though and it really changed my opinion about it.

I'd rather see Dragonlance change a little than be left in the dust. I think it could be transfered to new editions and maintain it's spirit. It would just take alot of careful work and time.

inca1980

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« Reply #93 on: <10-04-10/0513:42> »
 
The hard, ugly, truth, though, is that Einstein, Gates, and Hawkings did stuff with their intellect.  Yeah, they're all badass renegade supergenius types who think outside the box or whatever, but...well...they're using it.  They're sharing their genius, making lots of money off of it, changing the world.

We're not.  

We're rolling dice, playing with toy soldiers, and telling stories with our friends in a basement somewhere.

Yes, what we do is awesome and fun.  Yes, what we do requires creative thinking, team-building abilities, communication skills, imagination, quick wits, and all that good stuff.  Yes, as a community we're terribly, monstrously, imaginative and bright.  But -- and this sucks to say, trust me, but it's true -- ultimately, we're squandering it.  What we do isn't terribly productive, when you get right down to it, any moreso than Lady Gaga's latest song, or Brad Pitt's six-pack abs.  

I totally agree, very well put.  We're just playing games and it should be seen as such.  It is funny though how video games are seen to be a perfectly acceptable way to spend your free-time, but RPG's are 'geeky'.  Watching sports or doing fantasy football is the same way.  I mean, I can see how playing sports might be seen as a better use of time because at least you're exercising your body....but a huge chunk of sports fans are pretty overweight and are exclusively spectators.  It makes no sense at all why these activities wouldn't also be seen as geeky.  They're just as much a waste of time.  

I feel though that a lot of the stigma is warranted because so many so called "geeks", maybe as a defense mechanism, form a "culture".  And it gets to the point that if I like Shadowrun, then somehow that's going to correllate to me liking Serenity or Firefly or that somehow I'm supposed to know more about anime than the next guy.  I'm really into shadowrun....like realy really into it....and I played WoW for like a whole year...and I played D&D as a kid....but i don't know jack about most of the stuff that the other "gamers" i play shadowrun with talk about.    But I notice that they have a whole series of games, shows, videosgames, and movies that they kind of all are into.  It's like a whole cannon that they all kind of gravitate towards....and i think that is the whole problem.  I think if each individual "nerd" activity kind of stood on its own by itself....then i think the general public would not really think much of it.....but because it's this monolithic culture which you can see on display in gaming stores and gaming conventions, then of course it's going to get targeted.  

If there were more people who were just into shadowrun for example, and aside from shadowrun they weren't really into other "geeky" activities, then there wouldn't be so much of stigma......but it seems that most people are either all in or all out.
« Last Edit: <10-04-10/0523:52> by inca1980 »

Frostriese

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« Reply #94 on: <10-07-10/1246:40> »
I really don't think the "gamer stigma" is as linked to the whole devil worship/Chick Tracts nonsense as we like to sometimes believe.  We latch onto that stereotype as a way of -- after a fashion -- stereotyping Christians, and by extension stereotyping everyone that doesn't like us.  It's flattering to us to imagine that everyone that doesn't like gaming, doesn't like it because of how small-minded and bigoted they are, or how they believed a speaker at a seminar, or whatever.  It's crappy anti-gamer rhetoric and propaganda that we've "owned" by claiming it's reversal for ourselves;  we comfort and flatter ourselves by throwing the "shrieking right-winger" label on folks who don't like our hobby.
Well, those who do shriek instead of simply shaking heads, so to say, usually are, uh, a bit unbalanced and ideologically biased, that cant be denied. Of course, the real problem for P&P isnt them, but instead indeed the quiet bad reputation. However, while there is less ideology involved in that, it still is mostly based on prejudices. The nornal social kind of prejudices: Its a minority activity, and hence most people are ignorant about it, and only pick up the negative memes that are already floating around about it. Kinda something self-inforcing, like most those reputation things.

Quote
Yes, what we do is awesome and fun.  Yes, what we do requires creative thinking, team-building abilities, communication skills, imagination, quick wits, and all that good stuff.  Yes, as a community we're terribly, monstrously, imaginative and bright.  But -- and this sucks to say, trust me, but it's true -- ultimately, we're squandering it.  What we do isn't terribly productive, when you get right down to it, any moreso than Lady Gaga's latest song, or Brad Pitt's six-pack abs.  
Yeah, but we dont need to! Its after all a free time activity. Amateur football, hunting, fishing, collecting stuff - that all inst productive, either, and it doesnt need to be, since it is free time stuff.

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To non-gamers, pen-and-paper RPG games just don't matter, and by extension neither do the people who play them.
If it were only that, it wouldnt be a problem. Benignly not caring is the base of every sort of tolerance, after all, and not the base of social stigma.

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People don't give gamers a bad rap.  Gamers give gamers a bad rap.
A bold claim, and somehow I dont see how it follows from your post.

Codac

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« Reply #95 on: <10-13-10/0941:18> »
While I wasn't a gamer or you know alive back when the anti-gaming thing was big i have heard many a stories and it seems to have been majorly improved. I mean now a days you can go to main stream book stores and they will have a role-playing section.
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Chaotic Insane

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« Reply #96 on: <10-13-10/1000:32> »
HA! I GOT IT OFF MY PHONE! Probably a page stretch, sorry I can't like... put this in a spoiler tag or anything.

This... THIS... is why we get a bad rap. Actual photo taken on the door to mine, Doom's, Codac's, and Usda's Friendly Local Gaming Store.

« Last Edit: <10-13-10/1035:07> by Chaotic Insane »
"People say I hate the living. It's not true. I just happen to see the potential inside all people; those great things anyone can do if they aren't trapped in their own consciousness and morals. And when I unlock that potential, death is the side-effect. I can't help that." - Dr. McMourning

FastJack

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Chaotic Insane

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« Reply #98 on: <10-13-10/1035:28> »
Switched the url to photobucket instead of my sprint email-y thingy. Should work now.
"People say I hate the living. It's not true. I just happen to see the potential inside all people; those great things anyone can do if they aren't trapped in their own consciousness and morals. And when I unlock that potential, death is the side-effect. I can't help that." - Dr. McMourning

FastJack

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« Reply #99 on: <10-13-10/1041:12> »
Much better.

The picture anyway. ;)

It's sad actually, after decades of gaming, the first thing my friends had to say about GenCon was that there was no stench. (Mostly due to a terrific HVAC system).

hazmat the monstar

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« Reply #100 on: <10-14-10/1530:24> »
My girlfreind is ultra hot, and she does not question my gaming. lol. I know your pain sir. We are an elite bunch. Go ask someone who sits in their house 20 hours a day playing video games what they think of RP gamers, and you may get a laugh. I laugh back. (no offense to anybody who plays video games 20 hours a day) I just can't get the same depth and detail of imagination from a video game. ( Although I love them ) I would much rather hear the stories of my players' characters than the limited storyline in a game. ( i do love strategy games though!)

Caine Hazen

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« Reply #101 on: <10-14-10/1927:54> »
My girlfreind is ultra hot, and she does not question my gaming. lol.

Pics or it didn't hapopen :D
j/k
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hazmat the monstar

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« Reply #102 on: <10-14-10/1959:55> »
Agreed. At least I think she is. Check it out...
http://www.myspace.com/hazmat08/photos/albums/my-photos/50221

hazmat the monstar

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« Reply #103 on: <10-15-10/1518:58> »
Did you know in correspondence college courses, you can get credits for having been a DM/GM?

Devil

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« Reply #104 on: <10-15-10/1530:03> »
Are you joking?