[AJCarrington]

You can also check out Gun Heaven, p.14-15...for those of us younger folks

[Sithlis]

Number 11 is the Predator.

' 12 too

but Pixel 01 is looking for the Ruger Thunderbolt

Not according the the books SR1, SR1-StSamGuide, & New Seattle.
Based on those three....
Predator = Not shown
#11 = Thunderbolt
#12 = Predator-II

What is your source?

Well page 24 of Arsenal has a pic of the Thunderbolt and Both Patrick and AJ have listed the page numbers that I would have used. Also Shadowrun Return show that the Predator is #1.  As a side note I belive the Predator-II is the only one to use the smooth rounded shape as I believe the III, IV, and V have returned to a design closer to the original

[Tarislar]

As an old-time grognard, let me assure you, #11 is the Ares Predator. It was deliberately designed to look like RoboCop's gun from the real RoboCop back in the day.

EDIT: Check out page 238 in the SR2 core rulebook.

Not that I doubt you Patrick, but I don't have that book available, as a fellow grognard, could you please see the following?

SR3 - New Seattle - Pg. 113  =  Thunderbolt =  Clearly #11 on that chart.
SR1 - St. Samurai Catalog - Pg. 18 = Predator-2 = Clearly #12 on that chart.
SR1 - CRB - Pg 35 & 41 = Predator-1 = Not on that chart.  (Admittedly these are stylized drawings but they match each other & the gear block, and I'd ignore it except for the fact that the Thunderbolt from New Seattle is clearly the same drawing on #11)

Not sure if this is an issue of reused art or what but those are the images I'm seeing from SR1, SSG, & New Seattle.

[AJCarrington]

A more recent image from Shadowrun Online:



A really good fan piece showing the different Predator versions:

[Sithlis]

I think I understand where your confusion is with New Seattle.  They give a picture of a LoneStar officer armed with a Predator but they give the stats with a specialty with Thunderbolts.  Note that they do not ever label the gun a Thunderbolt however as it is a Predator.  And yes 12 is a Predator-II.  11 is a Predator-I.

[Tarislar]

So the artwork, in the Lone Star section, talking about the Lone Star custom made Thunderbolt handgun...... shows an officer holding a Predator?

Oh joy, that makes SOOOO much sense.  /annoyed face.
/grrr  Stupid Stupid Stupid Stupid Stupid Stupid 

..................................... Okay, I'm all better now.

[Sithlis]

Yeah the old books art didn't always match up great

[Reaver]

And this is why pretty pictures are always used on crappy products.....

[Medicineman]

and what about the Fianchetti Military 100 (which should be a Fichetti Military 100 ! ) ?

HeyaHeyaHeyaJa
Medicineman

[PiXeL01]

Finally found a better picture than Lone Star SB. It is the same art actually but with a better background, making it easier to actually see the pistol.

Thanks AJ and others for trying to help out ^^

[AJCarrington]

Not a problem...glad you tracked something down. An aside, there might also be graphics in SRR...can't remember for if the Thunderbolt was an option though.

[PiXeL01]

There is, just not to track down online in a proper format

[Tarislar]

See, now this is just bad history here.

That TB pic looks a LOT like the Predator-II.  Which to me would make it a better look for the Predator-I

Meanwhile, Patrick said the Predator was "drawn to look like Robocops gun",  but when you think about Robocops gun, it was basically the Burst Firing Thunderbolt in mechanics.  And the longer front end of the Robo/Predator is a much better visual of the Thunderbolts build in Recoil Comp.

Finally the Predator-I had no special toys like Gas Vent or Laser or Smart Link etc etc etc to explain why its a freaking foot long.

Bah, just plain Bah.   /grumble

[PiXeL01]

I never liked the Predator II actually. Back in SR2 I would rather buy PredI or the Manhunter and then pay double to get it Smartlink'd then using a II.
Then Savalette Guardian came along with Fields of Fire ... Thunderbolt came with Lonestar Sourcebook after that, but was both rare and more illegal than an assault rifle at the time.

I don't remember actually seeing a III. Did that come with Cannon Companion?

[Patrick Goodman]

As I understand the story:

The Predator was drawn to look like RoboCop's gun...but it didn't act like it (the cool triple-shot thing). The Thunderbolt was explicitly written, mechanics-wise, to actually emulate RoboCop's gun, and was even made exclusive to a cop corp for a while (the high availability and legality codes), all because it was noticed by Tom and company that the look didn't match the performance, and they wanted a gun in-game that did what RoboCop's did.

Writers are fanboys, too. Please don't ever forget that. It helps us achieve some dizzying heights...and occasionally sends us crashing and burning with epic vigor, as well.

EDIT: Ah, AJ found one of the reference shots I was looking for that showed the history of the Predator as we were building up to SR5. Excellent. Means I don't have to look for it anymore.