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Overlooked "Must have" gear to survive in 2070

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Senko

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« Reply #75 on: <04-03-15/0622:10> »
@Tarislar
I'm trying to avoid "arguing" as its been pointed out I have a habit to do that on the forums and I honestly don't know where the limits lie on that. However in this case I will address why I disagree with your points and you can respond or not to that.

1.  Last I checked SIN readers are a type of sensor & are NOT loaded into every CCTV camera known to man.

I view this as a seperate thing. That is there are SIN readers and SIN scanners. A sin reader to me is something that reads your SIN and checks against a database for information on you while a SIN scanner actively looks for discrepancies. To illustrate the point Toy's R US has a SIN reader and Joe Jumbo Tusk (7 foot, troll, tattoos, cyberware etc etc the crowd parts around him) walks past and it reads his SIN (Tina Simulation 7 year old, human, female etc etc). It then does what its programmed too and sends a message from the corporation "Miss Simulation we have a new Lisa Lionheart dolly in tell your parents you want blah blah blah and here new blah blah blah". It couldn't care less about the discrepancies and unless there's a police alert out wont draw anyones attention to it. Its just there to read for SINS, check them against its databases (SIN details vs store products) and generate a bit of spam to attract a customer. A SIN scanner on the other hand is as you said not loaded into every CCTV because its actively checking a SIN for problems. This is when the table on 324 comes in and does various levels of checks on the SIN depending on its rating, the security of the zone and so on.

2.  If every CCTV camera had the ability to run a SIN check on you then you would literally NEVER get away.  And yet... they do.

As indicated in point 1 my understanding is that the ability to run a SIN check on you is something that requires specific programming but to read a SIN is ubiquioutous and everywhere. Every store is always looking out for potential customers its not looking out for potential fake SINS.

3.  Having enough people to monitor every person that walks down the street would require a MASSIVE sized police force.  I live in a city of millions with a ratio of over 500 people to every police officer.  How much larger a police force do you think is required to be able to actively monitor Citizen Joe every minute of his day to be able to track him down at a moments notice.  At what point does the economy collapse from maintaining the kind of force needed to actively devote that many people.

Never said they can track him down at a moments notice but the SIN is your ID, credit card, car keys etc etc. Remember in this world the SINLESS are barely a step above criminal in most peoples minds so a store security system would be monitoring all the people moving in and out today. In the sixth world the only difference is in C+ areas its also looking for SINS. As long as it finds them the checking is unlikely to go any deeper unless someone has a reason to do so. However we're not talking about determining your SIN is fake, we're determining your not broadcasting one. Think assasins creed and his eagle vision all those crowds just blend into one seemeless mass of white until you see the red enemy. Thats how I picture it all the crowds moving along the streets broadcasting SINS and no one's likely to notice your says your a 7 year old human girl when your really a 7 foot tall troll what they will notice is if your the only individual not broadcasting one at all and then they start looking into you.

4.  I'm not really up on all the Decking stuff, but, what happens if a person leaves home w/o their commlink?  Does that mean they are harassed all day by this massive police force just getting to & from work?  When they shut off their phone to go into a movie theater & their PAN goes down are they suddenly stopped when they walk out of the theater?

Depending on the area yes. From page 363 "Those who don’t have one can’t get a job, can’t buy food, can’t even walk down the street. To the system, these people don’t exist.". You walk out the door without broadcasting a SIN and its unlikely police will promptly jump on you but your not going to be able to catch the train, ride a cab, buy lunch, enter any secure area (train stations, office buildings etc), stores will politely ask you to leave since you can't buy their products anyway from the SINNER negative quality on page 84 "A legal SIN is required for all legal
purchases". In other words every store has a way to read your SIN even if they can't check it for errors. If your in a AA or AAA area you could well be arrested since you can't prove who you are or that you have any right to be there. If you just forgot to turn it back on after being in a hospital/cinema or other location where you can't have it running you could apologize and do so but there'd be a decent chance in my opinion that then the police would scan it for discrepancies.

5.  There is even a published SR adventure called Rally Cry that I played in last year.  One of the key things I remember about it is that KE when deployed to cover a pair of public rallies that could turn into a riot was broadcasting to all citizens to please actively display their SIN & any gun license.  This would seem to imply that they are NOT actively broadcasting that message every other time & that deploying to cover a big public rally was an exception to the rule.

Haven't played that so I can't really comment although I'd imagine that's just a precaution to ensure someone who had turned theirs off to watch a movie switch's it back on but like I said not played it.

6.  I'm not convinced that not walking around w/o a PAN turned on & broadcasting a SIN means you can't go 100 ft w/o being stopped by the police.

Not saying you can't go anywhere without being immediately stopped (although again in a AAA area where security response occurs in minutes that could be the case) but you do need it to function in most civilized/built up areas. As quoted above a SIN is required for all legal purchases meals, bus fare, a new phone, grid subscription, video rental, clothing and all the other parts of day to day life. My average work day is get up, catch train to work, work, catch train home, eat dinner, bed (long travel times. In that day I'd need my SIN for the train trip back and forth as well as swiping into the offices. Walking around the city I pass numerous security cameras of various sorts all of which would probably note and flag a SINless person. Now the reaction to that would vary. Near where I live probably no response no crime, not worth bothering them. Near where I work (major city area) police would probably check it out if they were there but not bother travelling if they weren't on the other hand a SINLESS actually at where I work would bring the police down on them (governement office currently on high alert due to the threat of terrorism we've even gone from leaving the main doors unlocked during business hours to requiring you swipe in each time). Again it depends on the place as much as anything else but you are going to be checked on a pretty regular basis as per the books.

PS.  There is still Cash in 2070, its just less common.  I'd say Certified Credsticks are more like a Pre-Paid Visa Gift Card actually.

Maybe I only operate on credit cards or cash nothing in between but that's a person/place issue.

@psycho835
I recall what The Wyrm Orouboros is referring to as well its a mention of police shooting SINless if it'd be easier for them, I don't think they were shot for being SINless so much as shot because being SINless no one would care and it makes the officers job easier. Admitedly the difference it largely acccademic to the person shot but its the difference between being killed because your SINless and being killed because the officer doesn't want to deal with you.

The Wyrm Ouroboros

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« Reply #76 on: <04-03-15/1248:12> »
Look at it from the corporation/security service's position.  If you're a good citizen, why shouldn't you be broadcasting your SIN?  If you aren't broadcasting a SIN, you must be trying to hide something - or else you must not have one at all.  Not broadcasting a SIN is, therefore, by its very nature a suspicious activity.  "Show me your SIN, or receive hot lead" becomes a viable security statement.
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Tarislar

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« Reply #77 on: <04-03-15/1442:44> »
Every store would likely have a SIN reader up at the Register, where you have to pay for goods.
And what happens when its a 12 yo kid that doesn't own a Commlink yet & tries to buy a candy bar at Circle-K w/ Cash or CertCredstick
We are not talking about "Good Corp-SIN Drone" living at an Archology and never seeing the streets.
I'm talking about driving down a middle/low class suburban/urban street in the good ole USofA & walking into generic store.
I'm just not seeing how not actively having you Commlink or not broadcasting on the wireless that your there is a crime worthy of getting shot.

Not everyone is an office drone at Corp HQ.
People are still cashiers at Sears, McDonalds, Circle-K etc etc.

I've never heard of a SIN scanner v/s reader.  There is nothing to support that in the rules that I've seen.  There are levels of scanners that are easier to beat but even a Fake SIN-6 is going to fail to L1 scanners if its read every 100 feet all day long.  And fail fast actually.

Having a SIN & not displaying it 24/7 is not the same thing as NOT having a SIN.
Otherwise there would never be the line in example in several SR books about a cop saying "What is your SIN citizen?" when they are questioning you.

But honestly this has gotten completely off topic and is going in circles.  So I think this thread is done.