[prismite]

These are all really good (and mostly common sense) responses here and I thank everyone for their participation.

It still feels wrong, however, that somebody is allowed to buy something that REQUIRES another piece to function, but one piece is illegal. I dunno, to me its like buying a car is legal ... but the tires are illegal.

Yes, its an extreme example, but still smacks of foul play.

In a real-world scenario I could understand this rule, as there are bound to be collectors and hobbiest that want to have one of these units in their collection, fully understanding that it will never be fired/used. In game terms, however, it just feels wrong. I think I would feel better if the rifle was illegal too.

However, I could see ZeConster's side of things too. A corp is likely to extend thier blanket of protection in certain regards. If you are hunting an ugly armored critter on their behalf, I could see them sponsoring the use of some less-than-average gear, provided it was YOUR gear.

Of course, the sensible thing to do would be to just select a different rifle.

[martinchaen]

I agree that High-Power Chambering should be an F rated modification.

[emsquared]

Even if you go through the hoops and paid the fees to be legit, you'd have to have a SIN, they'd have your firearm's rifling print on file, you'd be on lots of lists...

[LionofPerth]

Even if you go through the hoops and paid the fees to be legit, you'd have to have a SIN, they'd have your firearm's rifling print on file, you'd be on lots of lists...

I think in this case rule the ammunition as 20R rather than 20F.

There's something to be said for having all of the permits, only to be screwed over on the ammunition, making it a wall hanger. I have to agree that if there's a legal reason for the purchaser to have it and use, they should be able to thoroughly enjoy using it. They shouldn't be screwed over for item required to use it.

[martinchaen]

To be fair, high-power chambering is an item from WAR!. It's designed for campaigns centered on military (private, corporate, or government) campaigns, and military gear is usually forbidden from use by civilians.

[KarmaInferno]

I agree that High-Power Chambering should be an F rated modification.

Eh. From a simulationist point of view, I don't see why. All you're doing is running 'hot' loads in a firearm reinforced to handle the extra pressure. You can do that TODAY in most places without extra licencing beyond what was required for the base weapon.

I'd rather just drop the F from the ammo, keeping or even raising the Availability. That and allow ammo variants like High Power/APDS.


-k

[martinchaen]

Eh. You can do whatever you want.

[Michael Chandra]

That and allow ammo variants like High Power/APDS.


-k

I had them for some NPCs in my game, High-Power Anti-Tank rounds. With the x4 markup (I'd probably do more if I ever convert HP to SR5) they were firing sniper shots at 100 nuyen per bullet. + Market Dry and another modifier, making it 140.

[The Wyrm Ouroboros]

What, that's it???  I fire rounds that valuable out of my light pistol.

[Sendaz]

Forget availability or restrictions, just make bullets cost 5k each. :p

[Prodigy]

By the way, to respond to something earlier in the thread, my friends and I formed a gun trust here in Texas and "our trust" owns multiple suppressors and such. It is actually quite easy.

Also, companies IRL such as MPRI and other PMCs buy HELICOPTERS AND ROCKETS using VEUCs, so yes it can be done. My players in 4ED love the WAR! book because they formed their own PMC and do buy that stuff. There is no system. Just wing it.

[LionofPerth]

Thinking about this some more, what about the large bore hunting revolvers out there? That to me strikes as a perfect example of a High Powered load. Especially considering some the stories I've heard about people only firing them twice before selling them.

I'll be another vote behind extremely expensive ammo, or having the player make hand loads.

Another thing I might have to borrow for my own character, that suits her general objective quite nicely.

[WellsIDidIt]

A High Power round usually describes ammo that is the same caliber with a more or different powder that creates more pressure. The chambering has to be reinforced for the extra pressure.

A real life example would be the .357 magnum round. It is the same caliber as a .38 special, but uses a slower burning powder to create more pressure.

Usually, the higher power ammunition will have different length casing to differentiate between it and a standard round of that caliber (again look at the .38 special and .357 magnum). A lot of the times this is just for safety though, so the two types don't get mixed up.

That different case length is what makes automatic weapons unable to use both rounds interchangeably. One of my house rules is that HPC revolvers and break action weapons can use normal and HPC rounds.

Then again, I also think that High Power ammo should just modify standard ammo types instead of being a unique type. After all, if you look at high power rounds in real life, they come in just as many varieties as standard rounds.

[KarmaInferno]

Really should have just called them magnum loads to begin with.



-k

[prismite]

Some good ideas here.

Lets take the Onotari Rhino Hunter (the rifle in question originally) and apply some of these suggestions to it. I assume that the high damage of the weapon is set to reflect the HPC in the description. Do you think, then, that the weapon could potentially fire normal rounds, but -2 damage?

Or would you take a simpler route and just say that if I own the license(s) to make it legal for me to carry this weapon I could potentially obtain a license to carry the ammunition for it?

Seems like 2 viable options, and we have enough heads here to posit a reasonable decision ... so whatever the community decides will become a house-rule at our table.