[Michael Chandra]

HotPatch states they can only buy for karma at chargen (not properly rule-lawyery, mind you, Bull's not good at rule-lawyering, but the book already states it and it's not replaced here) and afterwards solely through taking them as Metamagic when Initiating.

[Zar]

I always got the impression that the Karma cost per Power Point was a CharGen Tax and that if a Mystic Adept gained Magic in any way that they got the power point for free.  If anything I would think that they could purchase the Power point for 5 points up the their Maximum Magic score anytime.  If that is the case, then  they wouldn't lose any Power Points until their Essence bit into the level of Magic they have the power points for because the Magic score would determine their maximum.

Thought so too, but rulewise, its not as clear. Magic section says magic adepts can get PPs in only two ways, Raising their Magic Score, or Initiation.

The 2 karma thing is ONLY in the character creation process, and everywhere mentionned, it says something akin to ''During character creation, the MA can spend 2 karmas...'' etc, etc.

Of course, the 2 karma thing was hotfixed to 5, and the ''get PPs through raising magic'' for MA was temporary errata'ed to ''Through Initiation only'', so make of that what you will.

Yeah I don't know if I agree to the temporary errata.  While I agree that 5 karma per is justifiable.  The fact that Prime Runner Mystic Adepts get more points to spend on their Power Points implies to me that Mystic Adepts aren't just born with their Power Points and can't raise them without going through a Frat House.

[Michael Chandra]

It's not as if a Prime Runner Mystic Adept, or normal Adept for that manner, gets (to buy) more PP, so I'm confused on what this is about.

[ZeConster]

Yeah I don't know if I agree to the temporary errata.  While I agree that 5 karma per is justifiable.  The fact that Prime Runner Mystic Adepts get more points to spend on their Power Points implies to me that Mystic Adepts aren't just born with their Power Points and can't raise them without going through a Frat House.

They may get more Karma to customize themselves, but they're still restricted to 6 Magic (7 if they get Exceptional Attribute), and therefore 6 (or 7) PP max at chargen. Prime Runners can get 2 of Aptitude, Exceptional Attribute and Lucky instead of 1, but they can't start with more Magic.

[Beaumis]

I think he means that under the normal rules, a mystic adept can buy a max of 5 power points (25 karma). He has to take negative qualities to get the necessary karma for the 6th point. A prime runner build on the other hand, can buy all six points (30 karma) and has 5 karma leftover.

It does seem a little weird that its impossible to reach the char gen max magic power points (6) unless you take negative qualities. But then, such things happen when you errata stuff.

[Xenon]

HotPatch states they can only buy for karma at chargen (not properly rule-lawyery, mind you, Bull's not good at rule-lawyering, but the book already states it and it's not replaced here) and afterwards solely through taking them as Metamagic when Initiating.

Hotpatch state they can spend 5 karma per PP up to their starting magic rating.
It does not state that the 5 karma per PP up to their starting magic rating have to be payed for during chargen...

...but yes, once you have starting magic rating PPs (which in normal case you reach during chargen) then you can only raise it with metamagic during initiating (as long as you never get more PP than your current magic rating).

[Michael Chandra]

If anything I would think that they could purchase the Power point for 5 points up the their Maximum Magic score anytime.

The book says there are only 2 ways to gain Power Points post-chargen: 1 is by raising Magic (which the hot patch errata removes for Mystic Adepts), the other is as a metamagic when Initiating. Spending Karma isn't named, and the list is exhaustive.

HotPatch states they can only buy for karma at chargen (not properly rule-lawyery, mind you, Bull's not good at rule-lawyering, but the book already states it and it's not replaced here) and afterwards solely through taking them as Metamagic when Initiating.

[ZeConster]

I think he means that under the normal rules, a mystic adept can buy a max of 5 power points (25 karma). He has to take negative qualities to get the necessary karma for the 6th point. A prime runner build on the other hand, can buy all six points (30 karma) and has 5 karma leftover.

It does seem a little weird that its impossible to reach the char gen max magic power points (6) unless you take negative qualities. But then, such things happen when you errata stuff.

If that's his argument, then frankly, who cares? That's what Negative Qualities are for: to allow you to start with stuff you otherwise wouldn't be able to afford.

[Dracain]

I think he means that under the normal rules, a mystic adept can buy a max of 5 power points (25 karma). He has to take negative qualities to get the necessary karma for the 6th point. A prime runner build on the other hand, can buy all six points (30 karma) and has 5 karma leftover.

It does seem a little weird that its impossible to reach the char gen max magic power points (6) unless you take negative qualities. But then, such things happen when you errata stuff.

If that's his argument, then frankly, who cares? That's what Negative Qualities are for: to allow you to start with stuff you otherwise wouldn't be able to afford.

I agree with this, for what it's worth.  It makes little sense that MAs can start out as good as a Mage in magic, and a Physical Adept in...Adept stuff.  They are the jack of all trades, master of none, and if they can just start out like the others with no issue, then that is a bit much.  To be honest, in my upcoming campaign, I think I'll have an MA.  If that is the case, I am thinking about making them start with 1 less point of magic then the mage of the equal level of priority (and maybe a few less spells).  I am not 100% sure about this, but it does seem like a good way to give a little balance to keep the character from doing EVERYTHING good. 

[Zar]

You guys aren't getting my argument.  A prime runner is supposed to be a more veteran runner.  That means he's gone out into the world and earned XP.  There is no distinguishing that extra XP with the regular runner's XP so in essence, the prime runner could use that extra XP to gain a PP that they wouldn't have had if they were a normal runner.  Thus I argue that Power Points for Mystic Adepts aren't Character Creation only things.

[Michael Chandra]

That is a plain silly interpretation, really. If we're going to argue that, then Prime Runners should pay double for the extra +10 Positive Qualities since they would pay twice the cost after chargen and shouldn't be able to get 10 more karma from taking Negative Qualities.

[ZeConster]

You guys aren't getting my argument.  A prime runner is supposed to be a more veteran runner.  That means he's gone out into the world and earned XP.  There is no distinguishing that extra XP with the regular runner's XP so in essence, the prime runner could use that extra XP to gain a PP that they wouldn't have had if they were a normal runner.  Thus I argue that Power Points for Mystic Adepts aren't Character Creation only things.

I don't get it. Non-Prime Runners can start with the same amount of PP that a Prime Runner can, can't they?

[RHat]

You guys aren't getting my argument.  A prime runner is supposed to be a more veteran runner.  That means he's gone out into the world and earned XP.  There is no distinguishing that extra XP with the regular runner's XP so in essence, the prime runner could use that extra XP to gain a PP that they wouldn't have had if they were a normal runner.  Thus I argue that Power Points for Mystic Adepts aren't Character Creation only things.

Given the existence of the hotfix, this argument becomes truly untenable.

[Xenon]

You can get PP post chargen for 5 karma per point, but still only up to your starting magic rating. Beyond that you need to initiate, raise your magic rating and pick a point of PP instead of another metamagic.

In most cases you would get all your PP at chargen,  but sometimes you have more important things to buy so you get the last points post chargen. Like Kyra, the text book Mystic Adept example.

If you buy PP during chargen you would do it at step seven of the chargen process.

You might or might not also be allowed to spend karma to initiate during chargen. Not sure if we ever got clarification on that.

[RHat]

You can get PP post chargen for 5 karma per point, but still only up to your starting magic rating.

No, in point of fact, you can't.  Part of the hotfix is that the only way to get power points as a Mystech Adept after chargen is on initiation, in place of a metamagic.