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Are skillwires/skilljacks ever worth it?

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Dr. Meatgrinder

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« Reply #15 on: <04-20-15/1524:13> »
It's fairly obvious that the initial investment cost is skewed way out of proportion for skillwires. That being said, depending on your reading of the Skilljack rules and whether or not one can make do with a rating 2 skilljack (which, if wirelessly enabled, arguably allows up to 4 skillsofts of rating 6 to run simultaneously), one can cut the initial investment by anywhere from 20,000¥ to 80,000¥.

That's not how I read it at all.  The Wireless bonus for the Skilljack only boosts the total Rating limit, not the maximum Rating per skill, so a Rating 2 Skilljack with Wireless allows you to run a total Rating limit of 6, but each skill has a maximum Rating of 2 (so you could run 3 Rating-2 skills or 6 Rating-1 skills).  And the Wireless bonus for Skillwires only improves the Limit for each skillsoft you're running.
Hehe. Hence my caveat of "depending on your reading".

Fair enough.  I'd forgotten for a moment that I was on an Internet forum.
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Glyph

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« Reply #16 on: <04-20-15/2134:41> »
I prefer cheap and ubiquitous skillwires, myself.  Less for PC's, and more for verisimilitude - to keep them in line with the fluff about all of these low-paid, unskilled workers who have their skills chipped by the corporation.  The whole setup doesn't make sense, even with economies of scale and "free" software, when the augmentations involved are costlier than low-end wired reflexes and similar 'ware.

Novocrane

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« Reply #17 on: <04-20-15/2245:06> »
Quote
The whole setup doesn't make sense
I'd ask a few questions, before jumping to that conclusion.

How much are corporations spending to build skilljack / skillwire cyberware, relative to the sale price? (how does that price change on the black market?)

What ratings are being used in which industries?

Are skilljacks and knowledge skills enough for any given job?

Is there any reason to be firmly disbelieving the idea of skilljacks / skillwires being slaved to some kind of Rigger Control Console Host? (single instances of skillsofts and knowsofts being run on multiple wageslaves)

halflingmage

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« Reply #18 on: <04-20-15/2323:27> »
In terms of corps using skillwire workers, I think the big thing they gain in flexibility.  Fred is a skill wire worker.  This week he is a welder, next week he is doing electronic assembly, the week after that he is doing routine maintenance on the HVAC system.   And push come to shove if Phil in accounting is out with the flu Fred can dust off his tie, chip in an accounting program, and probably handle at least the scut work in the accounting department.  He is not going to be able to do any of those tasks better than a true expert, and they would probably want to have the supervisor spot check him, but he can handle basic tasks in just about any job in the building.   Its not saving the training expense on one skill, its the ability to have Fred do darned near any job they need, at least at a basic level.

The problem from the Shadowrunner point of view is that basic level often doesn't cut it.  You don't want a guy to chip in demolitions and be "fair" at taking care of the bomb.  If its an opposed skill of any type you don't want to be going with a skill of 3.  After all the mantra here on the character boards is always "shadowrun is a game of specialists".  Skillwires don't let you be a specialist.  Its a very expensive way to be a generalist.

Marcus

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« Reply #19 on: <04-21-15/0930:04> »
When they added them to the move by wire system in 4th, I had couple character who used them.
The 5k price point per skill rating really is the problem. The base units have never been cheap but that's not really a big deal.
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Top Dog

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« Reply #20 on: <04-21-15/1016:20> »
I wonder if skillsofts shouldn't be adjusted to be non-linear.

Compared to natural skills, Rating 6 skillsofts are fine. They're a big investment all at once, but they're worth it. But the lower you get, the less they're worth.

If the cost was, say, Rating*Rating*1000, lower-rating skillsofts would be worth the money as well, so you can mix and match skill ratings as needed and not waste money (although that would make R6's more expensive, so maybe not exactly that).

The Wyrm Ouroboros

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« Reply #21 on: <04-24-15/0551:25> »
Skillwires are a thematic choice, not really a practical one.  IMO, however, a skilljack is highly useful for a runner; they're relatively Essence-friendly, and they are So Goddamn Useful it makes a runner cry - from linguasofts to area-based knowsofts*, that is the Way To Go.

* - IMO, a datasoft such as a mapsoft takes time to access - it's like pausing to access the map on your iPhone.  It may be faster than an iPhone, but you have to look through it.  (I also use 'rating' Datasofts/Mapsofts, just like a hermetic mage's e-library, or the difference between a Rand-McNally map and a USGC Survey map of the same area.)  Convert that information from something you have to take a few seconds to access into something you straight out KNOW, and you really have reason to cook. 

"We're trapped!!  How the hell are we going to get out?!?"
"We're not trapped.  Go into this room.  Okay, now punch through the bottom panel there.  Main wet wall."
"How the hell did you know that?!?"
"Knowsoft of the building architecture.  Started getting them after that clusterfuck in Caracas."
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Top Dog

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« Reply #22 on: <04-24-15/0640:40> »
Skillwires are a thematic choice, not really a practical one.  IMO, however, a skilljack is highly useful for a runner; they're relatively Essence-friendly, and they are So Goddamn Useful it makes a runner cry - from linguasofts to area-based knowsofts*, that is the Way To Go.

* - IMO, a datasoft such as a mapsoft takes time to access - it's like pausing to access the map on your iPhone.  It may be faster than an iPhone, but you have to look through it.  (I also use 'rating' Datasofts/Mapsofts, just like a hermetic mage's e-library, or the difference between a Rand-McNally map and a USGC Survey map of the same area.)  Convert that information from something you have to take a few seconds to access into something you straight out KNOW, and you really have reason to cook. 

"We're trapped!!  How the hell are we going to get out?!?"
"We're not trapped.  Go into this room.  Okay, now punch through the bottom panel there.  Main wet wall."
"How the hell did you know that?!?"
"Knowsoft of the building architecture.  Started getting them after that clusterfuck in Caracas."

That's a nice comparison. Goes, partially, for linguasofts too. You can easily translate things via commlink (you can do that now) - but it's going to take time and you're going to lose nuance. Except Knowsofts - like linguasofts - do a lot more then mere datasofts and simple translations do, since they also give you the learned skills to interpret the data and such.

The Wyrm Ouroboros

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« Reply #23 on: <04-24-15/0707:19> »
And always remember, kiddies, check with your GM as to whether or not you can get mapsofts (or architectural/area knowsofts!) of the complexes you're infiltrating.  Knowing what goes where - or what SHOULD go where - is the first step to getting the hell out of Dodge City!!
Pananagutan & End/Line

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"Oh, gee - it's Go-Frag-Yourself-O'Clock."
New Wyrm!! Now with Twice the Bastard!!

Laés is ... I forget. -PiXeL01
Play the game. Don't try to win it.