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[4e] Weapons and Safehouses

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AwesomenessDog

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« on: <01-27-16/1947:25> »
So i got two questions, one simple in face but weird in concept and the other a monster in the face and complex in structure:

1) What is there to stop me from creating an impossi-gun that is made up of under-barreleds on under-barreleds? I am talking to the gm about creating a Rocket launcher, Gatling gun, sniper-rifle, assault riffle, grenade launcher, match key (shotgun), pistol, bayonet. He said rule of cool (after tons of upcharges to account for the wackiness of making and using such a thing) but we are looking for rules for this or even against it to better figure out how to run this. Just so the question of carrying it doesn't come up, it is intended to be wielded in a Iron Will exosuit.


2) Help me plug as many of the holes in this Alamo safehouse (warning, its a libertarian's wet dream): The house is on its own isolated, hard-wired matrix away from normal civilization but nearby a water tower and cliff. The building is a 2 story 7 room (per floor) building with outer walls reinforced with 5in of metal, inner walls have a layering of (space - thin drywall - jigsaw metal pieces -  <breaching charge - monowire suspension and wiring - breaching charge> - Jigsaw metal pieces - thin drywall - space) with the metal to act as shrapnel as well tear down the opposite side of the wall that didnt explode once the monowire breaks. The whole building is monitored by a RFiD scanner that monitors and informs other systems where friendlies and not friendlies are. There are several hallways and murderholes with mounted MGs autonomously piloted to attack anything dwarf sized or larger that doesnt read as within a meter of a friendly RFiD as well as one aimed to the front door and a 360 view rocket launcher. Some of the doors open to false rooms that are just filled with monowire intended to resident evil anyone who runs into it. The floor  boards as well as a few walls have plates hidden underneath/on them that will rise and provide cover to anyone with a friendly RFiD. There are several ammo caches hidden in case someone needs a reload. As well the driveway, front door, nearby outside, and some decoy cars on the road leading up to driveway are all rigged with remote detonation explosives and hidden cameras that monitor the area (and some decoy camera boxes with nothing actually inside them) and the side areas of the yard around the safehouse are filled with S-mines (bouncing betties) all set to go off 1 turn after triggering activating all the other mines in a 5m area within the source. The water tower has an autonomous sniper riffle, overlooking the front and left side of the house, with facial scanner (cued to party members faces) as well as the works for not alerting noncombatants to its presence (because its 1000m away and close enough to alert those near the tower) and see through the tree line moderately well, and a safety only deactivatable by pointing a laser at a sensor in the tower (the laser is activated from the house); the cliff has a secret escape to it, as well as its own remote controlled (via a wire through the escape tunnel) sniper-rifle, overlooking the rear right of the house from 700m, with a quick release and explosive rounds (specialized minigrenades integrated into a .50cal round). The internal systems are all hard wired, have receiver only wireless AR interfaces (to detonate or to read the location of an RFiD) to prevent hacking, everything tied to the central house (everything but the carbombs and water tower rifle) can be activated using switches or by anyone with the right encryption keys (different one for every device, again to prevent hacking and to make sure the wrong things dont go off) in their AR; a hacker can pick up these signals but since everything is only a receiver or 1 time device like an explosive, they cant hack wireless, although they can clone the RFiD to register themselves as friendlies for the cover panels; the only issue as far as hackers go is a technomancer that can get into even hard wired systems (any counter for this besides your own technomancer?). The goal of this safehouse is to brunt any assault on the safehouse not involving an orbital bombardment and get the jump on any assault team (dont ask why i need this). Are there any holes in the defense that are glaringly obvious or that could be better covered besides slapping sensors everywhere? As well, can someone give me a general guesstimate of the Nuyen cost to build this from scratch?

Mirikon

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« Reply #1 on: <01-29-16/2006:26> »
1) I'm pretty sure it says somewhere that you can't put an underbarrel weapon on an underbarrel weapon, but I'm too lazy to look it up, so I'm just going to take this Metro Atlanta phonebook and beat you about the head and shoulders until you stop being stupid.

2) A few problems. First, any hardwired connections can be broken into with a cable tap, which combined with a transmitter makes your entire grid connected to the Matrix at large. Second, spirits will just walk right through all that and gank you, or serve as spotters for ritual magic. You've got absolutely no magic defenses there. Third, and most importantly, you've gone and isolated yourself in an obvious bunker without any pesky SINners to call the Knights or locals who might get pissed at having explosions go off. No collateral damage means that the kid gloves can come off, especially if they don't care about you living or dying. Instead of a black van type team, expect Special Forces. Rocket launcher taking out the tower, white phosphorous, napalm, lasers, and more working the building itself, with kill teams on the exits. Drones going in first to clear those mines, and so on. Much better to get rid of most that crap, get yourself a nice place in a middle-class neighborhood, be friendly with the neighbors, be on good terms with whoever runs protection for that area, and have multiple escape routes. Much easier to disappear into the middle of a sprawl than it is to disappear into wilderness where there are no other metahumans around. And being in good neighborhoods limits what kind of weapons and tactics your pursuit is going to use. Things that are acceptable in a Z zone or wilderness aren't going to fly in the middle of Downtown Seattle.
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AwesomenessDog

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« Reply #2 on: <01-29-16/2217:55> »
The place itself looks like your ole wood cabin in the mountains, so the bunker doesn't look like a bunker to anyone who walks in, unless they blow a hole in the wall themselves, the wires that went through the wall are no longer there and they cant reach the wires until a hole is made. The tower is still at the edge of a neighborhood so blowing it up would alert the authorities much more so than the bouncing betties an extra half mile away which by my calculations would not be that outlandish of a sound even most low lifestyle areas to hear. As far as I know, there isn't anyway to "throw money" at something and magic proof it short of paying for the armor mod enough times to put a piece of armor all over your walls or how to stop spirits, but I am very ignorant as to the magic workings as had never played one. (I was relying on our mage to give me a price on that.) While I definitely agree that 99.999999% of the time a quieter place would be nice, there are many story specific reasons as to why someone might be able to see past your hideout's cover. Also, where else are you going to hide that rocket-powered-gattling-marksman-assault-scatter-grenade-pistol-sword rig?

Mirikon

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« Reply #3 on: <01-29-16/2233:15> »
First, you wouldn't be getting the rig of craziness, because of phonebooking you until you started making sense. Second, unless you're taking over someone else's paranoid survival bunker, you're talking about a ground up construction job. The level of work you're talking about is not possible with a simple refit. That, added to the fact that you're buying crap tons of explosives and military grade ware, means you're going to have people asking lots of questions. Even if you kill everyone involved in the actual work, there's going to be questions about your little compound. And when automated defenses start blowing up wild animals or kids trespassing, then you might as well put up a neon sign telling people where you are, and that you're ready for trouble. Which gives anyone who wants your head an easy excuse to get official sanction to clear out the 'terrorist base'. Third, magic defenses can be handled with biofiber walls or plants like magnus kudzu, which will provide a dual-natured barrier around your home, without a mage needing to ward it every so often.

Really, though, what you're talking about is the kind of thing that will get military units sent out to your place, if only to neutralize a possible threat. Not corpsec, full military, in milspec gear, with official sanction to do what they do best.
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AwesomenessDog

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« Reply #4 on: <01-30-16/0005:15> »
If it was animals, no big deal, no one can distinguish a .0046 Over-pressure (proably much lower as the trees should be dampening the sound more than pure airspace does) from a quick cough, children you have me at with the mines but a simple solution is to have the mines also set up to have safeties keyed to a switch in the central hub so that when the system is down (because shit hasn't hit the fan yet) all the automated defenses are down as well. The hidability lies not in the building itself but in building it, but this is also intended to be as a side thing my character was doing over a campaign arc so the purchases and build times are handled in a super extended way anyway. The character is a guy who is ex-special forces from way before most AAA corps existed (he is 63 in 2072) who is considered crazy for his incapability to fit in well with modern society and many more flags of raised *before* he asks for milspec gear for your average run. In case you can't tell, this is more purple hair.

By the way the impossi-gun is not for me but for another party member who uses Mind over Matter for her shooting skills and has an agility of 2 and is tired of never being able to switch weapons quickly.

farothel

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« Reply #5 on: <01-30-16/0509:38> »
The impossi-gun is what you said, impossible.  Even if RAW it's possible (I'm not sure, I don't think so, but away from books at the moment), RAI it's clearly not.  And logically it's impossible.  If you hang four-five guns under each other, how are you going to put in the clip for the top one (most have clips underneath the gun, where the next one is).  And if you hang the next gun a bit further forward to avoid that, you wouldn't be able to reach the trigger of the last one simply because of the bulk of all the rest.  As GM I would allow one underbarrel gun mod only.  Choose, but choose wisely.

For your bunker idea, I agree with Mirikon on his assessment.  And it might even be worse.  Instead of sending a milspec team, they might just send two fighter-bombers with deep penetrator bombs and solve the issue that way.  Much easier for them and less casualties (on their side that is).  I would even go with an appartment building in a nice middle class neighbourhood, because that way they can't even demolish the building while you are not there.
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Mirikon

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« Reply #6 on: <01-30-16/1207:34> »
Yeah, buying explosives over time is great, but unless you're buying them from multiple sources, then your arms dealer contact is going to get a little concerned with your stockpile, especially if word comes down about you being in deep drek. No one wants an Alamo being traced back to them. And if you don't think an arms dealer keeps track of who he sells what to, and how much, you're crazy. So getting the explosives from multiple sources. Except if they're all from sources in the same sprawl, you've got that many more points of failure in your security. If they're from 'out of town' they might not care about what you buy, so long as it isn't used in their sprawl, but you still have to get it back home.

And that still doesn't cover the security leaks in building the thing. The builders ARE going to notice if they're putting explosives between drywall pieces in your walls. And unless you're taking several months off running, you're not going to have the time to build it yourself, even if you had the skills. That's before you get into the wiring and plumbing people, and so on. Every single person who is involved in building this place is a point of failure for your security. Assume that SOMEONE is going to talk, if only to give themselves legal cover. Even if you kill all the contractors, that kind of thing will get you and your building noticed, in a bad way. Especially if the construction company had any 'Family' ties.

What you have is an impressive kill house that someone will take a look at, and then hit with drone-launched missiles before sending in a kill team to clean up.

And for the impossi-gun, I will expand the phonebooking to include your party member as well. Her for thinking it, you for bringing it up.
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