[Shadowjack]

I missed cyberdecks so this change is awesome for me

[AJCarrington]

I'm just saying, the hardware being used for the new Matrix is substantially more powerful.  Given the general parity, rating-to-rating, of technomancers and hackers, I'd expect maintaining the same would imply that technomancers have also become more powerful.  I posit that this suggests a change in the nature of their abilities.

Ahhh...understand now...good points.  I'm more hoping that we see something for deckers and technomancers along similar lines to what we do for street sams and adepts...both have very similar capabilities, but take quite different paths to get there that offer pros and cons.

[Shinobi Killfist]

Personally I never saw much of a parity between technomancers and deckers.  In 4e technomancers seem to curb stomp deckers on the hacking side of things and hackers usually have reosurces left to be a bit more competent out of the matrix.  I don't know about you but threading things like stealth way past a hackers 6 limit seems to make hacking much easier for the technomancer.

[Mirikon]

Technomancers are better at avoiding combat, yes. But when things hit the fan, a hacker is hardier, just by nature of their persona not being linked directly to their brain. Black IC is one thing, but for a TM even a normal Attack program affects their meat.

[Shinobi Killfist]

Technomancers are better at avoiding combat, yes. But when things hit the fan, a hacker is hardier, just by nature of their persona not being linked directly to their brain. Black IC is one thing, but for a TM even a normal Attack program affects their meat.

Meh a bit more risk but ridiclous more rewards.  Threading + sprites are a lot more of a benefit than the risk is a negative. And hell with deep resonance they get a bag of tricks a decker could never dream of.   

[Mirikon]

Not good to rely too much on threading. Remember, thread things over your Resonance rating, and you can start bleeding out your eyes and ears pretty quick.

[RHat]

Personally I never saw much of a parity between technomancers and deckers.  In 4e technomancers seem to curb stomp deckers on the hacking side of things and hackers usually have reosurces left to be a bit more competent out of the matrix.  I don't know about you but threading things like stealth way past a hackers 6 limit seems to make hacking much easier for the technomancer.

Note I specified rating for rating.

[Shinobi Killfist]

Personally I never saw much of a parity between technomancers and deckers.  In 4e technomancers seem to curb stomp deckers on the hacking side of things and hackers usually have reosurces left to be a bit more competent out of the matrix.  I don't know about you but threading things like stealth way past a hackers 6 limit seems to make hacking much easier for the technomancer.

Note I specified rating for rating.

I guess, but it is kind of a false equivelence in my mind.  A deckers rating is his max rating.  A technomancers rating is his rating when not really trying. 

Still the overall point people were making is sound, what is the backgorund fluff reason for why technomancers are still able to hang when things got 5 times more difficult?

[Mara]

I am liking this return. I really, really hope that they keep commlinks around for everyone, as the things where people's SIN's, licenses,
bank accounts, etc are located, and that Decks are a hackers tool, like a VCR is a Rigger's tool.

I am really liking the ideas espoused by CGL. I hope they can live up to the coolness of those ideas.

[Black]

I am liking this return. I really, really hope that they keep commlinks around for everyone, as the things where people's SIN's, licenses,
bank accounts, etc are located, and that Decks are a hackers tool, like a VCR is a Rigger's tool.

I am really liking the ideas espoused by CGL. I hope they can live up to the coolness of those ideas.

Concur Mara with all above.  Also, the rules look like Hacking, at least Combat Hacking, will get easier.  Maybe just one dice roll to take control of simple items.  And Noise sounds interesting.  Makes sense actually, the chaotic world of everything sending fricken signals all the time, meaning you got have the tools (decks) or get in close, or both.  Looks like a massive step in the right direction.  Very exciting.

[KarmaInferno]

As I posted over on Dumpshock, I would like Hackers to be able to do combat attacks like temporarily blinding opponents by quick-hacking their cybereyes or goggles, forcing their firearms to eject clips, creating an electrical strike by hacking a nearby light pole, and the like.

These would all be immediate/short duration effects and ideally be achieved with just one or two dice rolls like firearm or spell combat.

More substantial effects would require traditional network infiltration, but it would give hackers an active combat role beyond "I take a gun out and shoot."


-k

[emsquared]

As I posted over on Dumpshock, I would like Hackers to be able to do combat attacks like temporarily blinding opponents by quick-hacking their cybereyes or goggles, forcing their firearms to eject clips, creating an electrical strike by hacking a nearby light pole, and the like.

The two former "attacks" are already possible, unless that gear is skinlinked, and creating an electrical strike by hacking a light pole I don't think is within the realm of physical reality.

[UmaroVI]

Well, first, not skinlinking that gear is generally a bad idea for exactly that reason, so in practice hacking people during combat is something that only happens to people who are being dumb. Even if it didn't, SR4 combat is too fast-paced for it to be a good idea - "debuff" effects like blinding people simply aren't very helpful in a system where people go from fine to dead/unconscious in 1 pass.

[RHat]

Personally I never saw much of a parity between technomancers and deckers.  In 4e technomancers seem to curb stomp deckers on the hacking side of things and hackers usually have reosurces left to be a bit more competent out of the matrix.  I don't know about you but threading things like stealth way past a hackers 6 limit seems to make hacking much easier for the technomancer.

Note I specified rating for rating.

I guess, but it is kind of a false equivelence in my mind.  A deckers rating is his max rating.  A technomancers rating is his rating when not really trying. 

Still the overall point people were making is sound, what is the backgorund fluff reason for why technomancers are still able to hang when things got 5 times more difficult?

The point was that they're on the same numerical scale with the question being what does it mean if that remains the case, but it looks like you get that.

[CanRay]

...and creating an electrical strike by hacking a light pole I don't think is within the realm of physical reality.

Unless you've ported in Highlander, in which case the decapitated guy is something you have to worry more about for electrical damage.

Not to mention the unkillable fellow with the big ass sword.