[cptjackrabbit]

To start, this is the first time making a character in this game.  I have wanted to play SR for years, never found a game.  A group of us is finally giving it a go, so yay.  So, I have been pourng through the books and using Chummer5 for some assistance, and I want some more expert opinions on how to go about it.

I came up with a character concept, and the more I worked on it, the more I realized I was basically trying to be Michael Weston from Burn Notice.  So my question is, how would you make Micahel Weston?

I attached my incomplete chum5 file so you can get an idea.



Thanks for your time.

[gunther]

If you want to have people take a look you have to make it easier

In chummer, select "print", select "text only", copy&paste it here, delete unnecesarry stuff. People will help.

[cptjackrabbit]

If you want to have people take a look you have to make it easier

In chummer, select "print", select "text only", copy&paste it here, delete unnecesarry stuff. People will help.

Good advice.  Thank you.  And here it is.

== Info ==
Street Name: Three
Name: Unnamed Character
Movement: 4/8
Karma: 0
Street Cred: 0
Notoriety: 3
Public Awareness: 1
Human
Composure: 6
Judge Intentions: 8
Lift/Carry: 5 (30 kg/20 kg)
Memory: 6
Nuyen: 20950

== Priorities ==
Metatype: E - Human
Attributes: C - 16 Attributes
Special: B - Adept, Magician, or Technomancer
Skills: A - 46 Skills/10 Skill Groups
Resources: D - 50,000¥

== Attributes ==
BOD: 3
AGI: 2
REA: 3
STR: 2
CHA: 4
INT: 4
LOG: 4
WIL: 2
EDG: 3
MAG: 6

== Derived Attributes ==
Essence:                                6
Initiative:                                  7 + 1d6
Rigger Initiative:                     7 + 1d6
Astral Initiative:                       8 + 2d6
Matrix AR Initiative:                 7 + 1d6
Matrix Cold Initiative:              4 + DP + 3d6
Matrix Hot Initiative:                4 + DP + 4d6
Physical Damage Track:     10
Stun Damage Track:             9

== Limits ==
Physical:                  5
Mental:                     6
Social:                      6
Astral:                       6

== Active Skills ==
Animal Handling            : 1                      Pool: 5
Archery                             : 2                      Pool: 4
Armorer                            : 0                      Pool: 3
Automatics                      : 4                      Pool: 6
Automotive Mechanic    : 1 [Wheeled]   Pool: 5 (7)
Blades                              : 2                      Pool: 4
Clubs                                : 2                      Pool: 4
Computer                         : 1                      Pool: 5
Con                                   : 4                      Pool: 8
Cybercombat                   : 1                      Pool: 5
Cybertechnology             : 1                      Pool: 5
Demolitions                     : 1 [Improvised Explosives] Pool: 5 (7)
Disguise                          : 1                      Pool: 5
Diving                                : 1                      Pool: 4
Escape Artist                   : 2 [Ropes]              Pool: 4 (6)
Etiquette                           : 1                      Pool: 5
First Aid                  :           2                      Pool: 6
Forgery                              : 2                      Pool: 6
Free-Fall                  :          1                      Pool: 4
Gunnery                            : 0                      Pool: 1
Gymnastics                 :      1                      Pool: 5
Hacking                             : 0                      Pool: 3
Heavy Weapons              : 1                      Pool: 3
Impersonation                 : 1                      Pool: 5
Industrial Mechanic        : 1                      Pool: 5
Instruction                           1                     Pool: 5 (7)
Intimidation               :         1 [Interrogation]      Pool: 5 (7)
Leadership                       : 1                      Pool: 5
Longarms                         : 4                      Pool: 6
Medicine                            : 1                      Pool: 5
Navigation                         : 1                      Pool: 5
Negotiation                       : 1                      Pool: 5
Palming                             : 1                      Pool: 3
Perception                 :         2                      Pool: 6
Performance                     : 1                      Pool: 5
Pilot Aircraft                        : 2                      Pool: 5
Pilot Ground Craft             : 2 [Wheeled]            Pool: 5 (7)
Pilot Watercraft                  : 1                      Pool: 4
Pistols                                 : 4                      Pool: 7
Running                              : 2 [[Terrain]]          Pool: 6 (
Sneaking                             : 1                      Pool: 5
Software                              : 1                      Pool: 5
Survival                                : 1                      Pool: 3
Swimming                          : 2                      Pool: 4
Throwing Weapons           : 4 [Blades]             Pool: 6 (
Tracking                               : 1                      Pool: 5
Unarmed Combat             : 2                      Pool: 4

== Knowledge Skills ==

== Qualities ==
Adept
Bad Rep
Catlike
First Impression
Natural Athlete
SINner (Corporate) (25)
Strive For Perfection

== Powers ==
Adrenaline Boost Rating: 1
Combat Sense Rating: 1
Improved Ability (skill) (Pistols) Rating: 1
Improved Potential (limit) (Physical) Rating: 1
Improved Potential (limit) (Mental) Rating: 1

== Lifestyles ==
Loft 

== Weapons ==
Unarmed Attack
   Pool: 4   Accuracy: 5   DV: 2S   AP: -   RC: 1

== Vehicles ==
Hyundai Shin-Hyung (Sport Sedan)
   +Sensor Array Rating 2



Admittedly I do not think Michael is a starting lvl character.  So for starting I am puting emphasis on pistols for sake of the game.  But I would like to come relatively close.

[Top Dog]

Let's start with what you're trying to do. Taking inspiration from a character is fine (and Weston seems a nice ideal for a runner). But what's the role of the character? Do you want him to be a good combatant, or better in the social/espionage department? Bit of both?

You mention specializing in Pistols, so let's take it from there. For a combatant (any combatant really), your agility is far too low. Considering that there's not much else to take stats from though - if you want to stick to the character - I'd think about putting attributes higher on the priority list. Skills can go lower instead (more on that in a moment).

Since you're an adept, a big part of your character's strength comes from your adept powers. Improved Potential isn't very good for the cost. One point of Combat Sense is - so keep that - the rest is meh. One you need is an agility increaser (on top of the naturally higher agi you should have). Attribute Boost is generally best for that - straight Increased Physical Attribute is expensive for what you get. Your character will also need Increased Reflexes.

Qualities: You can only have 25 points in negative qualities. Also, there's a reason Corporate SIN is worth so much - it's bad bad news. Don't pick it. Limited Corporate could work, as could Criminal (that depends a lot on background). Also, since you want to have so many skills, Jack of All Trades from Run Faster (it might be called differently) is a good idea.

Speaking of skills. You have far, far too many. Generally, you want to use your skill points to buy up skills high - at least 4, preferably 6. Buying skills from points at 1 is a waste of potential. That means you're going to have to pick and choose. Many are essentially useless, a lot of others are marginally useful.
First, don't take so many combat skills.
Melee is going to be an emergency backup at best - you don't have the STR to be good at it. If you want to go there at all, stick to one and get a decent pool in it. Unarmed is good, it lets you use Shock Gloves (which don't rely on STR). With your increased AGI and say 4+ skill you're likely to actually hit things.
Ranged is much the same - you don't need all three. Yes it's nice, but it's just not affordable. Stick to one, and maybe put a point in the other ones later (see below). As for which to pick, that depends a lot on what you want to do. Generally, Pistols is weakest (low power and little options) but is best at stealth and concealment, Automatics is the most versatile (has both relatively easy to conceal options and high-power assault rifles), longarms has the most raw power but is unsubtle.
Apart from that, pick some other skills to be good at - infiltration, or social, for example. You'll also need the essentials. Everyone needs Perception, and everyone needs some social (etiquette!) and stealth.
That's skill points. If you do want to go the jack of all trades route, you don't use skill points from that. Single-level skills are best bought with Karma, either at chargen or after. That requires high attributes, though, and a high Edge wouldn't hurt there either (so you can boost the ones you need). You can't pick all, that's just not going to happen, but you can pick up quite a few things along the way. Don't expect to be good at those, but you'll be better then nothing.

Really though, to go further in detail, you're going to have to pick some core competencies and start again from there.

[Glyph]

With mediocre Attributes and low-rated skills, you have single-digit dice pools for just about anything - that isn't good, especially for combat and social skills, which are opposed dice contests with potential dice pool penalties most of the time.  You need to tighten up skills a lot, focusing on stealth and social skills with mainly pistols and unarmed on the combat side.  Don't be afraid to take 6's!  A skill of 6 is described as the character being able to sell his skills on the open market - in other words, what shadowrunners do.  If you can tighten up skills a bit more, you can switch Attributes to a higher priority - you want more points, especially for a human.

[halflingmage]

You are spread far, far too thin.  It looks like you have taken a point or two in just about everything.  This makes you fairly bad at just about. . .  everything.

Shadowrun is a game of specialists.  Decide what your character is good at, and be able to articulate that in one sentence.  Something along the lines of "fire arms expert" or "close combat specialist" or "magician focused on stealth and illusion", whatever.  Isolate your key stats/skills and make sure to really run those up.  Its ok to have some backup/assorted skills as well.  Everyone should have some perception, maybe a bit of sneak, and it doesn't hurt to have a little etiquette. 

If your main combat skill is pistols take a 6, and probably a specialization, and if you are an adept then use the apept power that lets you improve your pistol skill on  top of that.  And then maybe some Attribute Boost (agility) for when you really, really need to make the shot.  Thats your key skill, the thing you put on your business card so to speak.  You can have some support/secondary areas after that, but don't try to be good at everything or you will be good at nothing.

[drakir]

My version of Michael Weston. (Sum210)

Priorities: Metatype D (Human), Attributes B, Special B (Adept), Skills B, Resources E
Attributes:
Bod 3   Agi 6   Rea 3(5)   Str 2
Cha 5   Int 5    Log 2    Wil 3
Edge 5   Magic 6     Initiative: 10 + 3d6

Skills:
Pool  12(14)   Automatics 6(Assault Rifles)
Pool  12         Acting Group 5+Cool Resolve
Pool  9          Influence Group 2+Cool Resolve (Bought with Karma)
Pool  12          Gymnastics 4+Natural Athlete
Pool  8(10)   Intimidation(Interrogation) 1 (karma+sp)
Pool  7(9)     Locksmith(Keypad) 1 (karma+sp)
Pool  11        Perception
Pool   6(    Pilot(wheeled) (karma+sp)
Pool   13(15) Pistols 6 (Semi-Automatics)
Pool  12        Sneaking
Pool  12(14)  Unarmed Combat(    )

Contacts: Fiona (Demolitions Expert) 2/5,  Sam (Ex FBI) 4/3

Adept Powers:
Combat Sense 2, Cool Resolve 2, Improved Pistols 1, Improved Reflexes 2
Qualities: First Impression, Natural Athlete, Bad Rep, SINner Corp limited (CIA), Mild Addiction (Blueberry Youghurt)

Gear: Armor Vest, Ares Predator V, 4x Meta Link (Disposable Phones), Contacts rat 3(Smartlink, Flare compensation, Image Link), Lockpick Set

Pretty Satisfied. Missing is a Car and would have liked to give him a mentor spirit of some sort. (Probably a dog with different positives)

[ikarinokami]

You are doing what a lot of beginners do in this game which is to fall for the skills A trap. With very few exceptions -deckers/riggers, skills A is almost always terrible because of the opportunity cost. Michael Weston is not possible out of character creation with the rules as stated. if you want to make a competent combat character, these would be my suggestions

it looks like you want to be a combat adept. so attributes A
agility max
reaction soft max
body at least 3
intuition soft max.

Skills C
you only need to have three skills as a foundation
combat skill - should be maxed - use left over karma to get your specialty for 7 karma
perception (does not need to be maxed, because contacts or glasses and headphone/earbuds can add a nice boost
etiquette (doesn't need to be maxed)

they are other nice ones - con, stealth, gymnastics, running, these are nice, but for a combat guy, these are just flavor, you can add these to round out your character as you get karma.

adept powers - magic B
increase reflex at least level 2
combat sense is very nice
motion sense is always very nice

and then just fill around that.

[cptjackrabbit]

Thanks for the input.  I knew I was spreading myself thin and doomed to fail.  I simply wanted to be good at unarmed combat, armed combat, lying, sneaking, shooting, running, walking, and everything else he is, but i just need to bite the bullet and remember that I'm starting level.  I'm going to just retool it completely.

[zarzak]

they are other nice ones - con, stealth, gymnastics, running, these are nice, but for a combat guy, these are just flavor, you can add these to round out your character as you get karma.

If going unarmed you'll probably also want to max gymnastics (it comes into play with a few tests here and there)

[ZeldaBravo]

I simply wanted to be good at unarmed combat, armed combat, lying, sneaking, shooting, running, walking

That is quite possible to do if you set you will go with high attributes.

[Glyph]

Shadowrun characters really aren't starting level.  They have typically been doing what they are doing for a while.  However, they don't start out good at everything, which is why things like ex-special forces or burned super-spies don't work that well as starting characters.  For a concept, you need to pare it down to what the essentials are.  If you take Attributes at A (highly recommended, especially for humans who don't get metatype bonuses, and especially for characters you want decent physical and mental Attributes for), and Magic (adept) B, that leaves C for skills.  Can you do it?  I would say yes, if you focus on what you really want.

Say, pistols: 6 with a specialization in semi-automatics (this would be the main weapon a covert operator would use); unarmed combat: 6, sneaking: 6, con: 6, and perception: 3.  For the bonus skill for adept B, take locksmith: 4.  For your skill group, take the Influence skill group at 2.  Starting karma can be spent on some lower level (rating: 1 or 2) skills such as pilot ground craft.  So you have the basics of what you want - someone who is good with a gun or his fists, and also good at fast-talking, sneaking, and getting past locks.  Sure, he also has glaring omissions - no jumping or climbing ability, no picking up a crowbar or an assault rifle and being that good at it, etc.  But the core of the concept, I think, is there.

[halflingmage]

Glyph's build is certainly viable.  As an alternative, you could consider Attributes A Skills B Magic C Meta D Resources E.

You would use two of your human special attribute points to increase Magic to 6, and you would have an edge of 3 instead of 5.  That is not a trivial thing, Edge is really, really useful.  But you would start with a broader skill set.  Skills would be Pistol 6 (spec)8 Sneaking 6 Con 6 Perception 4 Locksmith 4 Unarmed 6 Influence Group 2 and Athletics Group 3 and you still have 5 active skill points for odds and ends.

You are going to be somewhat multiple attribute dependent.  Agility is your most importance attribute.  Charisma is 2nd.  The problem with unarmed is that you need a high strength to make it worth your while to punch someone.  Consider shock gloves to go with your unarmed skill.  I would go with the following

Body 5 Agility 6( 8 ) Reaction 3(5) Str 3 Charisma 5 Intuition 3 Logic 2 Willpower 5. 
Adept powers Improve Agility 2 Improve Reflexes 2 Improve Pistols 2 Improve Sneak 1.

With your pistol specialty you are throwing 18 dice, 19 with a laser sight.  You have 15 to sneak 12 for locksmith and 11 dice for Con and Gymnastics.  Initiative is 8+3d6.  Be sure to take the Agile Defender quality from Run and Gun.  Its only three karma and it lets you use your Agility instead of willpower on defense tests, so at full defense you have 16 dice.   You are still reasonably broad (pistols, sneaky, breaking and entering) but you are bringing some professional level heat in your main skills. 

Edit- Another though, consider automatics instead of pistol.  Its the broadest firearms skill, you have machine pistol for concealed carry, smgs for more firepower that will still fit under an overcoat, and assault rifles for when its time to abandon subtle action and just hose down the room with a kilo of armor piercing rounds.  The possible reason to keep pistols would be that is covers light pistols and holdouts, which are easier to smuggle past security, as well as tasers, which have the advantage of being entirely street legal without a license.  And heavy pistols still do reasonable damage (An ares predator with APDS ammon (and apds ammo is your friend) is 8p -5 ap.  A Super Warhawk revolver with the same ammo is 9p -6ap.  Another thing, and some may smirk at this, is that pistols burn through less ammo.  The APDS that everyone loves is 12 freaking nuyen per bullet.  Emptying an Ares Alpha clip costs you 504 nuyen.  That can eat up your profits very quickly.    . 

[cptjackrabbit]

Glyph's build is certainly viable.  As an alternative, you could consider Attributes A Skills B Magic C Meta D Resources E.

You would use two of your human special attribute points to increase Magic to 6, and you would have an edge of 3 instead of 5.  That is not a trivial thing, Edge is really, really useful.  But you would start with a broader skill set.  Skills would be Pistol 6 (spec)8 Sneaking 6 Con 6 Perception 4 Locksmith 4 Unarmed 6 Influence Group 2 and Athletics Group 3 and you still have 5 active skill points for odds and ends.

You are going to be somewhat multiple attribute dependent.  Agility is your most importance attribute.  Charisma is 2nd.  The problem with unarmed is that you need a high strength to make it worth your while to punch someone.  Consider shock gloves to go with your unarmed skill.  I would go with the following

Body 5 Agility 6( 8 ) Reaction 3(5) Str 3 Charisma 5 Intuition 3 Logic 2 Willpower 5. 
Adept powers Improve Agility 2 Improve Reflexes 2 Improve Pistols 2 Improve Sneak 1.

With your pistol specialty you are throwing 18 dice, 19 with a laser sight.  You have 15 to sneak 12 for locksmith and 11 dice for Con and Gymnastics.  Initiative is 8+3d6.  Be sure to take the Agile Defender quality from Run and Gun.  Its only three karma and it lets you use your Agility instead of willpower on defense tests, so at full defense you have 16 dice.   You are still reasonably broad (pistols, sneaky, breaking and entering) but you are bringing some professional level heat in your main skills. 

Edit- Another though, consider automatics instead of pistol.  Its the broadest firearms skill, you have machine pistol for concealed carry, smgs for more firepower that will still fit under an overcoat, and assault rifles for when its time to abandon subtle action and just hose down the room with a kilo of armor piercing rounds.  The possible reason to keep pistols would be that is covers light pistols and holdouts, which are easier to smuggle past security, as well as tasers, which have the advantage of being entirely street legal without a license.  And heavy pistols still do reasonable damage (An ares predator with APDS ammon (and apds ammo is your friend) is 8p -5 ap.  A Super Warhawk revolver with the same ammo is 9p -6ap.  Another thing, and some may smirk at this, is that pistols burn through less ammo.  The APDS that everyone loves is 12 freaking nuyen per bullet.  Emptying an Ares Alpha clip costs you 504 nuyen.  That can eat up your profits very quickly.    .

Wow.  This is like, absolutely what I was looking for.  I was reading through everyone's taking notes, and appreciate it a lot.  This is a nice breakdown so that newbs like me arent as confused. 

Thank You everyone!

[Whiskeyjack]

Don't sink points into Improved Phys Attribute AGI. It's totally overcosted. Take Wolf as a Mentor Spirit - you now have AGI Boost 2 for free. Use it at the start of combat and whenever you need that extra AGI. The Drain is easy to soak. Spend that leftover PP on Combat Sense and Motion Sense. It's a much better investment.